Priests (&/or catechized Catholics): Is the topic of the Real Presence "too much information" for certain non-Catholics?

[po18guy]

You wouldn’t think i would need this kind of reminder, but i do…

Take heart! You answer to God for the truth you presented, not how receptive other hearts were.

funny you should say this 'cause recently i was @ the Blessed Sacrament & the Holy spirit seemed to be telling me/showing me just how much anti-Christ “stuff” there is in this world… way more than i fully realized…

The very division in Christ’s body was brought about by the spirit of antichrist. Who else would seek the destruction of the Truth?

This is something that has been in the back of my mind for a long time… but without the clarity of your words… That is exactly what his problem seems to be… I guess he just wants to keep Jesus in the attick… of his mind… but isn’t that the way it is with Protestantism - Jesus is never really known in their world as He is with the Catholic… (the Real Presence…)… Pretty sad…

Many want to follow Christ, as long as their journey does not lead to the Catholic Church. Can you really call them Christians? If they are validly baptized, yes. However, they appear to be like those in John 6 who found His teaching regarding eating His flesh hard to accept. I am searching for a term which will define them.

thank you so much… I am so glad i asked this question (almost didn’t)… God bless…

Seek and you shall find. Knock and the door will opened. It is up to your friend to realize the truth. Yo have shown him, but only he answers for his belief, or lack thereof. As Christ let them go, we also must allow them to go. The Lord is not through with them yet. Remember the parable of the workers hired in the last hour of the day:

Matthew 20:1-8 "For the kingdom of heaven is like a landowner who went out early in the morning to hire men to work in his vineyard. He agreed to pay them a denarius for the day and sent them into his vineyard. "About the third hour he went out and saw others standing in the marketplace doing nothing. He told them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard, and I will pay you whatever is right.’ So they went. "He went out again about the sixth hour and the ninth hour and did the same thing. About the eleventh hour he went out and found still others standing around. He asked them, ‘Why have you been standing here all day long doing nothing?’ " ‘Because no one has hired us,’ they answered. "He said to them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard.’ "When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, ‘Call the workers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last ones hired and going on to the first.’

Thus, God’s grace extends throughout our lifetimes, so that we may even benefit from a deathbed conversion. Those workers who entered the vineyard (Heaven) in the last hour received the same reward (eternal joy) as those who were there all day. So, patience and prayer will call the Holy Spirit to speak to his heart. You can see how the Holy Spirit revealed things to you so clearly. Well, maybe he’s just a late bloomer.

Christ’s peace.

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

My experience with most protestants inquiring about the Church is that they are truly interested in knowing more, especially about the Eucharist and why we believe what we believe. The gospel of John, Chapter 6 is an excellent discussion point, especially at the end of the presentation of Jesus saying that his flesh is real food and his blood real drink. I like to point out what Jesus did not do when the disciples left him saying" we cannot take this kind of talk" and they left him. I point out that Jesus was so serious about what he said, that he not only let them go, but also turned to the 12 (the apostles) and asked, “Are you going to leave me too.” Most often, those inquiring say, they have not looked at it that way. In RCIA classes I have taught, this was one point that brought one man in who was going through RCIA for his second time because he was hung up on the Eucharist. When I pointed this out, he responded, “Oh my God, I have missed that before. It was never explained to me that way before.” He has now been in the Church for 5 - 6 years and is extremely active as a lector, Extraordinary minister of the Eucharist, KC’s, you name it. He has since brought in his wife and children. and all are just as happy as he. So, yes, explain the Eucharist is its full meaning. Let Jesus do the rest.
Prayers & Blessings
Deacon Ed B

 

[distracted]

" ‘Because no one has hired us,’ they answered. "He said to them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard.’ "When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, ‘Call the workers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last ones hired and going on to the first.’

thank you so much for your whole post but especially for this one… another passage about WORKS being necessary to salvation… Well, OK the passage doesn’t mention salvation but i guess that is implied. At another forum about whether the Catholic Church is the true one and necessary for salvation, this one poster (& many others, of course) thinks a person can be saved withiout good works…

. Those workers who entered the vineyard (Heaven) in the last hour received the same reward (eternal joy) as those who were there all day.

that is a comforting thought…

patience and prayer will call the Holy Spirit to speak to his heart. You can see how the Holy Spirit revealed things to you so clearly. Well, maybe he’s just a late bloomer.

