Prayer Restrictions Imposed On Me When Trying To Go Back To The Mormon Church

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Hey everyone. A couple of years ago, when I was having doubts about Catholicism, I went to the “bishop” of the local Mormon church and asked him if I could be re-baptized (I had my name withdrawn from the Mormon church’s records and doing that effectively “undoes” your “baptism” and “confirmation” in the Mormon church. Anyway, while I was there, he asked me to lead him and I in prayer. So I did. I started out saying an ordinary prayer in modern English and used the word “Lord” instead of “Heavenly Father” (Mormons do not pray to any member of their “godhead” except for the “Heavenly Father”. Well, he “corrected” me and told me that out of respect for the Lord, we are to refer to the Lord in the “language of the Bible” and use “thees” and “thous” etc. Also, he instructed me only to to refer to the Lord as “Heavenly Father”. So I started over and continued like that. He continued to criticize my prayer. I don’t remember what else he said but he did criticize it. Also, he told me that I was not allowed to lead any sort of public prayer until I was initiated back into the Mormon church. Basically I was not allowed to lead a prayer in their classes or anything even if I was asked to do so. I thought this to be rather strange. And then he imposed yet another restriction on prayer. He said that when I pray at home, I should always kneel when I pray. Well, I told him that I can’t do that due to knee problems and he told me that I would just have to endure the pain.

But anyway, I thought that all of this was very weird and it was one reason why I chose not to be re-initiated and now I am back home with the Catholic Church. 👍
 
Holly3278 said:
Hey everyone. A couple of years ago, when I was having doubts about Catholicism, I went to the “bishop” of the local Mormon church and asked him if I could be re-baptized (I had my name withdrawn from the Mormon church’s records and doing that effectively “undoes” your “baptism” and “confirmation” in the Mormon church. Anyway, while I was there, he asked me to lead him and I in prayer. So I did. I started out saying an ordinary prayer in modern English and used the word “Lord” instead of “Heavenly Father” (Mormons do not pray to any member of their “godhead” except for the “Heavenly Father”. Well, he “corrected” me and told me that out of respect for the Lord, we are to refer to the Lord in the “language of the Bible” and use “thees” and “thous” etc. Also, he instructed me only to to refer to the Lord as “Heavenly Father”. So I started over and continued like that. He continued to criticize my prayer. I don’t remember what else he said but he did criticize it. Also, he told me that I was not allowed to lead any sort of public prayer until I was initiated back into the Mormon church. Basically I was not allowed to lead a prayer in their classes or anything even if I was asked to do so. I thought this to be rather strange. And then he imposed yet another restriction on prayer. He said that when I pray at home, I should always kneel when I pray. Well, I told him that I can’t do that due to knee problems and he told me that I would just have to endure the pain.

But anyway, I thought that all of this was very weird and it was one reason why I chose not to be re-initiated and now I am back home with the Catholic Church. 👍
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I found the fact that you were required to use “thees and thous” very interesting. The fact that the BoM was written in this manner, in mid 1800’s America, has always seemed more than a little strange. My take has always been that Joseph Smith believed that this is how God speaks due to his use of the KJV and that his use of this language would seem to add more credibilty. To me, it has just the opposite affect.
 
Your experience reminds me of Mosiah 24:
9 For Amulon knew Alma, that he had been one of the king’s priests, and that it was he that believed the words of Abinadi and was driven out before the king, and therefore he was wroth with him; for he was subject to king Laman, yet he exercised authority over them, and put tasks upon them, and put task-masters over them.
10 And it came to pass that so great were their afflictions that they began to cry mightily to God.
11 And Amulon commanded them that they should stop their cries; and he put guards over them to watch them, that whosoever should be found calling upon God should be put to death.
12 And Alma and his people did not raise their voices to the Lord their God, but did pour out their hearts to him; and he did know the thoughts of their hearts.
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LOL 😃 You can laugh now. No-one has the power to stop you from praying. They don’t even know their own book, and, as a result, have turned into Amulonites. 😛
 
Hi Holly,
That all sounds very sad, that the bishop was first focused on nuances or style issues rather than helping you resolve your questions of faith.

