Possibly Leaving the Church. Help Would Be Much Appreciated

[Roseeurekacross]

Dear Lord, I pray for a strong gift of faith for Cadbury, if it be your Will.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Have you read Frank Sheed “Theology and Sanity”?

 

[PJM]

In the limited space allowed, permit me to number your comments for reference purposes. And a single question

[1] The entire issue depends on a single word: “TUTH” and on a single question:
Are YOU actually [graced] able to accept what that Truth is?

As an absolute fact:

There can be only One True God

That God can and does have just One TRUE set of Faith beliefs

That same God choose just one Chosen People [Exo 6:7] which Jesus modeled and accepted: ‘My Church” [singular]**

** Because ALL churches are identified b their own selected set of Faith beliefs and there are literally thousands of differing sets of Protestant [to protest] faith sets and churches. Giving irrefutable evidence that NONE of them holds GODS One True Faith.
On the other hand you have the RCC which historically & biblically dates back to Jesus & the 12 Apostles; holding on to its ONE set of faith beliefs for 2,000 years.

My friend the RCC is Organic and pragmatic. …It teaches absolutes that are Holy Spirit inspired and JESUS approved [John 17:17-20]; which NO other faith, religion or church can claim with evidence to support it. ALL of God’s truths were not revealed at the time of His Visitation of 3 years. Such would have been incomprehensible at that time, hence as the Holy Spirit has inspired deeper and fuller understandings; they have been proclaimed in the absolute God entrusted Powers of the Key’s Mt 16:18-19
Pope Benedict says: “If we omit the truth, what do we do anything for?”

“Their cannot be your truth and my truth or there would be no truth”; which is bluntly factual and logically irrefutable.

Fr. HARDON, taught this about TRUTH:

“Truth is the condition of grace, it is the source of grace, it is the channel of grace, it is the divinely ordained requirement of grace.”.Which explains WHY there are so many Protestant faiths and churches: They LACK the TRUTH.

Ps.145: 17 - 18
The LORD is just in all his ways, and kind in all his doings. The LORD is near to all who call upon him, to all who call upon him in truth.

[2] the practice of all religions call in varying degrees for Faith: Benedict says:

“Their cannot be your truth and my truth or there would be no truth

The practice of any religion is often termed “FAITH” : Heb.1: 1 “Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen”

This is no accident. It is a part of God’s Plan for us that not everything is to be logically deduced or known in this life time. Isaiah 55: 6-8 "Seek the LORD while [AND WHERE] he may be found, call upon him while he is near; let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; let him return to the LORD, For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, says the LORD.

Know that I and others on this FORUM CAN address your concerns. IT IS BEST TO DO SO ONE ISSUE AT A TIME AS SPACE IS RESTRICTED.

Start each Rosary with a heart-felt: BEGONE SATAN I BELONG TO JESUS MARY AND JOSEPH…the keep praying the rosary daily.

. [3] Please ask the question on Infallibility separately and space does not permit that discussion now.

Pray MUCH
Patrick

 

[itsjustdave1988]

Cadbery,

I’m a fallen-away Catholic who returned to the Church decades later, after I worked through some very similar doctrinal doubts. My recommendation is to not try to tackle everything all at once, but start by working through some foundational issues. For example, I started by asking what rule of faith did the most ancient Christians use to distinguish error from true Christian doctrine. I did a lot of research on this and found that the earliest Christians used what would later be described as the Rule of St. Vincent de Lerins.

According to St. Vincent de Lerins (d. c. 450)
Source: Commonitory for the Antiquity and Universality of the Catholic Faith
…quote…
… in the Catholic Church itself, all possible care must be taken, that we hold that faith which has been believed everywhere, always, by all. For that is truly and in the strictest sense “Catholic,” which, as the name itself and the reason of the thing declare, comprehends all universally. This rule we shall observe if we follow universality, antiquity, consent. We shall follow universality if we confess that one faith to be true, which the whole Church throughout the world confesses [note: as opposed to that which is merely regional]; antiquity, if we in no wise depart from those interpretations which it is manifest were notoriously held by our holy ancestors and fathers [note: as opposed to something novel]; consent, in like manner, if in antiquity itself we adhere to the consentient definitions and determinations of all, or at the least of almost all priests and doctors.
…endquote…

Does this sound like a reasonable rule for distinguishing error from true Christian doctrine?

