Promote NFP more honestly!

[emmar]

So, today was reading an article by Human Life International, allow me to quote.

The Three Primary Concerns. The three primary concerns of couples inquiring about NFP are the result of a pervasive propaganda campaign by medical professionals, pro-abortionists, population controllers and others. These fears are that NFP is ineffective; that too much abstinence is required; and that it is too difficult to learn.
All of these misconceptions can be dispelled by proper instruction.
The maximum amount of abstinence required each month is about nine days using the most advanced methods of NFP

From talking with other NFP couples, nine days is hardly accurate. Perhaps NFP would be more widely practiced if NFP promoters were more up-front with couples about how difficult it actually is.

 

[Em_in_FL]

Let’s post a link to the entire article and really critique it, okay???
Because you left a LOT of information out of your “quote”…
hli.org/index.php/condoms/589?task=view

Here’s an excerpt - I’ll bold a few points:

Learning and Practicing NFP.

   Motivation is Everything. As with all worthy efforts, the key to learning and practicing natural family planning is motivation. If a husband and wife truly want to make the Gospel of Life part of their lives, they will take the time to learn NFP. With NFP, attitude is everything — the more the couple truly want their relationship with each other and with God to grow in maturity and grace, the easier the methods will be to learn. The secret is to make NFP an integral part of one's life, like a weekly "date" enjoyed by husband and wife or frequent Mass attendance.
   Adopting the philosophy of natural stewardship of fertility soon becomes so much a part of one's life that the very concept of contraception becomes unnatural and unthinkable.

   The Three Primary Concerns. The three primary concerns of couples inquiring about NFP are the result of a pervasive propaganda campaign by medical professionals, pro-abortionists, population controllers and others. These fears are that NFP is ineffective; that too much abstinence is required; and that it is too difficult to learn.
   All of these misconceptions can be dispelled by proper instruction.
   Chapter 21, "Contraception," shows that NFP is more effective than all contraceptive methods and as effective as most abortifacient methods. The maximum amount of abstinence required each month is about nine days using the most advanced methods of NFP. The only remaining concern voiced by most couples is the difficulty of learning a method of NFP.
   The simplest method of NFP is calendar rhythm. Couples need to determine the length of the longest and shortest menstrual cycles over the past 12 months. NFP instructors can quickly teach this method to country women in developing nations, even if they cannot read, because the concepts are very easy to explain.
   **The most complex and reliable method of natural family planning is the sympto-thermal method. Depending upon the instructor, this method will take up to 12 hours of careful study at first, and will require careful charting thereafter. It addition, if the woman's cycles are in any way atypical, some coaching or consulting with an experienced NFP practitioner will probably be required.**
   Simply assessing how difficult it is to learn NFP is only a small part of a proper analysis. NFP's great advantages over contraceptives and abortifacients (particularly the intangible benefits) must be carefully weighed.

So from your *personal *perspective, emmar… let’s reevaluate.
You were not using the “most complex and reliable method” (sympto-thermal)… you were using Billings (which works GREAT for MANY people… it’s just not the “most complex and reliable”)
Also, articles like this CLEARLY state, if “cycles are in any way atypical, some coaching or consulting with an experienced NFP practitioner will probably be required.”… hence suggesting that there are *exceptions *to the “typical” experience.

Yes, your personal experience (and many others) differed from this ideal/typical experience. That in no way suggests the methods are bad or that they do not come with the proper “warnings”…

 

[emmar]

Perhaps NFP is not such a burden when you aren’t an atypical case As to the fact that STD users have better effectivness rates, I cannot find any solid research to support that theory. Perhaps Marquette has a better chance than all other methods, BUT the family has to be able to have the money to afford to practice it.

 

[Schieffelin]

I agree that for some couples it does take more than 9 days of abstinence if you really need to be safe. I would say 14 days is a more accurate maximum.

Sympto-thermal is the way to go. I have several friends with irregular cycles and fertility problems and they have all been able to use it effectively.

 

[Em_in_FL]

Perhaps NFP is not such a burden when you aren’t an atypical case As to the fact that STD users have better effectivness rates, I cannot find any solid research to support that theory. Perhaps Marquette has a better chance than all other methods, BUT the family has to be able to have the money to afford to practice it.

