Praying for the Conversion of Jews...

[rescath]

I may be wrong but did you just state that all Jews have to do to be accepted and tolerated is to stop being Jews?
Nothing antisemitic in that(!???)

Certainly not. By definition, antisemitism is racial. I prefer the term antijudaic. Yes, I’m antijudaic because the continuation of a now false Judaism ensnares so many people whom I wish could become my brothers and sisters in the one true faith. It’s religious and not racial. I am against Judaism in the same way that I am against the errors of Protestantism, Islam, etc. You see that on Good Friday, the Church also prayers for those ensnared by heresy and other false religious views. It’s my charity for Jews which makes me be against Judaism. If I hated Jews, would I not rejoice in their being snared in a false religion?

 

[chosen_people]

Certainly not. By definition, antisemitism is racial. I prefer the term antijudaic. Yes, I’m antijudaic because the continuation of a now false Judaism ensnares so many people whom I wish could become my brothers and sisters in the one true faith. It’s religious and not racial. I am against Judaism in the same way that I am against the errors of Protestantism, Islam, etc. You see that on Good Friday, the Church also prayers for those ensnared by heresy and other false religious views. It’s my charity for Jews which makes me be against Judaism. If I hated Jews, would I not rejoice in their being snared in a false religion?

Why is it that antisemitic Catholics always feel they have the right to define the term “antisemitic” ? It really doesn’t matter if you call yourself antisemitic or antijudaic or antiheritic or hostile- it has led in the past to hate persecution and unspeakable crimes by Catholics against Jews as well as people of other religions.

 

[Freshman88]

Why is it that antisemitic Catholics always feel they have the right to define the term “antisemitic” ? It really doesn’t matter if you call yourself antisemitic or antijudaic or antiheritic or hostile- it has led in the past to hate persecution and unspeakable crimes by Catholics against Jews as well as people of other religions.

Your charge that he is anti-semitc is quite serious and as I see it without grounds. I hold similar views, and am even pro-Israeli, with Jewish friends.

would you be so kind then to define anti-semitism for us?
Then explain how praying for the conversion of all outside of our faith (including Jews) is anti-Semitic.

 

[Andreas_Hofer]

Herod, all I know of the prayer is its name, and as I said I personally don’t think that any form of anti-semitism is good for Our Lord while on the cross pleaded on their behalf (Lk 23:24). My only point was that it seems that we no longer pray for their conversion - instead only praying that they “grow in faith”.

Catholig

Which I think is a very good point. If perfidis was constantly misunderstood, I don’t mind dropping it, but after my pretty tradtional NO Good Friday service I sat down and read the '62 service and was struck by how much more clearly the '62 missal seemed to express the mind of the Church toward non-Catholics than the new rite. It was simply a much better set of petitions all around. Now it’s much harder to tell whether non-Catholics need conversion or simply to grow where they are or maybe try to get to full unity but don’t worry if they fall short. I don’t think the '62 missal said anything hostile about any of the non-Catholics for which it prayed but it managed to make it *absolutely *clear that Christ in the Catholic Church is the only way to heaven; our modern prayers are far more complimentary of other denominations and religions and seem to shy away from making clear the need for conversion.

 

[Malcolm_McLean]

I may be wrong but did you just state that all Jews have to do to be accepted and tolerated is to stop being Jews?
Nothing antisemitic in that(!???)

I share your anger to any allusion between the Catholic faith and antisemitism. No one could believe that. If I were you I’d write to everyone of the one million one hundred and twenty thousand web sites dealing with Catholic antisemitism on the internet.

There you go “move along now”.

You can be polite and tolerant to the man who says that there is no such thing as an imaginary number. You can even give him a title like Professor of Mathematics.
But ultimately to be a mathematician he must drop that false view. It is simply not compatibe with the various thigns we need to do to manipulate numbers.

There are about a billion Catholics in the world. If 1 million one hundred and twenty thousand of them hate Jews that makes 0.1%Jew-haters. I dare say a similar number hate Negroes, Chinese people, North Americans, Muslims, and so forth. It is not desireable, in fact it is contrary to our teachings, but is is pretty much inevitable.

 

[rescath]

Why is it that antisemitic Catholics always feel they have the right to define the term “antisemitic” ? It really doesn’t matter if you call yourself antisemitic or antijudaic or antiheritic or hostile- it has led in the past to hate persecution and unspeakable crimes by Catholics against Jews as well as people of other religions.

How do you define antisemitic then? So in order not to be antisemitic I now have to accept the errors of modern-day Judaism as legitimate? Antisemitism is a racial term by definition, as the term “semite” is a racial/ethnic term.

Colin Powell once said: “It is not antisemitic to criticize policies of the state of Israel.” Likewise, it is not antisemtic to criticize modern-day Judaism or Zionism. There is, for example, a group called “Jews Against Zionism”. I find it inexplicable that some Jewish groups actually call JEWS antisemitic simply for disagreeing with certain political views.

Just because something CAN lead to hatred or persecution doesn’t mean that it must nor that the intellectual premises of such activities are mistaken. So, for example, similarly, just because being against homosexuality causes some people to become violent against homosexuals doesn’t make homosexuality right.

I don’t hate Jews and your are not in a position to judge my intentions. God knows my heart; you do not.

 

[Malcolm_McLean]

Why is it that antisemitic Catholics always feel they have the right to define the term “antisemitic” ? It really doesn’t matter if you call yourself antisemitic or antijudaic or antiheritic or hostile- it has led in the past to hate persecution and unspeakable crimes by Catholics against Jews as well as people of other religions.

Someone said that ultimately all words end up meaning either “good” or “bad”. The term “anti-Semitism” was introduced in the nineteenth century. The normal procedure is to say that if a group of people invent a word to describe themselves, then that is what the word means. It means specifically hatred of Jews on non-religious grounds.

 

[Jean_Anthony]

This post is closed. Thank you, everyone.