Thanks… I needed to be reminded of all this because sometimes i get so impatient with people who seem so obstinate and… well, foolish even… but i need to remember my own foolishness and obstinancy (in other kinds of matters)… When i see my own human-ness, it helps me to see and understand the human-ness of others… One thing i need to realize (over and over ) is that Protestants were raisedto believe a certain way and it is difficult to overcome how a person was raised… especially when most people in this country are protestant… thanks…
God bless…

Christ’s peace.

 

[EasterJoy]

But surrprisingly and inevitably some will ask me later in the year about the Eucharist as a “symbol”. -That’s when i get frustrated.

Well, since a sacrament is by definition an “outward sign” it is also symbol. The Eucharist exemplifies this feature of all other sacraments: the ritual symbol is also the most profound of realities.

Generally speaking, if you explain the sacrament of marriage as both symbol and reality, people can get that one. The marriage ceremony is symbolic of the reality of how these people are joined. Then it is easier to convince people that the deepest realities of our lives are those very ones that cry out for a ritual symbol to call attention to them, and to underscore their fundamental importance.

My experience with most protestants inquiring about the Church is that they are truly interested in knowing more, especially about the Eucharist and why we believe what we believe. The gospel of John, Chapter 6 is an excellent discussion point, especially at the end of the presentation of Jesus saying that his flesh is real food and his blood real drink. I like to point out what Jesus did not do when the disciples left him saying" we cannot take this kind of talk" and they left him. I point out that Jesus was so serious about what he said, that he not only let them go, but also turned to the 12 (the apostles) and asked, “Are you going to leave me too.” Most often, those inquiring say, they have not looked at it that way. In RCIA classes I have taught, this was one point that brought one man in who was going through RCIA for his second time because he was hung up on the Eucharist. When I pointed this out, he responded, “Oh my God, I have missed that before. It was never explained to me that way before.” He has now been in the Church for 5 - 6 years and is extremely active as a lector, Extraordinary minister of the Eucharist, KC’s, you name it. He has since brought in his wife and children. and all are just as happy as he. So, yes, explain the Eucharist is its full meaning. Let Jesus do the rest.
Prayers & Blessings
Deacon Ed B

Yes! You never know which encounter with the truth is going to open the gate, but it takes some kind of encounter to do it. I think that sometimes, it is the persistent knocking of many encounters that finally does the trick. We should not be discouraged or overly upset that these things can take time, as if the Holy Spirit were bound to serve us. Patient and ongoing insistence on the truth is key.

 

[distracted]

My experience with most protestants inquiring about the Church is that they are truly interested in knowing more, especially about the Eucharist and B

I wish i knew the Protestants you know… the ones i have known have made me want to not bother anymore (until i get to know them better or this or that changes… whatever…)

Thanks for the much-needed encouragement… maybe i will try again soon… (I am always doing something to spread the faith, just not always explaining the eucharist right away… or if so, i do not do so with certain people, in certain situations… )

 

[distracted]

Generally speaking, if you explain the sacrament of marriage as both symbol and reality, people can get that one. The marriage ceremony is symbolic of the reality of how these people are joined.

Thanks. I never thought of matrimony as a way to explain the Eucharist. It is actaully a very good way, now that i think about it… I never considered this… but is communion a way of being married to Christ… Oh, maybe that is a dumb question… Well, remember, i was not catechized… @ least not until i catechized myself several years ago.

 

[distracted]

Many want to follow Christ, as long as their journey does not lead to the Catholic Church.

---

So True!!***

 

[po18guy]

I wish i knew the Protestants you know… the ones i have known have made me want to not bother anymore (until i get to know them better or this or that changes… whatever…)

Thanks for the much-needed encouragement… maybe i will try again soon… (I am always doing something to spread the faith, just not always explaining the eucharist right away… or if so, i do not do so with certain people, in certain situations… )

Simply amaze them by the joy you have in the Lord. Your constant witness of how much you love Christ, especially in the Eucharist, will speak volumes that lips cannot, as they lack the eloquence. Recently, on the “Coming Home Network” chnetwork.org/ with Marcus Grodi, a Protestant convert told of the power of Christ in the Eucharist as he read John 6 before the Blessed Sacrament. His eyes were opened to the Real Presence.