It doesn’t say most “effective”, it says most “complex and reliable”… but complex implies that it is more challenging for many to use the method “perfectly”.
There are very valid reasons and medical conditions where couples find the mucous-only methods to be more effective *FOR THEM *(again, it’s about HOW you use it as well as what data you’re getting from that method).
(*Specifically *I’m speaking about those who suffer from PCOS have often found high effectiveness and ability to use the Creighton Model)…

I agree that for some couples it does take more than 9 days of abstinence if you really need to be safe. I would say 14 days is a more accurate maximum.

Sympto-thermal is the way to go. I have several friends with irregular cycles and fertility problems and they have all been able to use it effectively.

NFP is simply about statistics and risk evaluation.
Those who have a life/death situation regarding pregnancy WILL INDEED have to abstain more. Those who are the “typical” users of NFP who are simply trying to delay/postpone pregnancy are usually willing to evaluate their risk a little differently.

It’s just statistics based on a “normal” curve. Deviating from that normal curve will change all the statistics.

 

[emmar]

One of the supposed benefits of learning NFP is an ‘‘appreciation’’ of how the body works. However, from my and other’s experience the only thing NFP has done is teach me to hate my body and how it works. I think it’s different for those who have few days available, and this is not just post-partum. Anyone else find that NFP makes them hate their body?

 

[Dan_Daly]

I was happy to see the thread title and have a different take on how NFP has been dishonestly promoted.

Pre-Cana classes and other NFP classes that I have been to and have heard about from others, all spend about 2 seconds (if that) talking about WHEN you may use NFP to avoid pregnancy and an hour or hours talking about how to do it. The teacher talks about how “beautiful” and “great” NFP is.

The problem is that it’s not what the Church teaches.

NFP can only be used to try and avoid conception when there are grave reasons for the married couple to do so. So rather than being “great” it should be “grave”.

Most instruction on NFP teaches that it’s basically Catholic birth control which gets around the prohibition against contraception by means of a theological loopholes. The result is that many Catholics use it as exactly that- Catholic birth control- and avoid having children even though there is no grave reason for them to do so.

Pax and God Bless.

 

[Em_in_FL]

One of the supposed benefits of learning NFP is an ‘‘appreciation’’ of how the body works. However, from my and other’s experience the only thing NFP has done is teach me to hate my body and how it works. I think it’s different for those who have few days available, and this is not just post-partum. Anyone else find that NFP makes them hate their body?

I think it would be a logical conclusion that those who suffer from ANY bodily “abnormality” would dislike that abnormality.
But God didn’t cause you (or anyone else) to have an abnormal situation… just like He doesn’t cause bad things in this world to happen to anyone. Sin entering this world is the cause for everything that isn’t perfect.

God’s creation is good, though… “hating” God’s creation would be problematic from a spiritual standpoint.
NFP simply observes how fertility works… that’s it.

 

[Em_in_FL]

I was happy to see the thread title and have a different take on how NFP has been dishonestly promoted.

Pre-Cana classes and other NFP classes that I have been to and have heard about from others, all spend about 2 seconds (if that) talking about WHEN you may use NFP to avoid pregnancy and an hour or hours talking about how to do it. The teacher talks about how “beautiful” and “great” NFP is.

The problem is that it’s not what the Church teaches.

NFP can only be used to try and avoid conception when there are grave reasons for the married couple to do so. So rather than being “great” it should be “grave”.

Most instruction on NFP teaches that it’s basically Catholic birth control which gets around the prohibition against contraception by means of a theological loopholes. The result is that many Catholics use it as exactly that- Catholic birth control- and avoid having children even though there is no grave reason for them to do so.

Pax and God Bless.

With the caveat that depending on the writing “grave” can be substituted for “serious” or “just”…
I AGREE COMPLETELY!!

 

[emmar]

I think it would be a logical conclusion that those who suffer from ANY bodily “abnormality” would dislike that abnormality.
But God didn’t cause you (or anyone else) to have an abnormal situation… just like He doesn’t cause bad things in this world to happen to anyone. Sin entering this world is the cause for everything that isn’t perfect.

God’s creation is good, though… “hating” God’s creation would be problematic from a spiritual standpoint.
NFP simply observes how fertility works… that’s it.

I don’t believe God causes these problems, but NFP does not have all the answers either. When you really have “serious” reasons to avoid it becomes much more difficult when your cycles are not typical.

