Pope says he's saddened by 'perfect' Catholics who despise others

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PJH_74 said:
Hmmm… Maybe at least partially addresses to some members of this forum? 😉
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This is what I thought too, thinking maybe he reads posts here! (Just a thought)

But then I had this idea that maybe what you think is an example of what the pope said is not the same of what I think is an example of what the pope said. Do you know what I mean? I think perhaps people’s perceptions can differ, at least I am wondering about it. I’m wondering if we could site things others here have said that would fit the pope’s description- would we all be in agreement, even if we are in agreement that some members of the forum seem to need to heed the popes advice here?

I hope that made sense. What I mean to say is, maybe all of us would agree with the pope but if we all cited examples of this (what the pope said) we would then find ourselves in disagreement, because of personal beliefs differing slightly. There are various “extremes”…and this reality, I believe, has always led to the hot debates/fights within the church.
 
I am particularly saddened by perfect pontiffs, persecuting, practically, all penitential Catholic persons, who are ponderously protecting people, from pouncing into perdition.

Painstakingly Praying for an end to possible Papal progressive perfidy, against a particular portion of the Catholic population.
 
esieffe said:
I am particularly saddened by perfect pontiffs, persecuting, practically, all penitential Catholic persons, who are ponderously protecting people, from pouncing into perdition.

Painstakingly Praying for an end to possible Papal progressive perfidy, against a particular portion of the Catholic population.
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Partially perfect!
 
esieffe said:
I am particularly saddened by perfect pontiffs, persecuting, practically, all penitential Catholic persons, who are ponderously protecting people, from pouncing into perdition.
.
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That is quite the alliteration of “p”. Dare anyone to say that 10 times fast. 😃
 
I’m reminded of a little old lady I knew once many years ago. She was, dare I say, just like all of us; she had some wonderful virtues, a few vices, and she wasn’t afraid to speak her mind.

However, she always prefaced her statements with something like, “You know, I’m just a miserable sinner myself” before she complained about one of her friends who was being all about ‘rules’, or about people only looking at ‘their side’ of an argument. Thus she placed herself on the moral high ground by claiming a ‘lower’ place. It was a kind of false humility, an "I’m a terrible offender myself and therefore when I make a statement about others, you will be more inclined to see my point of view because I have consciously put myself ‘up for judgment’, and you’ll be more receptive to my words because I appear to be open and tolerant of others’.

It worked for quite a long time, until people started seeing the pattern and started just listening to what she was actually saying without that ‘but look how open and tolerant she is’ vibe coloring their perceptions. In fact, all things considered, she wound up, in time, losing ground. The many early arguments that she ‘won’ were more than offset in later years because people knew that she had played games earlier and they were on their guard. Kind of like the ‘boy who cried wolf’.

Now mind you, she was a very interesting and companionable and often charming woman. She just had found a ‘trick’ which she used, with the best of intentions, to ‘get her own way’ in things. I think we all have done things like that at times, right? I often wonder how she would have done had she lived into the Internet age. She would probably have loved it. . .
 
Generally speaking, the pope is exposed to a lot more people, cultures and countries than we are. He could be seeing more extremes and amounts of ‘perfect’ Catholics in different parts of the world than we’re exposed to in our area. The reprocussions of the ‘perfect’ Catholics’ actions toward another person may be more far-reaching and may have more devastating effects socioeconomically and spirituality in another area of the world, i.e., causing isolation, ostracism, people can’t make a living, etc.
 
friardchips said:
He is guided by the Holy Spirit. So no, not just my opinion.
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on definitive statements of faith and morals, or when teaching in communion with the college of bishops.

The pope does sin and does make mistakes.
 
macstar said:
Generally speaking, the pope is exposed to a lot more people, cultures and countries than we are. He could be seeing more extremes and amounts of ‘perfect’ Catholics in different parts of the world than we’re exposed to in our area. The reprocussions of the ‘perfect’ Catholics’ actions toward another person may be more far-reaching and may have more devastating effects socioeconomically and spirituality in another area of the world, i.e., causing isolation, ostracism, people can’t make a living, etc.
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this.

