Proclaiming the bride and not the bridegroom

[Shannon9791]

I did but you just miss the central point again. Why did Christ live a perfect life and died on the cross for?

Why Christ did it has nothing to do with what we’re asking.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Why Christ did it has nothing to do with what we’re asking.

Really, maybe that’s why you may have a greater affection for the bride than the bridegroom?

Please please please buy this book…

amazon.com/Fifty-Reasons-Why-Jesus-Came/dp/158134788X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1259790710&sr=8-1

Editorial Reviews

Product Description

WHY?

The most important questions anyone can ask are: Why was Jesus Christ crucified? Why did he suffer so much? What has this to do with me? Finally, who sent him to his sdeath? The answer to the last question is that God did. Jesus was God’s Son. The suffering was unsurpassed, but the whole message of the Bible leads to this answer.

The central issue of Jesus’ death is not the cause, but the meaning—God’s meaning. That is what this book is about. John Piper has gathered from the New Testament fifty reasons. Not fifty causes, but fifty purposes—in answer to the most important question that each of us must face: What did God achieve for sinners like us in sending his Son to die?

 

[Shannon9791]

Really, maybe that’s why you may have a greater affection for the bride than the bridegroom?

Please please please buy this book…

amazon.com/Fifty-Reasons-Why-Jesus-Came/dp/158134788X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1259790710&sr=8-1

Editorial Reviews

Product Description

WHY?

The most important questions anyone can ask are: Why was Jesus Christ crucified? Why did he suffer so much? What has this to do with me? Finally, who sent him to his sdeath? The answer to the last question is that God did. Jesus was God’s Son. The suffering was unsurpassed, but the whole message of the Bible leads to this answer.

The central issue of Jesus’ death is not the cause, but the meaning—God’s meaning. That is what this book is about. John Piper has gathered from the New Testament fifty reasons. Not fifty causes, but fifty purposes—in answer to the most important question that each of us must face: What did God achieve for sinners like us in sending his Son to die?

There you go taking what I said out of context again. I will assume that since you have not answered the questing ewok and I asked that you don’t have an answer, and as such I do not have to answer your question.

 

[Lapey]

Which of the three posts above seem to bring the most glory to God?

Sorry, I had to run some errands and was away for a little while.

Adam, it is time for you to honor God and bring glory to Him by doing as He says and be honest. Why do you hate, why do you not love if you want the positive side, the Church that Christ Built upon the rock, Peter? The Roman Church, and those in communion with the Holy See, are the Body of Christ. To hate this is to hate Christ.

To repeat something another poster mentioned, you have used my honest and heart felt post to belittle your siblings, as you call them, which is not Christian like. In fact John wrote that if you claim to love God whom you cannot see and hate those whom you do see, then you are a liar.

It is easier to see hate in your words than love. I’ll stick with my Catholic Christian brothers and sisters, while attempting to show love to others outside of the truth. BTW, I love you and Christ tremendously!

Now tell me brother, why must you work against His church?

 

[2nd_Adam]

Sorry, I had to run some errands and was away for a little while.

Adam, it is time for you to honor God and bring glory to Him by doing as He says and be honest. Why do you hate, why do you not love if you want the positive side, the Church that Christ Built upon the rock, Peter? The Roman Church, and those in communion with the Holy See, are the Body of Christ. To hate this is to hate Christ.

To repeat something another poster mentioned, you have used my honest and heart felt post to belittle your siblings, as you call them, which is not Christian like. In fact John wrote that if you claim to love God whom you cannot see and hate those whom you do see, then you are a liar.

It is easier to see hate in your words than love. I’ll stick with my Catholic Christian brothers and sisters, while attempting to show love to others outside of the truth. BTW, I love you and Christ tremendously!

Now tell me brother, why must you work against His church?

We both love the church, but we have a different understanding of the church. I’m a Christian first and foremost; I am an Evangelical Christian second, and I am a Reformed Christian a distant third. The way that I understand it, many Catholics identify as being Catholic first and Christian second. Therefore, there can be a tendency to love the bride more than the bridegroom. Protestants can have the tendency to love Scripture more than Christ Himself. Therefore, Protestants can love the written word more than the living Word.

BTW… I really loved your testimony! Believe me, I was sincere in what I posted.