 

[samiam1611]

they shouldn’t have said maximum. that is misleading. they should say like, “if a person has a regular cycle and typical, predictable symptoms, and understands the method perfectly, the average number of days they need to abstain is 9.” or something like that.
they should not have said maximum if they wanted to be honest and up-front :dts:

 

[Em_in_FL]

I don’t believe God causes these problems, but NFP does not have all the answers either. When you really have “serious” reasons to avoid it becomes much more difficult when your cycles are not typical.

DING DING DING… read Dan’s post above.
It’s not *SUPPOSED *to be easy.
It’s a suffering… a cross to bear for many! But isn’t that the truth for almost everything that is good for our lives?
We have very “serious” reasons to avoid all sin (in general)… they aren’t always easy crosses to bear.

 

[Elizium23]

NFP can only be used to try and avoid conception when there are grave reasons for the married couple to do so. So rather than being “great” it should be “grave”.

Incorrect. The correct term is “just reason”.

“Grave reason” and “just reason” have very specific meanings which originate in Canon Law. “Grave” has the most extreme meaning of any modifier. Therefore, a “grave reason” to avoid pregnancy would be imminent danger of death. This is not the case and not what the Church teaches. The Catechism says.

2368 A particular aspect of this responsibility concerns the regulation of procreation. For just reasons, spouses may wish to space the births of their children. It is their duty to make certain that their desire is not motivated by selfishness but is in conformity with the generosity appropriate to responsible parenthood.

As you can see, a “just reason” is a less urgent criterion and it includes the desire to space out births in time.

 

[helplesspilgrim]

Firstly, sense a previous poster brought it up, my wife and I have a grave reason to use NFP; I would definitely say i feel lied to regarding NFP instruction in every aspect, effectiveness, abstinence requires, ease of use, and the supposed “closeness” that they like to promote. It’s very much the opposite of everything they said. After almost two years signs are still completely unreadable, once charts were determined to atypical we were shrugged off and have been ignored by our instructor; so ease of use was not true. This leads into length of abstinence, near perpetual due to hard to read signs. This leads to months of absistenence, until we cave once; setting off an absolute panic on if that one day we thought was okay was truly okay, causing depression, anxiety, and a few panic attacks. As far as effectiveness goes i don’t think i can speak to that very well when near celibate, but i have serious doubts.
Concerning how it makes it feel about our bodies. I feel like i have the plague and that I am a cotagion that is one wrong move from hurting my wife whom i love more than i thought possible; she feels like a science project, constantly checking this that and the other. This makes me feel guilty for even asking how the chart is going. She feels like a failure as a wife because we cant be together in that special way spouses, and only spouses, can be; and no amount of reassurance or love or talking to I can give her removes that feeling from her. It makes both of us feel woefully unattractive to the other, because your always restraining that touch, that fire, that burns for each other; even though you know it’s not true and you do desire each other and you want to share that amazing connection with each other sooo bad.

 

[Jennifer_J]

Firstly, sense a previous poster brought it up, my wife and I have a grave reason to use NFP; I would definitely say i feel lied to regarding NFP instruction in every aspect, effectiveness, abstinence requires, ease of use, and the supposed “closeness” that they like to promote. It’s very much the opposite of everything they said. After almost two years signs are still completely unreadable, once charts were determined to atypical we were shrugged off and have been ignored by our instructor; so ease of use was not true. This leads into length of abstinence, near perpetual due to hard to read signs. This leads to months of absistenence, until we cave once; setting off an absolute panic on if that one day we thought was okay was truly okay, causing depression, anxiety, and a few panic attacks. As far as effectiveness goes i don’t think i can speak to that very well when near celibate, but i have serious doubts.
Concerning how it makes it feel about our bodies. I feel like i have the plague and that I am a cotagion that is one wrong move from hurting my wife whom i love more than i thought possible; she feels like a science project, constantly checking this that and the other. This makes me feel guilty for even asking how the chart is going. She feels like a failure as a wife because we cant be together in that special way spouses, and only spouses, can be; and no amount of reassurance or love or talking to I can give her removes that feeling from her. It makes both of us feel woefully unattractive to the other, because your always restraining that touch, that fire, that burns for each other; even though you know it’s not true and you do desire each other and you want to share that amazing connection with each other sooo bad.

You don’t say what method you are using. Some methods work well for some women, while they don’t work as well for others. You might investigate a new method or find a new instructor. Even call the main ‘headquarters’ of your method for help. Find an NFP only doc.

