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poche
Guest
When an married man is ordained to the priesthood it is understood that if his wife dies he will not be allowed to marry again.
Priesthood and celibacy question for my fellow Easterners (and Latin brethren as well š)
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George720
Guest
True - He cannot re-marry without giving up being a priestā¦
Laicization is his only road to re-marriageā¦
And with a lot of very young children, it can be what happensā¦
geo
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dochawk
Guest
There are very rare cases, both EO and EC, of widowed priests with small children being allowed to remarryānot for their own sake, but for that of the children.
And when I say āvery rareā, I mean that I doubt Iād need the fingers of my second hand to count htenm all . . .
And when I say āvery rareā, I mean that I doubt Iād need the fingers of my second hand to count htenm all . . .
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babochka
Guest
I have heard rumors of such cases for many years, but have never seen any evidence or actual documentation. It all seems to be limited to internet commentary on various forums.
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babochka
Guest
Well, there you go! That was quick.
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dochawk
Guest
Most of the time, Iād dismiss them.
However, given the backgrounds of many of the folks active on byzcath where it has been discussed more than once, I suspect it would have been debunked thereāand it hasnāt
I also expect that those that do know would keep fairly quiet for the privacy of those involve.d
You will find more documentation for the ROC allowing RC priests to marry after conversion on the grounds that they were āwrongfullyā denied.
The infant situation is very rare, the ROC exception rare, and the EPās decision new (Iām not aware of any other EO church accepting this [then again, the time for such things is more often measured in centuries than years . . .]).
Also, the RCC recognizes the orders of the PNC which allows, I believe, post-ordination marriage.
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babochka
Guest
Yes, this is quite common. I know of more than one case personally. Usually they get around it by bringing the priest in via ordination, rather than just vesting. Sometimes he is also baptized and chrismated. That way he gets to start with a clean slate.
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Margaret_Ann
Guest
With all due respect, he wonāt āstart with a clean slateā. Baptism and Chrismation can only be conferred once in a lifetime, unless the Baptism and/or Chrismation was clearly invalid (e.g. using āpolitically correctā terminology instead of the Trinitarian formula for baptism), and then theyāre administered conditionally. Otherwise itās a sacrilege.
We acknowledge the validity of Baptism & Chrismation administered by the EOC. They should at least reciprocate. Sorry, this really burns me up.
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George720
Guest
This is from the article:
āThe Holy Synod of the Ecumenical Patriarchate has rendered a historic decision
to allow priests whose wives died or abandoned them to enter into a second marriage.ā
It is interesting that both the EP and the Pope seem well bent on exercising their creative authority to take non-canonical actions unilaterallyā¦ Personally, I regard this action as a non-canonical local decision of the local EPās Church -
Lord have mercyā¦
Interesting, these Times!
geo
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dochawk
Guest
I think Baptism is a rather rare exception (although I think there are one or two EO that even baptize other EOāI read a webpage from one years ago that claimed baptism was into a church, and thus necessary. I canāt find it anymore).
Some EO jurisdictions chrysmate again after some excommunications; itās not just denial of the RC chrysmation.
Some EO jurisdictions chrysmate again after some excommunications; itās not just denial of the RC chrysmation.
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babochka
Guest
I agree with you, of course!babochka:
With all due respect, he wonāt āstart with a clean slateā. Baptism and Chrismation can only be conferred once in a lifetime, unless the Baptism and/or Chrismation was clearly invalid (e.g. using āpolitically correctā terminology instead of the Trinitarian formula for baptism), and then theyāre administered conditionally. Otherwise itās a sacrilege.
We acknowledge the validity of Baptism & Chrismation administered by the EOC. They should at least reciprocate. Sorry, this really burns me up.
But certain Orthodox jurisdictions do not and others only do so when it is convenient for them.
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ConcernedConvert
Guest
I agree completely! The Catholic Church needs to be faithful to its own traditions. Sometimes it seems like the Catholic Church is ready to abandon her traditions to accept traditions of other faith groups.
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ziapueblo
Guest
The Latin Church should be faithful to its current tradition of a celibate priesthood. However, pushing the celibate priesthood on the Byzantine Catholic Churches or other Eastern Catholic Churches should not happen.
ZP
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Margaret_Ann
Guest
Do you have a link for that talk? Iād like to see it.
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dochawk
Guest
Iād be interested too, on a variety of levels . . . including the recording of such dissent in the fourth century . . .
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Phillip_Rolfes
Guest
It was in a series of talks on the history of the Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom that he recorded for DVD through Eastern Christian Publications/Orientale Lumen Television. I canāt find OLTVās website any more.
EDIT: I found it! OLTV has a page of video series done by Fr. Taft. Most of the videos were shot by meā¦ literally just sitting in the room with Fr. Taft while he talked/taught into the camera. It was like having my own personal retreat with him.
Anyhow, the history of the liturgical spoon is in one of the first three series on that page. Canāt remember which. Itās been some time since Iāve listened to them.
EDIT: I found it! OLTV has a page of video series done by Fr. Taft. Most of the videos were shot by meā¦ literally just sitting in the room with Fr. Taft while he talked/taught into the camera. It was like having my own personal retreat with him.
Anyhow, the history of the liturgical spoon is in one of the first three series on that page. Canāt remember which. Itās been some time since Iāve listened to them.
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Herculees
Guest
I donāt think that is going to be the case anymore
as the Maroniteās in the U.S. already has one ordained
Married American born priest in the U.S. This particular
priest was ordained in Lebanon but after a few years
returned to the states. There is a married man in the
Maronite seminary in the U.S. right now who is going
āGod willingā be ordained.
and
as the Maroniteās in the U.S. already has one ordained
Married American born priest in the U.S. This particular
priest was ordained in Lebanon but after a few years
returned to the states. There is a married man in the
Maronite seminary in the U.S. right now who is going
āGod willingā be ordained.
and
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KIM.T
Guest
Hello Herculees,
There must have been a change in the rules. It was not this way in the past. Do you know when they changed these rules? Thanks
There must have been a change in the rules. It was not this way in the past. Do you know when they changed these rules? Thanks
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dochawk
Guest
Pope Frances vacated the hateful Cum Data Fuerit, which is where the abuse of EC in the US had been ācodifiedā.
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