God bless,

Dave

 

[PJM]

thanks VERY WELL DONE

God Bless you
Partick

 

[Casilda]

Suggest you go to Mass on a Sunday and listen very attentively to the Creed. That common statement of faith that all say after the homily and before the Offertory Rite. It was once explained to me that that is what we must believe. It is a simple statement of belief. One thing to notice about it for instance is the complete statement of Catholic belief concerning the Virgin Mary. The only reference is “born of the Virgin Mary and became man.” Yes, there are other things we believe, but in a sense they are secondary. They are devotions, aspects of the Mother of God that we believe. No one, protestant or Catholic is going to be denied heaven because he/she had trouble believing the Immaculate Conception. It is a wonderful belief, but not necessary for salvation. Listen with your heart to the creed. If you have no problem accepting it, welcome home.

The Eastern Orthodox and many Protestants also recite the creed. Its what all believers in Christ have in common (with Catholics).

 

[mattp0625]

Most of these truths can be demonstrated through scripture, even the communion of saints and relics

They become even more clear through apostolic tradition

I would refrain from basing your decision on the people. That leads to error. Our truth transcends people

Let me know if I can help

 

[JoeVig]

What do you feel in your heart? These promptings you get that bring you anxiety, doubt, depression: that is the vomit of Satan. The Holy Spirit would NEVER have you feeling that way.
In the end, you do what makes you feel cliser to God. The biggest benefit of our Church is the Sacrements. The grace makes it easier for you to fight the enemy and obtain peace.
Much Love and prayer for you.

 

[po18guy]

Exactly! Spend time with the Lord, asking Him for clarity. Then, be as patient with Him as He has been with you. When you receive your answer, you will be changed.

 

[almost2]

Educational is fine but as saint Paul said 1 cor 2. I came not to educate you but in demonstrated holy spirit . so you faith did not rest on man’s wisdom.

Get a book on the believers authority.

Get answers . 1 john 2-27. You have an anointing of the holy spirit
Get to know this teacher

 

[MonteRCMS]

First question is: Who was [is] Jesus?

My question to Protestants is this: what were the Christian beliefs before the Protestant changes?

 

[almost2]

I suggest start a new thread

 

[almost2]

I would suggest to start a new thread

 

[Reesey]

After much contemplation, I do not see the basis for this extreme level of authority given to fallible men.

I’m not sure what you mean by “extreme level of authority”, but I think the real question is: “If Jesus, Who is God Incarnate, really founded a Church to teach all nations throughout the generations in His Name, would He make sure that Church is INCAPABLE of error (ie, infallible) in Her teachings - or would He allow Her to teach error”?

God is perfectly capable of teaching infallibly through fallible men - or we couldn’t even know with any infallible certainty which books God inspired, and how many were inspired. IOW, we wouldn’t even have an infallible defined Biblical Canon. All we would have is a fallible collection of books - some of which might be inspired, some inspired books may have been left out erroneously, and some non-inspired books added in error.

So since He is capable of teaching infallibly through fallible men - why would He NOT do this for us? Why would He instead allow His Church to add a little bit of arsenic (error) in His childrens’ orange Juice - error that, like arsenic, can be deadly? I personally believe that Jesus’ Church is infallible in Her teachings because the Holy Spirit guards both the Revelation given, received, and interpreted, from man-made corruptions and errors.

A second point that is important is to recognize the varying degrees of certainty in our doctrines (teachings). Those that have the highest degree of certainty are our de fide dogmas - like the Divinity of Christ, and the Immaculate Conception. But not ALL our doctrines carry this high degree of certainty (ie, are infallibly defined). Some of the things you mentioned aren’t infallibly defined (de fide dogmas) at all - like, relics, and asking saints for their prayers. They are more like practices than doctrines. You might want to check out Ludwig Ott’s “Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma” so you know what IS de fide dogma and what is not. This website can help you understand the varying degrees of certainty in our doctrines:

Theological Grades of Certainty

L_D posted an answer to my earlier question about differences in level of doctrine, but could L_D or someone post some examples so that I have a reference point to go off of? Heres a summary of what L_D posted 1- fides divina, fides catholica 2- fides ecclesiastica 3- sententia fidei proxima 4- s...

www.phatmass.com

To sum up, I think before you do anything, you need to ask yourself if Jesus would have founded a Church that would teach some error along with some truth, AND you need to understand the difference between infallibly defined de fide dogmas, teachings with lower levels of theological certainty, and pious practices/devotions.

This really helped me when I was struggling with reverting back to the Catholic Church. I hope it can help you.