However, you cannot expect this to work with a dyed-in-the-wool member of another church. Their heart must be in the seeking mode before such things are revealed. An air of obstinacy repels illumination by the Holy Spirit.

Remember that your friend has known all his life that God is good and the devil is bad. He may have heard only negative stereotypes and false ideas of the Catholic church. These take time to dispel. Exposure to the Catholic church via the love revealed through her members is the only effective manner of overturning a lifetime of negativity associated with her.

Yo have already started him along that road. But, like learning to walk, there will be stumbles and falls along the way. Place your faith and trust in God. He has a much more long-term plan that we do!

Christ’s peace be always with you.

 

[EasterJoy]

Thanks. I never thought of matrimony as a way to explain the Eucharist. It is actaully a very good way, now that i think about it… I never considered this… but is communion a way of being married to Christ… Oh, maybe that is a dumb question… Well, remember, i was not catechized… @ least not until i catechized myself several years ago.

I don’t mean that Communion is a way to be married to Christ. I mean that a sacrament is, by definition “an outward sign, instituted by Christ, to give grace”. Every one of the sacraments has ritual symbolism. Every one bestows a spiritual reality: the indelible mark of baptism, the life-long bonds of marriage, the actual absolution of sins, the True Presence of the Eucharist…

We become one with the Church, the Bride of Christ, when we are baptized. It is the Church that is His Bride.

 

[distracted]

. Exposure to the Catholic church via the love revealed through her members is the only effective manner of overturning a lifetime of negativity associated with her.

thanks… The only problem is, i feel i have done this with the “friend” (we don’t speak much anymore…). It is a guy and maybe he is upset because i wouldn’t be more than friend… don’t know… but i feel i need to distance myself from him for now… I only pray right now…

Yo have already started him along that road.

I’m not sure he’s on the road at all… i think he got lost on a rabbit trail long ago… but then, God knows… he doesn’t talk to me & is in a habit of suppressing true feelings, so no one, not me or anyone else in his life, seems to know where he’s coming from…

 

[po18guy]

thanks… The only problem is, i feel i have done this with the “friend” (we don’t speak much anymore…). It is a guy and maybe he is upset because i wouldn’t be more than friend… don’t know… but i feel i need to distance myself from him for now… I only pray right now…

You are doing exactly what you should. You have already revealed Christ’s love, which is all you can do. Patience is next. The Lord will send someone to him with the truth, even if you never see him again.

I’m not sure he’s on the road at all… i think he got lost on a rabbit trail long ago… but then, God knows… he doesn’t talk to me & is in a habit of suppressing true feelings, so no one, not me or anyone else in his life, seems to know where he’s coming from…

The path to the truth is littered with holes and boulders. He may not know it, but he’s just picking his way along right now. If he’s off the path, the journey becomes so difficult that he will long to get back on track. His heart will turn and he will seek the truth. Prayer is all that will help him now.

Christ’s peace.

 

[distracted]

. If he’s off the path, the journey becomes so difficult that he will long to get back on track. His heart will turn and he will seek the truth. Prayer is all that will help him now.

.

The sad thing is that sin can “blind” a person… If a person is in serious sin (and God knows wehther this guy is or not)… his soul is deformed, his mind adversely affected… & he may not even see the value of investigating such things as Catholicism… (?). He may have been lying to himself for so long he no longer can tell truth from error… to speak of…

I know how sin can affect one’s soul. I am a sinner myself (Hard to believe, i know )… and if it weren’t for me having allowed Jesus to cleanse me, or at least begin a cleansing process (through frequent Mass attendance, confession, etc.), i would be very “lost”…
This guy doesn’t have all those helps… so i wonder… But again, only God knows… and it does no real good to speculate on such things as the true condition of his soul.
Even so, the Word says you will know them by their fruits… and his fruits are not so good… My reality says he is messing w/ my head…(being abusive, mentally) and i know God doesn’t want me to continue letting him… If i do, then i am abusing Christ who lives in me…

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

I know how sin can affect one’s soul. I am a sinner myself (Hard to believe, i know )… and if it weren’t for me having allowed Jesus to cleanse me, or at least begin a cleansing process (through frequent Mass attendance, confession, etc.), i would be very “lost”… .