The style of language (thee & thou), including kneeling is meant to focus the prayer on the importance of prayer. It clearly doesn’t impact God’s ability to listen. I personally notice a difference in my concentration when I pray kneeling vs sitting on the couch or trying to pray while driving. All are good but kneeling is better for me. Isn’t this also why people knee in a Catholic mass?

I’m puzzled why one would expect anyone to pray to the Holy Spirit or Jesus over God the father? LDS are taught to pray to God in the name of Jesus, so they are both included in every prayer. We know the Holy Spirit delivers his answers to us.

I have no idea why you should not lead a group prayer?

Looking at your post count, I seems you are now an active and happy RCC member 👍
Holly3278 said:
But anyway, I thought that all of this was very weird and it was one reason why I chose not to be re-initiated and now I am back home with the Catholic Church. 👍
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LongJourney said:
Your experience reminds me of Mosiah 24:

LOL 😃 You can laugh now. No-one has the power to stop you from praying. They don’t even know their own book, and, as a result, have turned into Amulonites. 😛
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LOL, we can always depend on LJ to twist something into a broad brush insult of Mormons.

How can you convert a single incident into Mormon’s not knowing “their book” :confused:
The PEW research survey showed LDS doing better than RCC on bible questions 😛
 
Why not pray to the “Lord?” Because Jesus is Lord. I know this is in their Bibles: “And every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”
I don’t know why they call themselves the “Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints” if they do not pray to Jesus. Seems like the “Church of the Heavenly Father of Latter-Day Saints” would be more appropriate. My two cents.
 
Todd520 said:
LOL, we can always depend on LJ to twist something into a broad brush insult of Mormons.

How can you convert a single incident into Mormon’s not knowing “their book” :confused:
The PEW research survey showed LDS doing better than RCC on bible questions 😛
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:rotfl: Just baiting you. :whistle: 😃
 
Make fun of it if you will, but here is the standard prayer formula taught to LDS

Address God:
We open the prayer by addressing God because he is the one we are praying to. We address Him as our Heavenly Father because He is the father of our spirits, our creator and the one to whom we owe everything we have, including our lives.

Thank Him:
We tell our Father in Heaven what we are thankful for, such as our home, family, health, the earth, and other blessings. This helps keep our mind and wishes in perspective with the gifts we have already received

Ask Him:
We can ask him for help, to bless us with the things we need, such as knowledge, comfort, guidance, peace, health, etc.

Close in the Name of Jesus Christ, Amen:
We close the prayer by saying, “In the name of Jesus Christ, Amen” because Jesus is our Savior, our mediator between death (physical and spiritual) and eternal life. Christ is the one who suffered and died for us that we may be able to return again to our Father’s presence and He is the one we are commanded to have faith in. The Apostle John taught: "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
 
I’m sorry that you are confused, Todd520 as to “why one would expect anyone to pray to the Holy Spirit or Jesus over God the father.” I’ll pray for you. First of all, God the Father is not “over” the other members of the Blessed Trinity. They are all co-equal. Jesus is God and the Holy Spirit is God. Why would one not expect that everyone pray to God? Please pray to the Holy Spirit for guidance. Don’t become apostate by leaving Christ to join a 19th-century Protestant sect. The Lord will give the crown of glory to those who persevere. Therefore, he will not give it to those who do not persevere. You persevere in Him by keeping the Faith handed on to the Apostles, believing in Jesus (that is, who He really is - not who J.S. and B.Y. say He is), and faithfully living out the Gospel. Jesus is THE PROPHET. J.S. is not a prophet. He was not sent by God. On the contrary. You can read for yourself what Holy Scripture given through Saint Paul has to say to those who are schismatics and apostates. In short, it is not good. Their fate is hell because they have refused or given up belief in Christ, which is necessary for Him to be able to forgive us our sins, to wash them away in his own blood, as He did mine yesterday in Holy Confession. Please don’t leave Him. Neither abandon your mother.
 
Make fun of it if you will, but here is the standard prayer formula taught to LDS
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And the Mormon god won’t listen to any prayer in any other format? :confused:
 
Todd520, you say you have faith in Jesus. Good. What do you believe about His person? Not what He has done, but who he Is. Is he THE ONE WHO IS or is only God the Father THE ONE WHO IS, the Alpha and the Omega? If Jesus is not HE WHO IS then He is not the Alpha and the Omega. He would be a Beta and the Omega.
 