 

[izoid]

Weren’t you just preaching against experiences earlier?

Did you take a page out of Adam’s book? Taken out of context you can make anything say whatever you want. You will quickly loose all credibility if you continue down this path.

 

[2nd_Adam]

There you go taking what I said out of context again. I will assume that since you have not answered the questing ewok and I asked that you don’t have an answer, and as such I do not have to answer your question.

I don’t think anyone does this intentionally. This is a Forum discussion with great limitations.

 

[guanophore]

I believe all Christians regardless of being Catholic or Protestant tend to move away from the centrality of Christ on our spiritual journey.

This is an interesting view. I am surprised to hear this, since you have said that you also think a Christian will grow in their love and affection for Christ. What do you think causes this moving away from Christ?

Therefore, we need to remind each other daily and to ourselves about our great God and Savior Jesus Christ.

This is why Catholics have the Daily Office (prayer) and Daily Mass. It really does work better to pray and worship together daily.

I am here to fellowship with Christians regardless of our religious affiliations, and to help each other to grow in our love and affection for our great Triune God.  Growing in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ requires comparing and contrasting our differences to the glory of God alone. Why are you here?

I agree. Personally, I don’t find CAF very conducive to fellowship. I prefer to have my worship and fellowship in person. I do grow in grace and knowlege here, certainly, but it is a very limited venue for that.

Rejection of Truth does not help me to feel affectionate, and the very serious lies about the Catholic faith I encounter on here are really more of a vexation to me than a source of pleasure.

 

[Dancelittleewok]

I don’t think anyone does this intentionally. This is a Forum discussion with great limitations.

Not intentionally? You failed to mention your question you asked us and then put our follow up between a testimony and asked–“which of these glorifies God the most?”

Instead of making excuses, just answer the question and you know what is.

 

[Lapey]

We both love the church, but we have a different understanding of the church. I’m a Christian first and foremost; I am an Evangelical Christian second, and I am a Reformed Christian a distant third. The way that I understand it, many Catholics identify as being Catholic first and Christian second. Therefore, there can be a tendency to love the bride more than the bridegroom. Protestants can have the tendency to love Scripture more than Christ Himself. Therefore, Protestants can love the written word more than the living Word.

BTW… I really loved your testimony! Believe me, I was sincere in what I posted.

In a way I can understand how this could be the appearance, because I have discussed faith issues with “bible worshipers”. It can be very frustrating and fruitless.

However both the Church institution and the Word of God have the presence of the Lord within them. So to say that they are “idols” would be a stretch don’t you think?

The Catholic Church has educated me and fed me over these 43 years of my life, and not I am working to help feed others by studying to be an ordained minister.

I guess my issue is the fact that the Church is the body, the head is Christ and the Eternal Living Word is within the Roman Catholic Church it is hard for me to see what you see. In the same light, I am sure it is hard for you to see my perspective as well.

I do not worship the Church; I worship my God within the Church, as He has asked us to do. This is where I spend time with Him and long for Him even more each time I am at a Mass and partake in the Eucharist.

 

[guanophore]

Have you heard the infamous term of “Cold Calvinism”?

I have a new term called “Cold Catholicism”…

You liked it so much, and found it so glorifying to God when someone insulted your faith tradition that you thought your would pass on the insult?

Way to Go 2nd! I am sure this activity is very glorifying to God.

 

[Lapey]

Not intentionally? You failed to mention your question you asked us and then put our follow up between a testimony and asked–“which of these glorifies God the most?”

Instead of making excuses, just answer the question and you know what is.

I agree with this post 100% What you did here Adam, was not fair.

 

[guanophore]

That is the tactic called proof texting and in doing so, he’s not answered the question. Basically, we answer his question, we ask for clarity, he is obtuse, blames us for not knowing the answer and then we are proof text against these testimonies.

2nd likes to play a game like this for diversion once in a while. He did this before on a “Defend the Catholic Gospel” thread. He tried to bait everyone into telling him what they believed “gospel” meant, then one by one, shot them down,and told them why they were wrong.

It may be one of the methods by which he believes he glorifies God? That and passing insults about other’s faith traditions?

A lot of us have just learned to see through the questions, and just don’t play anymore. I think he might get more supportive fellowship over on the Catholic Living section. I am sure there would be a great response to this “test”.

