Pro-Lifers Should Get Same Access to Schools as Planned Parenthood Does

  • Thread starter Thread starter JimG
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Whatever…

Killing the babe in the womb remains Murder

PP - Remains an Abomination…
 
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Hume:
Sex requires consent of both parties.

As one partner will not have consented to the sex, sure. It’s rape.
But one person has automony and the other doesn’t?
Again, sex requires mutual consent.

Not a difficult concept. 18 year old frat boys usually understand it.
 
Yeah. Since you can’t obtain consent, you can’t have sex with them. Similar to date-rape rules we have on college campuses.
I don’t see where things without bodily autonomy have rights in the train of thought you propose.
 
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Hume:
Yeah. Since you can’t obtain consent, you can’t have sex with them. Similar to date-rape rules we have on college campuses.
I don’t see where things without bodily autonomy have rights in the train of thought you propose.
As I had to explain to you in the other forum, there are other axioms in play that we can agree on.

Like the golden rule, another is the required consent of both parties for sex. Most the world over agree with it. If you don’t, fine. But I’m not sure that jives with your beliefs.
 
As I had to explain to you in the other forum, there are other axioms in play that we can agree on.
Sure…

No doubt that explanation didn’t hold water either - aka it was rejected for being false…

You convinced what? No one?

Killing the babe in the womb remains Murder

PP - Remains an Abomination…

_
 
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Hume:
Again, sex requires mutual consent.
OK, so we agree that not having bodily automonh doesn’t remove all your rights. Why does it remove the right to life?
It may not remove it. Not totally, and I was happy to concede that on the other forum.

But it is overshadowed by the mother’s autonomy.

We see this in nature - mom abandoning babies in extreme acute situations where caring for them is impossible.

We see this in the modern world - when choosing between baby and mom in a critical health situation, we choose mom.

Mom came first. Mom has bodily autonomy. Self determination. Moral agency.

A fetus literally has none of these things.

Coupled with the fact that pregnancy is dangerous, a woman cannot be forced to undergo a pregnancy she does not want.

She is made a slave and that won’t work. I think you Catholics teach that sin (her enslavement) cannot justify good (the forced gestation of her pregnancy)?
 
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It may not remove it. Not totally, and I was happy to concede that on the other forum.
So you concede that life is a right now.

If a woman is pregnant and has morning sickness should she be allowe take thalomide if she wants to?
 
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Hume:
It may not remove it. Not totally, and I was happy to concede that on the other forum.
So you concede that life is a right now.

If a woman is pregnant and has morning sickness should she be allowe take thalomide if she wants to?
It’s literally her body. We should labor to help her be as informed as possible. But it’s her ship to steer to port or steer to the rocks. She’s the captain.
 
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We see this in nature - mom abandoning babies in extreme acute situations where caring for them is impossible.

We see this in the modern world - when choosing between baby and mom in a critical health situation, we choose mom.
This isn’t evidence of anything. We also see countries that have already banned abortion.
 
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Hume:
We see this in nature - mom abandoning babies in extreme acute situations where caring for them is impossible.

We see this in the modern world - when choosing between baby and mom in a critical health situation, we choose mom.
This isn’t evidence of anything. We also see countries that have already banned abortion.
The trend is going the other way.

Out of 180 countries or so, I think there are, like, 12 left with a complete ban. Allah is the god of most of them, IIRC
 
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The trend is going the other way.

Out of 180 countries or so, I think there are, like, 12 left with a complete ban.
It doesn’t prove anything nonetheless because it is an appeal to behavior not to logic.
 
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She is made a slave and that won’t work. I think you Catholics teach that sin (her enslavement) cannot justify good (the forced gestation of her pregnancy)?
The law forces people to do things all the time so a responsibility towards the fetus can be proscribed since death is permanent and pregnancy is temporary.
 
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Hume:
She is made a slave and that won’t work. I think you Catholics teach that sin (her enslavement) cannot justify good (the forced gestation of her pregnancy)?
The law forces people to do things all the time so a responsibility towards the fetus can be proscribed since death is permanent and pregnancy is temporary.
Pregnancy is dangerous. My wife has bladder issues after 3, will probably get a hysterectomy in the not too distant future.

Somewhere in Texas this week, statistically, a woman will die in labor.

Genuinely, the minimization of women and the danger to women from pregnancy that’s hoisted by a lot of pro-lifers is probably the pathos appeal that wins my side the most converts.

It’s dangerous. It’s not “just a little sneeze, wipe your nose, then give it up for adoption if you don’t want it”.
 
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Genuinely, the minimization of women and the danger to women from pregnancy that’s hoisted by a lot of pro-lifers is probably the pathos appeal that wins my side the most converts.
Other precautions can be taken to minimize these risks and the harm caused and pregnancies that result in death can be detected and belong to a different category because of a new element.
Pregnancy is dangerous. My wife has bladder issues after 3, will probably get a hysterectomy in the not too distant future.
Between that and the death of another, the latter is worse and should be avoided.
 
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