Symptothermal: ccli.org or nfpandmore.com
Medical standardized Mucous only: creightonmodel.com
Mucous only: boma-usa.org or woomb.org
Adding ovulation kits to STM: nfpmarquette.edu

NFP doctor locator: your diocese family life office or onemoresoul.com

 

[ryecroft]

I think it would be a logical conclusion that those who suffer from ANY bodily “abnormality” would dislike that abnormality.
But God didn’t cause you (or anyone else) to have an abnormal situation… just like He doesn’t cause bad things in this world to happen to anyone. Sin entering this world is the cause for everything that isn’t perfect.

God’s creation is good, though… “hating” God’s creation would be problematic from a spiritual standpoint.
NFP simply observes how fertility works… that’s it.

O.K. - I’m going to pull out my own personal situation here and call myself abnormal as I have kidney disease and this can lead to differing things occuring with my body. We have tried multiple different ways of NFP and have come to the conclusion that NFP is just not something that will work for us - yes we have been to NFP classes, consultants and even got with “the” Institute- unfortuanately it seems it was always “let’s try this…” unfortunately, the only way we find out if NFP is working (in order to keep from getting pregnant) is if you don’t become pregnant - the way you find out it’s NOT working is if you do become pregnant…
But one thing I’m really having trouble with with regards to NFP is that I hear about this wonderful 99% effective rate, but from my acquaintances (people I actually know, not people on here telling me things), esepecially those at many of the parishes we’ve been at (we moved around often)- we constantly hear about friends and couples for whome NFP has NOT worked in order to prevent pregnancy. The response that seems to make some people very mad is that(and again people I know not people I’ve only spoken to on here) - is the response “well I guess God just decided it was time for you to get pregnant” - (these are people who have gone to classes, kept up with the people that taught them, chart and in some cases even get certain types of machines to help them keep up with their fertility and ovulation so there is NO question if they are “unsure” of what their body is doing).
I have to wonder, really how this “effective rate” of NFP is gotten at- I have never seen an NFP study that said “effective rate of those using NFP to prevent pregnancy or space out children” - it’s always just NFP. It also seems to me (again my perception) that many of the comments on here when we’re talking about NFP on here is that if someone doesn’t become pregnant and they’re trying to avoid, then it’s working but at the same time if they’re trying to avoid becoming pregnant and do become pregnant then it’s “all in God’s plan…” - my problem is this, if you really believe that it’s “God’s Plan” (which I have no doubt that He can make happen whatever He wants regardless of NFP or the pill or whatever)- then why even try at times?
I just wish I could feel better about NFP - my best friend was using NFP - religiously and is now wewll along into another pregnancy where she feels NFP failed her and her husband - now she’s to the point of wanting her tubes tied and I honestly can’t blame her. She feels she can’t trust NFP any longer and I understand why she feels this way.

God Bless
Rye

 

[Em_in_FL]

Firstly, sense a previous poster brought it up, my wife and I have a grave reason to use NFP; I would definitely say i feel lied to regarding NFP instruction in every aspect, effectiveness, abstinence requires, ease of use, and the supposed “closeness” that they like to promote. It’s very much the opposite of everything they said. After almost two years signs are still completely unreadable, once charts were determined to atypical we were shrugged off and have been ignored by our instructor; so ease of use was not true. This leads into length of abstinence, near perpetual due to hard to read signs. This leads to months of absistenence, until we cave once; setting off an absolute panic on if that one day we thought was okay was truly okay, causing depression, anxiety, and a few panic attacks. As far as effectiveness goes i don’t think i can speak to that very well when near celibate, but i have serious doubts.
Concerning how it makes it feel about our bodies. I feel like i have the plague and that I am a cotagion that is one wrong move from hurting my wife whom i love more than i thought possible; she feels like a science project, constantly checking this that and the other. This makes me feel guilty for even asking how the chart is going. She feels like a failure as a wife because we cant be together in that special way spouses, and only spouses, can be; and no amount of reassurance or love or talking to I can give her removes that feeling from her. It makes both of us feel woefully unattractive to the other, because your always restraining that touch, that fire, that burns for each other; even though you know it’s not true and you do desire each other and you want to share that amazing connection with each other sooo bad.

First… I know there are certainly permanent situations out there that cannot be accounted for or worked with or fixed… those are very challenging situations that require nothing less that completely throwing yourselves at the foot of the cross in prayer.