 

[PJM]

Very well done and GREAT advice,

Thanks and continued Blessings

Patrick

 

[Reesey]

These doubts, rather, are in respect and in great fear for what is true. As I try to pray the rosary, I cannot keep away the whispering, and sometimes yelling voice, telling me that what I am engaging is wrong and even possibly hell-binding, as some I know would tell me. It’s very scary and depressing.

Getting back to my original question - did Jesus found a Church that is capable of teaching error in His Name or a Church through which His Holy Spirit guards and protects its teachings from man-made error? If His Church can teach error, in fact, if NO Church is infallible in its teachings - then:

1. How can anyone say with any absolute certainty that praying the rosary is “wrong” and “ even possibly hell-binding”? Are THEY infallible?
2. Will He UNJUSTLY hold us accountable if we hold to erroneous teachings, when He has given us no means by which we can know, infallibly, what is truth and what is error?

Before I came back to the Catholic Church I had to overcome many such doubts that my Protestant friends introduced regarding Catholic teachings and practices. But even while my Protestant friends insisted that “ NO Church is infallible in its teachings” (including theirs), they often spoke and acted as though they were infallibly certain that they were right and the Catholic Church was in error. Once I realized the logical inconsistency between their denial that their Church was infallible and their virtually “infallible” declaration that the Catholic Church was wrong, many of those doubts fell away.

Nor do I believe that Jesus left us orphans who must accept that no Church can teach infallibly. I believe that Jesus gave us an Instrument through which we can have the full truth - and nothing but the truth, with no error mixed in, of His Divine Revelation. And that Instrument is His Church, the “pillar and bulwark of truth” (1 Tim. 3:15). Which I believe to be the Catholic Church.

Hope this helps!

 

[TheLittleLady]

We need to be careful speaking of “feelings”. Feelings, spiritually known as “consolations”, are nice but they are not required and are not indicative of truth. Feelings are emotional responses and our emotions can cloud our rational judgments.

Scripture says to “trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not to your own understanding”.

Great Saints have given us examples of persisting in faith even when the consolations are rare or completely absent from their life.

 

[OsculeturMeOsculo]

The Church gets its authority because Jesus said to Peter that he will build his Church on this rock (Peter) and the gates of hell will not triumph. The Catholic Church can be traced from this present day to the early christian communities started by the apostles and Jesus. Protestants started to form in 1600 after Luther and some others were trying to undermine church authority. Reading some of the doctors of the Church or the early church fathers might helps you gain a clearer understanding on these things. I think some of St. Louis de Monforts works like Secret of the Rosary might help you understand why venerating Mary is good and even essential to salvation in a certain way. The church has been consistent with its teachings while the Sola Scriptura method has cause thousands of denominations to exist. There are Lutherans, Baptists and Episcopal that have different views yet claim to use the bible as their sole authority.(No offense) It kinda of ironic when protestants write books because the bible should be sufficient enough without help from an outside source. Maybe you can listen to Immaculate Heart radio or Relevant Radio it might help you get some answers.

 

[MonteRCMS]

Give your life to GOD.

Make HIM the focus of your day.

Not necessary to become a priest or deacon, but:

Go to Daily Mass;

Daily Holy Communion;

Monthly Confession;

Daily Rosary;

Daily prayers morning, noon, and night.

Search for a parish that has Perpetual Eucharistic Adoration and make visits to Jesus in the Monstrance.

Read Catholic authors such as Scott Hahn and Bishop Fulton J. Sheen. These people are excellent! [Check with Catholic Answers bookstore … and some of the reading is free and can be downloaded.]

https://shop.catholic.com

Check your parish bulletin for courses and classes offered on church history, and other aspects of Catholic practices … not every parish has them but they are everywhere in every diocese.

Make yourself available to volunteer to help at parish activities.

AND, then, you may just meet someone … and see if a connection develops.

But PUT IT IN GOD’S HANDS.

“Lord, I am on your payroll.”

“Make me the way you want me to be.”

 

[MonteRCMS]

Daniel Chapter 10.

An on-going struggle.

Satanic influences that need to be fought.

Daniel 10 Commentary - Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible

Read Daniel 10 commentary using Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible. Study the bible online using commentary on Daniel 10 and more!...

www.biblestudytools.com

Huge fallen angels that fight goodness and lure people away from Jesus.

Holy Michael, the Archangel, defend us in battle. Be our safeguard against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray; and do you, O Prince of the heavenly host, by the power of God cast into hell Satan and all the evil spirits who wander through the world seeking the ruin of souls.
Amen.