Pope's Latinist pronounces death of a language

[Spirithound]

The native speakers of CL to which I refer are not in a centralized location, although a large percentage seem to live in Finland. These speakers have not preserved the language, but have revived it. It started with “Latinists” who had learned the language through study and went on to form “Latin Clubs” where they could interact with others who shared their passion for the language. As these people came from all over the world to participate in the meetings, often the only language that they had in common with others was Latin. Many marriages resulted from these get togethers, and again, as Latin was the only common language, it was the one used in the home. Therefore, the children of these couples grew up speaking Latin and could be considered native speakers.

Interesting concept. As a Master Linguist, how do you rate the chances of CL surviving beyond 2 generations? Considering that their numbers are not large or centralized, I would say not very good.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

From a linguistic point of view, Latin is alive and well. Due to the nature of linguistic evolution, Latin evolved into Spanish, Catalan, French, Romanch, Rumanian, Italian, Portuguese, and countless dialects therein, very very gradually, on a continuum. Therefore, any native speaker of Latin, or evolution thereof, which i will call L1, L2, L3, and so on, would be able to understand anybody 200-300 years before or after him. It is therefore incorrect to say that Latin died, because there is a continuous chain of mutually intelligible speakers.
Labelling a language based on the area where it is spoken is at best a convenient convention, and does not mean in any way that those languages listed above are not in actuality L426.
To further illustrate my point, Gothic is a dead language. The tribe was wiped out, and the language went with them.

Now, that being said, I’ve heard that St. Isidore of Seville was the last speaker of Latin.

And really, the title of this thread is incorrect. Since there are still some priests who know Latin, it cannot even be considered dead. At most, somebody should give it last rites…

About Gothic: not quite - Grammar of the Gothic Language (1910)​

 

[chevalier]

Therefore, the children of these couples grew up speaking Latin and could be considered native speakers.

Thanks for the idea.

As a side question, has anyone ever been to a mass with readings in Latin instead of vernacular? How about homily?

 

[Ham1]

Latin is dead and that is precisely why it is such a perfect language for the Church. By dead, I mean it is no longer used as a primary means of day to day communication which means it DOESN’T CHANGE. This is what dead means here, it means it doesn’t change over time and usage. Imagine if latin changed like all the other languages? Chances are we would look back and read documents from the Council of Trent and their meaning would have changed! This would be terrible. Latin is perfect because the words mean precisely the same now as they did then. Latin is perfect because it is dead.

 

[chevalier]

Whatever is understood as Latin is in reality the shape and condition of the language in a specific period of time. There’s no such thing as just Latin. Archaic, classical, late-Roman… This is for example why there’s so much fuss about 10000 different ways of pronouncing it.

 

[KathleenElsie]

Went to a Mass this morning for a RICA that was Confirmed and her First Communion her family was against her becoming Catholic. So the grapevine let us know to go to support her. It was wonderful.

But the reason I posted here is that three of the prayers today were in Latin and this reminded me that Latin is not dead just on life support and forgotten by many. We the members of the Holy Catholic Church need to keep it alive. It is a part of our tradition and past, lets make it a part of our future also.

 

[KathleenElsie]

The author of a recent book on classical education put it nicely indeed: in surveying Latin’s vigorous post-Empire career up to the present, he said than rather than “dying,” Latin long ago simply “ceased to be mortal.”

Sic semper!

Part of our home school curriculim is Latin. I will let my kids know that Latin ceased to be mortal.

 

[Le_Cracquere]

Part of our home school curriculim is Latin. I will let my kids know that Latin ceased to be mortal.

Excellent! Also, I finally remembered the name & title: it’s Climbing Parnassus by Tracy Lee Simmons. A great read.