However, you did not indicate that you have taken active steps to try to find alternatives or fixes to your particular situation. If you did take these steps, I’m sorry you’re struggling… but if you didn’t - why in the world would you allow this situation to persist???

If MY instructor shrugged me off, I’d find a new one.
If that one didn’t work, I’d search for another method.
If that one didn’t help me find answers I’d find a specialist physician who could help me determine exactly what was “wrong” with my fertility… etc, etc…
LOTS of hard and PERSISTENT work in order to be together. I KNOW that being together in that special marital union is WORTH THE EFFORT!!!

2 years of unreadable signs? Dude, I would have thrown my arms up in frustration and found ANSWERS a lot sooner than that!.. I’m MOTIVATED!

My point is… don’t “blame” NFP. Find the right method that works for you. Find the underlying REASONS for why that original method wasn’t working. Don’t just give up and blame the church or NFP…

 

[helplesspilgrim]

Jennifer,

We started using billings, when that didn’t work we called the institute, i think it was woomba(sp?). They looked at our chart and couldn’t figure it out and said “you should consider being celibate or just have kids and not worry about it” what part of “medically grave reason, fetus dying, deformity, mothers health ruined” do they not understand, next was STM, again didn’t work, temp tells us nothing, too erratic with wifes meds; and it sill relies on mucus being the primary symptom, temp is only a cross check. If billings doesnt work STM is unlikely, creighton also relies on mucus, though criteria is different, still unable to determine peaks, monitor methods also require mucus checks with monitor as cross ref, so again that doesn’t work.

 

[emmar]

I agree with Rye the only way you can tell if an NFP method works is to try and and then when it fails you end up pregnant! Just glad to know I’m not the only one NFP has failed for.

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

Firstly, sense a previous poster brought it up, my wife and I have a grave reason to use NFP; I would definitely say i feel lied to regarding NFP instruction in every aspect, effectiveness, abstinence requires, ease of use, and the supposed “closeness” that they like to promote. It’s very much the opposite of everything they said. After almost two years signs are still completely unreadable, once charts were determined to atypical we were shrugged off and have been ignored by our instructor; so ease of use was not true. This leads into length of abstinence, near perpetual due to hard to read signs. This leads to months of absistenence, until we cave once; setting off an absolute panic on if that one day we thought was okay was truly okay, causing depression, anxiety, and a few panic attacks. As far as effectiveness goes i don’t think i can speak to that very well when near celibate, but i have serious doubts.
Concerning how it makes it feel about our bodies. I feel like i have the plague and that I am a cotagion that is one wrong move from hurting my wife whom i love more than i thought possible; she feels like a science project, constantly checking this that and the other. This makes me feel guilty for even asking how the chart is going. She feels like a failure as a wife because we cant be together in that special way spouses, and only spouses, can be; and no amount of reassurance or love or talking to I can give her removes that feeling from her. It makes both of us feel woefully unattractive to the other, because your always restraining that touch, that fire, that burns for each other; even though you know it’s not true and you do desire each other and you want to share that amazing connection with each other sooo bad.

You aren’t alone in this. Couples that practice NFP certainly aren’t typical of the anecdotal testimonals NFP supporters use as their “facts.”

1. Married couples I know using NFP report that is has created a sense of rejection, fear, and resentment in their marriage since sex is almost always accompanied by fear.
2. Men start to hate their wife’s natural cycle, rather than respect it. Women start hating their own bodies.
3. Unless couples already have GREAT communication, NFP usually tears the marriage down, rather than build it up.
4. Effectiveness reported is highly inaccurate. Every couple I know who uses NFP have had more than 1 unplanned pregnancy.

See, NFP is promoted by the church. That’s excellent, but it needs to be reported fairly. It NEEDS to stop being heralded as this “marriage saving birth control.” It’s not. It’s not even effective at avoiding pregnancy for very long. It’s a cross and a suffering and something that will either make a stronger marriage, or rip it to shreds. It needs to be put forward as the yoke and suffering of following Christ’s commands. At least if it is advertised as it IS rather than not being up-front with people and saying it’s this magical wonderful thing, then maybe married couples going into it will have a better chance of shouldering the pain of it. Rather than feeling ashamed and alone in their suffering and worrying that they are doing something wrong, getting mad at each other and destroying their relationship over it, they’ll accept it as the pain and hardship that it is.