 

[2nd_Adam]

This is an interesting view. I am surprised to hear this, since you have said that you also think a Christian will grow in their love and affection for Christ. What do you think causes this moving away from Christ?

We tend to create Christian idols of the heart as sinner-saints. As unbelievers, we created pagan idols. As believers, we create Christian idols, anything that we love more than God Himself. These Christian idols can be good things in their proper place. Calvinism can become an idol and so can Catholicism. Therefore, we need to look to Jesus each and everyday. We need to preach the gospel to ourselves. We need to proclaim Christ to Christians each and everyday. Our lives so be centered around the gospel of God first and foremost. We need a Christ-centered and gospel-centered life. Therefore, we should remind each other about Christ and Him crucified all the time. That is the what the Apostles did in their Epistles to the churches.

Jesus, Founder and Perfecter of Our Faith

Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God. - Hebrews 12

 

[guanophore]

I already answered your question. Now, why do you love the Lord Jesus Christ?

No, Adam, you did not. You changed the focus of the thread, and are trying to get Catholics to jump through your little Calvanistic hoops.

Let’s get back to the topic, shall we? If you want to open a thread for people to give their testimony, you can do this. You opened this one to criticise Catholics, so let’s keep to that.

Here are the questions again:

Ah, Adam, do you believe the CC is between Jesus and its members? Why?

Can you love both the Bridegroom and His Bride?

Here was your “answer”:

“Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. And a person’s enemies will be those of his own household. Whoever loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me, and whoever loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. And whoever does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.

“If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. - Jesus the Christ

Your choice of verses does seem to “imply” an answer, but it is not an answer from you. You added nothing of how you understand these verses to respond to the questions that were asked of you.

Apparently you don’t want to answer questions on this thread either, and are trying the same tactic of changing the subject in order to avoid them. Catholic Living might meet your needs better.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Originally Posted by 2nd Adam
Have you heard the infamous term of “Cold Calvinism”?

I have a new term called “Cold Catholicism”…

You liked it so much, and found it so glorifying to God when someone insulted your faith tradition that you thought your would pass on the insult?

Way to Go 2nd! I am sure this activity is very glorifying to God.

I’m just being honest about the Christian life for all Christians regardless of our Christian communities. There is always a swing between cold orthodoxy and extreme emotionalism, one way or the other. I bet the Born Again Catholics or the Charismatic Catholics would have much to say about those Catholics who are orthodox at all cost. Calvinism is no different, nor is Armininism. The Christian life is a struggle, which God intended it to be.

Straining Toward the Goal

Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own. Brothers, I do not consider that I have made it my own. But one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead, I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus. Let those of us who are mature think this way, and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal that also to you. Only let us hold true to what we have attained. - Apostolic Teaching

 

[guanophore]

I think you missed the centrality of Christianity; and the love and glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ with your post. That is why this thread is so important!

I think you did too, by setting up a false dichotomy in your title, and by starting the thread as a criticism of people’s faith practice.

If you really wanted to hear testimony about people’s love of the Lord, why did you go about it this way?

 

[guanophore]

I did but you just miss the central point again. Why did Christ live a perfect life and died on the cross for?

How is this related to the thread topic?

 

[2nd_Adam]

I think you did too, by setting up a false dichotomy in your title, and by starting the thread as a criticism of people’s faith practice.

If you really wanted to hear testimony about people’s love of the Lord, why did you go about it this way?

I don’t think so my friend, because one Catholic (Lapey) gave a very glorifying testimony about her great love for the bridegroom within the Catholic Faith. Tweetymom is also another Catholic who has a great love for the bridegroom within the Catholic Faith. I also find Ryan Oneil to be a breath of fresh air in the Catholic Faith. I must have ask the question below at least four times.

Originally Posted by 2nd Adam
Okay, now’s a chance to post for the record. Why do you love the Lord Jesus Christ?

 

[Dancelittleewok]

How is this related to the thread topic?

Shannon said Christ has died, Christ is risen and Christ will come again. He replied a Mormon could say the same and Adam didn’t answer us when we asked about what was he alluding to the “centrality of the Gospel” if not Christ’s death, resurrection and Second Coming.