Don’t think that this is only you. You have just described us all.
Prayers & Blessings
Deacon Ed B

 

[po18guy]

The sad thing is that sin can “blind” a person… If a person is in serious sin (and God knows wehther this guy is or not)… his soul is deformed, his mind adversely affected… & he may not even see the value of investigating such things as Catholicism… (?). He may have been lying to himself for so long he no longer can tell truth from error… to speak of…

The Lord knows exactly what his soul needs for perfection. He will allow him to err as much as necessary, to wander as far away as needed, to fall into the very depths of sin, if that leads to his eventual perfection. In the meantime, continue to pray and trust God for everything else.

To paraphrase Saint Francis de Sales, if you employ the armor of truth and the shield of faith, he will have no power whatsoever over you.

Christ’s peace.

 

[Demetress]

Yes millions follow Jesus Christ he is the only way not the catholic church. Jesus said to the woman at the well (John4:vs24) God is spirit and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and truth.You can not put God in your catholic boxs.

 

[po18guy]

Yes millions follow Jesus Christ he is the only way not the catholic church. Jesus said to the woman at the well (John4:vs24) God is spirit and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and truth.You can not put God in your catholic boxs.

Christ founded one church, right? Which one?

 

[distracted]

The Lord knows exactly what his soul needs for perfection. He will allow him to err as much as necessary, to wander as far away as needed, to fall into the very depths of sin, if that leads to his eventual perfection. .

Thank you so much for reminding me of this… I don’t know why i had forgotten that God does allow that kind of wandering… and that sometimes a person has to hit rock bottom before he/she can… well, see things as God would want…

I was too emotionally involved… but I don’t feel i am anymore… so maybe i can pray in a better way for this person…

 

[distracted]

Don’t think that this is only you. You have just described us all.
Prayers & Blessings
Deacon Ed B

Thanks… and i am describing Protestants as well and the sad thing is, they don’t know what a lengthy Purgatory awaits them… They (not all but some) say that Jesus paid it all, so they don’t have to do anything but ask forgiveness… This one guy i talked to recently seemed to think that because God forgives everything, we don’t really have to worry about falling into this or that sin… But as Catholics, we know (or should) that sin needs not only to be forgiven, that is only the 1st step… it must be cleansed off the soul as well… No unclean thing will enter Heaven (Rev 21:27)…

I heard that Protestants spend more time in Purgatory because they didn’t believe in it and also because their Protestant friens./relatives don’t pray for them once they are “gone”…

We Catholics need to spread the faith… A lot of work and persecution, True, but it is the most important work we can do…

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

I heard that Protestants spend more time in Purgatory because they didn’t believe in it and also because their Protestant friens./relatives don’t pray for them once they are “gone”… .

All we have to do is pray for the holy souls in purgatory. We do not have to name them by name. Because of the efficacious power of prayer, it is as if we pray for each one individually.

Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B

 

[po18guy]

Thanks… and i am describing Protestants as well and the sad thing is, they don’t know what a lengthy Purgatory awaits them… They (not all but some) say that Jesus paid it all, so they don’t have to do anything but ask forgiveness… This one guy i talked to recently seemed to think that because God forgives everything, we don’t really have to worry about falling into this or that sin… But as Catholics, we know (or should) that sin needs not only to be forgiven, that is only the 1st step… it must be cleansed off the soul as well… No unclean thing will enter Heaven (Rev 21:27)…

I heard that Protestants spend more time in Purgatory because they didn’t believe in it and also because their Protestant friens./relatives don’t pray for them once they are “gone”…

We Catholics need to spread the faith… A lot of work and persecution, True, but it is the most important work we can do…

I have come to view Purgatory not as time, since God is outside of time, but as pain that we suffer for sinfulness that remains. And so, it appears, from the intense suffering of some on earth, that the Lord graciously allows purgation to begin in this life. What a blessing! I think the last years of Pope John Paul II’s life may point to this. I could be completely wrong, but such a loving and wonderful God is He!

Christ’s peace.