LongJourney said:
And the Mormon god won’t listen to any prayer in any other format? :confused:
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LJ, please grow up and stop baiting for a fight
  • I already said in my first post that our style of prayer does not affect God’s ear
  • should we start a negative thread on 'The Rosary" and what’s funky about it? (talk about prescriptive prayer) :eek:
I personally wish to encourage prayer in whatever form it takes.
 
Hear His words yourself:

“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.”

He is not the second and the last. Does not J.S. say he was a “spirit-being” and brother of Lucifer who was created by God the Father? Correct me if I’m wrong. Such a person is not “the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.” Could Satan call himself the Alpha, the beginning, and the first? He could, but he would be lying. Jesus does not lie.
 
dcana,
So read what you said again - you confirmed we are both praying to God.
Because of your view of the Trinity, you get there regardless of which of the x3 person masks he is wearing. It makes sense for Catholics to address Jesus or the Holy Spirit as they would God.

Since LDS see them as a Godhead, it’s essential that we open by addressing God specifically, and close in the name of Jesus.
dcana said:
I’m sorry that you are confused, Todd520 as to “why one would expect anyone to pray to the Holy Spirit or Jesus over God the father.”
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Todd520, when you say you are Catholic ==> LDS does that mean you currently Catholic or LDS? Is the “==>” in past, present, or future tense?
 
Todd520 said:
dcana,
So read what you said again - you confirmed we are both praying to God.
Because of your view of the Trinity, you get there regardless of which of the x3 peson masks he is wearing.
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Oh my. God isn’t wearing any “masks”. What you have described is a heresy known as Modalism, and has nothing to do with what Catholics believe.
 
CatholicGuyNY said:
Oh my. God isn’t wearing any “masks”. What you have described is a heresy known as Modalism, and has nothing to do with what Catholics believe.
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I admit I dont’ fully get the Trinity. Would it be better if I said Catholics use one of three distict aliases when they pray to God?

I personally don’t like this one because it makes me think Jason Bourne and his box of passports etc.
 
Holly3278 said:
Hey everyone. A couple of years ago, when I was having doubts about Catholicism, I went to the “bishop” of the local Mormon church and asked him if I could be re-baptized (I had my name withdrawn from the Mormon church’s records and doing that effectively “undoes” your “baptism” and “confirmation” in the Mormon church. Anyway, while I was there, he asked me to lead him and I in prayer. So I did. I started out saying an ordinary prayer in modern English and used the word “Lord” instead of “Heavenly Father” (Mormons do not pray to any member of their “godhead” except for the “Heavenly Father”. Well, he “corrected” me and told me that out of respect for the Lord, we are to refer to the Lord in the “language of the Bible” and use “thees” and “thous” etc. Also, he instructed me only to to refer to the Lord as “Heavenly Father”. So I started over and continued like that. He continued to criticize my prayer. I don’t remember what else he said but he did criticize it. Also, he told me that I was not allowed to lead any sort of public prayer until I was initiated back into the Mormon church. Basically I was not allowed to lead a prayer in their classes or anything even if I was asked to do so. I thought this to be rather strange. And then he imposed yet another restriction on prayer. He said that when I pray at home, I should always kneel when I pray. Well, I told him that I can’t do that due to knee problems and he told me that I would just have to endure the pain.

👍
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Although I know nothing about Mormonism, none of this seems too unreasonable to me, except for the kneeling thing.
But anyway, I thought that all of this was very weird and it was one reason why I chose not to be re-initiated and now I am back home with the Catholic Church.
Click to expand...
I’m glad you’re Catholic, but I hope it wasn’t the straw that broke the Mormon camel’s back.
 
Todd520 said:
I’m puzzled why one would expect anyone to pray to the Holy Spirit or Jesus over God the father? LDS are taught to pray to God in the name of Jesus, so they are both included in every prayer. We know the Holy Spirit delivers his answers to us.
Click to expand...
Christians have been praying to all three Persons of the Trinity from time immemorial. There is no need to change that now. 👍
 
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