Protestant Forum I Checked Out

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From what I read, I think so. If they follow Charles Spurgeon- he was calvinist.
 
Hope1960, I’m all in favor of satisfying curiosity of other faiths (see, I’m here!) and I certainly understand wanting any church to address ones needs.

The one thing that stands out to me about any church that has all these media bells and whistles and a fog machine is the amount of money being directed to these experiences. I understand the marketing idea of “more parishioners means larger funds to work with” but it makes me so sad to realize that this money could be used in so many other ways. I’m sure this church also has outreach and charities but I still see this large chunk of change going to entertain the parishioners rather than being used to feed the destitute.

I don’t go to any church but I do know that if I saw the display of money being used to entertain me rather than helping more needy people than they already are, it would turn my stomach. I’d ask if Jesus really wanted to be worshiped this way or would He rather we feed more hungry?
 
OMGosh, you really do have a good point that I’d never considered.
I would like to add, though, this church isn’t a mega-church or very large, just in case I’ve given that impression.
 
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I honestly don’t know numbers, but I know they were pretty high just in Ireland. To reference two of the more notorious periods of Anglo-Irish history - In the mid 1600 s Oliver Cromwell passed a series of penal laws against Catholics and confiscated large amounts of their lands, The Parliamentarian reconquest of Ireland was brutal and Cromwell is still a hated figure in Ireland. The impact of the war on the Irish population was severe. The war resulted in famine worsened by bubonic plague. The article says that the drop in the Irish population from the parliamentarian campaign was estimated from 15% - 83% Catholics were slaughtered in the tens of thousands in the 1640 s and 1650 s by Cromwell’s forces. All Catholic landowners were hounded out of Ulster, which prior to that had been known as the most Catholic part of Ireland.
Fast forward to the mid 1800 s. Ireland was still ruled by its neighbour Britain, which was the world’s wealthiest nation. Why was Ireland not better able to deal with the potato famine of 1845-1848. The British Govt. could have prohibited the export of grain from Ireland during these years when there was little food. In 1848 the Govt. could have taken steps to insure that imported food was distributed where the greatest need was. A soup-kitchen scheme was discontinued. This was done to keep expences down and to promote greater self reliance among the Irish poor. There was mass eviction of families from their homes. As many as 500000 ppl were evicted between 1846-1854. Under British rule Irish grain was exported while Irish Catholics continued to die from starvation. This happened as a result of deep dyed ethnic prejudice against the Catholic Irish.
 
In a way, that makes it worse!

A megachurch has much more funds to distribute amongst charities and entertainment. A small church will need to use a larger percentage of the collections for the entertainment. Please think on this and the uses of this churches collection plate.
 
Pattylt said:
In a way, that makes it worse!

A megachurch has much more funds to distribute amongst charities and entertainment. A small church will need to use a larger percentage of the collections for the entertainment. Please think on this and the uses of this churches collection plate.
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Well, I am happy to say that I only gave them $2.00
and didn’t buy anything in the cafe.

They don’t have collection plates but instead use these boxes that are set up around the church, lobby and maybe cafe, and you put your money in those.
They also have something like my Catholic Church has, where you can donate online or however it’s done.
 
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Most likely. My Presbyterian friends are Calvinist. Also, Reformed Baptists are Calvinist as well. However, there a different kinds of Calvinists, like 5-pointers who hold to all of TULIP or 4-point Calvinists who deny L or Limited Atonement. I’m considering opening up a new thread on TULIP itself.
 
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You are preaching to the choir. 😉 Most Calvinist doctrines fall apart after a little scrutiny. But Calvinist’s have a lot of pride. Imagine if YOU were in the closed club of the elect and a Catholic tried to show you that, well, you are only as special as the rest of us lol. Which, you and I know is indeed very special! God loves each of us - each of His creation - with an everlasting unfathomable love.

The Free Will verses Grace argument has been going on the centuries. ( Hence the play on words for the TV show, “Will & Grace”. ) The “Grace” side says there is no free will.
 
Rev12Mary said:
Imagine if YOU were in the closed club of the elect and a Catholic tried to show you that, well, you are only as special as the rest of us lol.
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I’ve come to the conclusion it is the desire to be ‘special’ that can make cults seem so attractive.
 
Pattylt said:
Hope1960, I’m all in favor of satisfying curiosity of other faiths (see, I’m here!) and I certainly understand wanting any church to address ones needs.

The one thing that stands out to me about any church that has all these media bells and whistles and a fog machine is the amount of money being directed to these experiences. I understand the marketing idea of “more parishioners means larger funds to work with” but it makes me so sad to realize that this money could be used in so many other ways. I’m sure this church also has outreach and charities but I still see this large chunk of change going to entertain the parishioners rather than being used to feed the destitute.

I don’t go to any church but I do know that if I saw the display of money being used to entertain me rather than helping more needy people than they already are, it would turn my stomach. I’d ask if Jesus really wanted to be worshiped this way or would He rather we feed more hungry?
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I don’t like the entertainment types of churches that much either and I agree with your thoughts about worshipping that way. I feel the same way though about the ostentatious churches and cathedrals I have been in with fancy windows and statues, relics etc. Worldwide I would be willing to bet there is more money wrapped up in these things than in the fog churches.
 
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Wannano said:
I feel the same way though about the ostentatious churches and cathedrals I have been in with fancy windows and statues, relics etc. Worldwide I would be willing to bet there is more money wrapped up in these things than in the fog churches.
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those ornate churches kept people employed. Any town lucky enough to have a cathedral benefited far beyond the cost of the construction.
 
I watched the series “Pillars of the Earth” recently. Although fiction and probably historically inaccurate, those people didn’t benefit much compared to what happened by building that Cathedral.

But hey, its fiction. Still makes one think… or “should” make one think a bit further…
 
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Many would argue that there is no corrective authority even inside Catholicism.
 
Of course! And it has been this way from the beginning which is why we say - all divisions in the church stem from authorty.

Peace!!!
 
I like reading some of the Protestant forums too, bcs there are some fine minds on there and some good viewpoints. However, I’ve learned to not speak up, ever, bcs even though I love them, they do NOT love me back. I made the mistake once of revealing I was Catholic, thinking I was amongst fellow Christians, and the kind of swearing and damning me to hell was like nothing anyone had ever said to me. This did NOT convince me they were in the right.
 
Yeah, that’s for sure. Sometimes, I get where they’re coming from. When you think your opponent is part of the Anti-Church, with pope as the Anti-Christ, all sorts of qualms can and do arise. Also, many of these people, usually even the more well-intentioned, hold onto these little soundbite arguments, like: You Catholics work your way into Heaven, you Catholics worship Mary, you Catholics add to the finished work of Christ, ect. Unfortunately, most of these anti-Catholics aren’t much for a fruitful dialogue because of all their misunderstandings and deeply-ingrained prejudices.
 
vsedriver said:
those ornate churches kept people employed. Any town lucky enough to have a cathedral benefited far beyond the cost of the construction.
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There is something to be said of the societies that built those old cathedrals, just like there is something to be said of a society where their stadiums are the centerpiece of their communities. Visiting sites in European cities would usually include a visit to the cathedral, showcasing the apex of architecture and art for its time.
 
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