I do think the pope needs a bit more context with his statements, as some people, in some countries might be the targets of his comments, while others may not be.
 
People just need to see themselves in his words, and mend their ways.

Notice how defensive people get?
They recognize what they are guilty of and lash out.

It’s like the little kids who always say “hey, it’s not my fault!!!”

:rolleyes:

Pope Francis is a good Pope. People are happy to remain goats. :coffeeread:
 
friardchips said:
There is nothing wrong with the Pope’s words.
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👍
I am 100% in agreement with him.
I pray daily for God to keep me from falling into the trap of feeling like I’m “better than” anybody. It’s an easy trap to fall into.

One of the only good things about having done some wrong things over a period of time is the humility it brings when you think back on your own missteps.

As for who the Pope might have been referring to, I’d say, if the shoe fits, wear it.
 
shockerfan said:
on definitive statements of faith and morals, or when teaching in communion with the college of bishops.

The pope does sin and does make mistakes.
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No, the Pope is always guided by the Holy Spirit. Vatican I did not limit the Pope’s authority.

"*For the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.

Indeed, their apostolic teaching was embraced by all the venerable fathers and reverenced and followed by all the holy orthodox doctors, for they knew very well that this See of St. Peter always remains unblemished by any error, in accordance with the divine promise of our Lord and Savior to the prince of his disciples: I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail; and when you have turned again, strengthen your brethren.*"

ewtn.com/library/councils/V1.htm

And you reversed the order - the bishops have authority when they are in communion with the Pope, not the other away around.

“Although the individual bishops do not enjoy the prerogative of infallibility, they nevertheless proclaim Christ’s doctrine infallibly whenever, even though dispersed through the world, but still maintaining the bond of communion among themselves and with the successor of Peter, and authentically teaching matters of faith and morals, they are in agreement on one position as definitively to be held.”

The Pope is supreme and infallible. Catholics need to hold their tongue and obey him.
 
PluniaZ said:
No, the Pope is always guided by the Holy Spirit. Vatican I did not limit the Pope’s authority.

"*For the Holy Spirit was promised to the successors of Peter not so that they might, by his revelation, make known some new doctrine, but that, by his assistance, they might religiously guard and faithfully expound the revelation or deposit of faith transmitted by the apostles.

Indeed, their apostolic teaching was embraced by all the venerable fathers and reverenced and followed by all the holy orthodox doctors, for they knew very well that this See of St. Peter always remains unblemished by any error*, in accordance with the divine promise of our Lord and Savior to the prince of his disciples: I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail; and when you have turned again, strengthen your brethren."

ewtn.com/library/councils/V1.htm

And you reversed the order - the bishops have authority when they are in communion with the Pope, not the other away around.

“Although the individual bishops do not enjoy the prerogative of infallibility, they nevertheless proclaim Christ’s doctrine infallibly whenever, even though dispersed through the world, but still maintaining the bond of communion among themselves and with the successor of Peter, and authentically teaching matters of faith and morals, they are in agreement on one position as definitively to be held.”

The Pope is supreme and infallible. Catholics need to hold their tongue and obey him.
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So St. Peter was guided by the Spirit when he acted in hypocrisy? So the pope at the time of St. Catherine of Siena was guided by the Spirit when he wanted to move the papacy from Rome to Avignon?
 
James248 said:
So St. Peter was guided by the Spirit when he acted in hypocrisy? So the pope at the time of St. Catherine of Siena was guided by the Spirit when he wanted to move the papacy from Rome to Avignon?
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Thank you for saying this.
 
PluniaZ said:
And all the sheep correct their shepherd …

:ouch:
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I remember the words of Venerable Fulton J. Sheen on this subject;

“Who is going to save our Church? Not our bishops, not our priests and religious. It is up to you, the people. You have the minds, the eyes, the ears to save the Church. Your mission is to see that your priests act like priests, your bishops, like bishops, and your religious act like religious.”
 
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