Population Bottleneck

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rossum said:
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Techno2000:
But, it took 30 Million years for evolution to produce the Whale.
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What is your starting point? Basilosaurus lived 35 million years ago and was a whale.

rossum
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Even if evolution only took hundreds of years, that would still be too long to make an animal or plant fit for a new environment. It has to be fit right from the start .
 
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rossum said:
Adaptation is evolution. I showed that an evolutionary change does not have to take “million of years”. Evolution can work a lot faster than that.
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Adaptation is micro-evolution which no one argues.
 
I know, but they succeeded in having kids. So after a shave and a haircut, they probably looked pretty average.

And what about the Basque people?

www.sciencedaily.com

Basque roots revealed through DNA analysis

The Genographic Project has announced the most comprehensive analysis to date of Basque genetic patterns, showing that Basque genetic uniqueness predates the arrival of agriculture in the Iberian Peninsula some 7,000 years ago. Through detailed DNA analysis of samples from the French and Spanish...
www.sciencedaily.com
 
Based on a previous thread with over 5K views, I don’t think a straight answer is coming.
 
Techno2000 said:
Even if evolution only took hundreds of years, that would still be too long to make an animal or plant fit for a new environment. It has to be fit right from the start .
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No. It only has to change as fast, or faster, than the environment. If the change is sudden, such as a meteorite strike or a volcanic eruption then a lot of animals will die because they cannot evolve that fast. If the change is slower, like a gradual desertification spread over thousands of years then there will be time to adapt.

Not all environmental changes are sudden.

rossum
 
rossum said:
If the change is slower, like a gradual desertification spread over thousands of years then there will be time to adapt.
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The cactus would have to know the future and be one step ahead of the coming dry environment.And how does the cactus know the environment it going to stay dry?
 
‘Today is not your day. Tomorrow’s not looking good either.’

The cactus doesn’t know anything.
 
edwest said:
‘Today is not your day. Tomorrow’s not looking good either.’

The cactus doesn’t know anything.
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And everything thing that cactus is connected to doesn’t know anything either,yet they can all morph into creatures that need very little water and withstand extreme heat .Isn’t all this just a little bit too perfect? 🤔
 
It will obviously require highly coordinated modifications all around. But I suspect no answer will be forthcoming that can address what is not one problem but many. Like you’ve been writing, everything has to be just right for the entire ecosystem to function before and after the current end result involving deserts that appear one day, and cactuses and other things can’t move in until they are ‘modified’ in some way to handle the new environment.

It sounds possible on paper but not so much in real life.
 
Hope1960 said:
How could we interbreed if they weren’t human, or, more importantly, do humans have parts of non human blood coursing through our veins?
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The Neanderthals became extinct 40,000 years ago. The homo sapiens that could have interbred with them must be the early homo sapiens who lived before the Neanderthals became extinct. These homo sapiens were not the children of Adam, because in my opinion the first true humans (the descendants of Adam and Eve) only lived after the Neanderthals became extinct. I don’t think there were true humans before that. There were homo sapiens, yes, but not true humans.

Do humans have parts of non-human blood coursing through our veins ? I think you are asking whether we could have DNA similar to what the non-human bodies have, right? The answer is yes. Did we inherit their DNA? For a person who believed that the human body evolved from a hominin, then maybe yes. But for me, since I do not believe in the evolution of the human body, my answer is not necessarily, because I believe that our bodies were especially made by God. God is the Author of the unique genetic code in each organism, and nothing could prevent Him from writing codes similar to what He used for the non-humans.
edwest said:
Some humans alive today have Neanderthal DNA.
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It doesn’t prove that the Neanderthals were human, or that we evolved from them. I reserve the word “human” to the descendants of Adam and Eve, or to hominins that have a rational soul. Is there proof that the Neanderthals were human? Did they show any sign of intelligence higher than animal intelligence?
 
“rational soul” is not a scientific term. Souls don’t exist in the world of science. I think those that study the past about humanoid creatures have made some mistakes. Neanderthals being one of them.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-02357-8

If Neanderthals could interbreed with humans then that is enough compatibility for me. One definition for a different species is that they cannot interbreed. So Neanderthals were not a different species. Much of the past is hidden and unknown. Finding Neanderthal DNA in people alive today is all the proof I need.
 
edwest said:
“rational soul” is not a scientific term. Souls don’t exist in the world of science.
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OK, I will grant that. But did the Neanderthals show any sign that their intelligence is higher than those of brute animals?
edwest said:
If Neanderthals could interbreed with humans then that is enough compatibility for me.
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Yes, their bodies are compatible with humans. But it is not just the body that makes a hominin human. What makes humans distinctively human is their intelligence. So, I don’t measure the “human-ness” of a hominin merely by its genetic compatibility or anatomical homology with a modern human. I measure it by its intelligence. What I am looking for is a sign that the Neanderthals have an intelligence better than those of brute animal.

You gave me a link showing paintings by Neanderthals. Those are not enough, because brute animals can do the same – and better. Look: http://mentalfloss.com/article/27307/6-professional-painters-animal-kingdom
 
And watch this 8-minute video of an elephant painting an elephant.

Were the Neanderthals better?
 
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