Protestants and our lady of Guadalupe

[Peter_J]

But, we don’t pray to Washington (meaning we don’t pray to him, not meaning his statue, as we know you aren’t praying to statues). I have no problem with statues of saints at all; I find them beautiful and good reminders.

Oh, okay. (It can be hard to keep track of which protestant has a problem with what.)

 

[dronald]

Oh, okay. (It can be hard to keep track of which protestant has a problem with what.)

I agree with the other poster. Statues aren’t a bad thing, they’re just confusing to those who have prayed to God without the inspiration of statues.

I think it’s a, “fear what you don’t understand” thing.

 

[Peter_J]

I agree with the other poster. Statues aren’t a bad thing, they’re just confusing to those who have prayed to God without the inspiration of statues.

Well, I don’t know about that; but it certainly is confusing when certain protestant groups (such as yours, I believe) say they are fine with statues but never have any.

 

[dronald]

Well, I don’t know about that; but it certainly is confusing when certain protestant groups (such as yours, I believe) say they are fine with statues but never have any.

Because it’s fine either way.

 

[Kliska]

Well, I don’t know about that; but it certainly is confusing when certain protestant groups (such as yours, I believe) say they are fine with statues but never have any.

Some are fine with them, but don’t want to even provide the opportunity for them to be misused, or misunderstood.

 

[aidanbradypop]

Some are fine with them, but don’t want to even provide the opportunity for them to be misused, or misunderstood.

For me, a statue is no different in a parish than having a picture of Christ hanging on the wall at the Baptist church I attended as a child.

 

[EvangelCatholic]

Again, there are different approaches among so-called “Protestants” on religious art. A crucifix and/ or statue of Christ, St Mary and apostles/ saints are common in Lutheran and Episcopal churches. Both have parishes that may have more statues then even found in a typical Roman Catholic churches. Both Lutheran and Episcopal churches may have candles and flowers under a statue. But it is less common to see a Lutheran/ Episcopalian kneeling/ praying before a statue of a saint than a figure of Christ.

 

[aidanbradypop]

we are completely off topic.

 

[Nicea325]

Some are fine with them, but don’t want to even provide the opportunity for them to be misused, or misunderstood.

Do think believe Protestants feels the same about every non-religious statue around this country? How about at D.C.?

 

[Kliska]

Do think believe Protestants feels the same about every non-religious statue around this country? How about at D.C.?

Yeah, us nutty Protestants.

 

[Kliska]

For me, a statue is no different in a parish than having a picture of Christ hanging on the wall at the Baptist church I attended as a child.

I don’t really care for those either, but that is a more a aesthetic call than anything else. On the serious side, you don’t really see anyone bowing before a painting of Christ in a Baptist church. Remember there are many protestants that want to avoid even an appearance of anything that even may be a no-no.

For me, this has always been a question of conscience and use. If one does it with no qualms, and doesn’t bow down to it as an actual object of worship, I see no problems with statues, or images.

 

[EvangelCatholic]

I don’t really care for those either, but that is a more a aesthetic call than anything else. On the serious side, you don’t really see anyone bowing before a painting of Christ in a Baptist church. Remember there are many protestants that want to avoid even an appearance of anything that even may be a no-no.

For me, this has always been a question of conscience and use. If one does it with no qualms, and doesn’t bow down to it as an actual object of worship, I see no problems with statues, or images.

Catholics [and now I am using the broader term to include Anglicans & Lutherans] do bow in church to the altar since it represents Christ. The altar has small crosses at each corner and one in the middle to represent the Five Holy Wounds of Jesus. No one is bowing to the structure of an altar but to Christ since He comes to us in the Eucharist. We also may bow when the processional cross passes by since it is the very image of Christ. If you believe Christ is really Presence than it is common to show adoration and awe.

 

[pablope]

Catholics [and now I am using the broader term to include Anglicans & Lutherans] do bow in church to the altar since it represents Christ. The altar has small crosses at each corner and one in the middle to represent the Five Holy Wounds of Jesus. No one is bowing to the structure of an altar but to Christ since He comes to us in the Eucharist. We also may bow when the processional cross passes by since it is the very image of Christ. If you believe Christ is really Presence than it is common to show adoration and awe.

And kneel or genuflect…

 

[aidanbradypop]

Catholics [and now I am using the broader term to include Anglicans & Lutherans] do bow in church to the altar since it represents Christ. The altar has small crosses at each corner and one in the middle to represent the Five Holy Wounds of Jesus. No one is bowing to the structure of an altar but to Christ since He comes to us in the Eucharist. We also may bow when the processional cross passes by since it is the very image of Christ. If you believe Christ is really Presence than it is common to show adoration and awe.

We genuflect toward the altar as we enter and depart, and also as the processional cross passes by.

 

[Eric_Hilbert]

we are completely off topic.

Good point.
Lets get back to it.

 

[PRmerger]

The belief that she does not receive all of our petitions is only based on our belief that she’s not omnipotent;

If she has any “potency” or “power” it is that which Her Son gives her.

Just as St. Paul gives himself the “omnipotent” ability to declare that he can save others (see Romans 11:14 and 1 Cor 9:22), so too could you declare Mary “omnipotent” to effect your prayer intentions. (And here I do mean “effect”, not “affect”).

 

[PRmerger]

I don’t really care for those either, but that is a more a aesthetic call than anything else. On the serious side, you don’t really see anyone bowing before a painting of Christ in a Baptist church.

But I do see Baptists bowing before or kissing the Bible.

I would never construe that as a Baptist worshipping the Bible.

 

[Randy_Carson]

Hence a difference between us and them. It’s partly that difference that we need to pay attention to. We choose to focus on God alone in the Spiritual realm, while still celebrating an honoring the memory and stories of those saints that have beaten us there.

And those in heaven are focused on worshiping God alone while still remembering the saints who are running the race here on earth. They are our cheering section, rooting for us, interceding for us, that we might win the prize, also.

But, we don’t pray to Washington (meaning we don’t pray to him, not meaning his statue, as we know you aren’t praying to statues).

Agreed. But I wonder if any President has ever sat in the Oval Office facing a national crisis and seeing a bust of Washington or portrait of Lincoln said, “Well, sir, what would you do in this situation?”

 

[aidanbradypop]

And those in heaven are focused on worshiping God alone while still remembering the saints who are running the race here on earth. They are our cheering section, rooting for us, interceding for us, that we might win the prize, also.

Agreed. But I wonder if any President has ever sat in the Oval Office facing a national crisis and seeing a bust of Washington or portrait of Lincoln said, “Well, sir, what would you do in this situation?”

I believe many will either like or dislike the idea of statues. Nothing will change their mind I believe. The statue is the fence and you are either on one side or the other.

The thread is about Our Lady of Guadalupe. That can be really hard for a Protestant to get their mind around. They see it as taking away from the ministry of Christ. Some even believe it is a hoax or something created by the Church (CARM) lol. Statues will not win the hearts of the masses but maybe a better understanding of the Blessed Mother and how she desires our love for her Son may.

 

[Kliska]

But I do see Baptists bowing before or kissing the Bible.

So do I, and I actually have issues with how some Christians seem to turn the physical copy of the Bible into something to worship or even become superstitious about it.

I would never construe that as a Baptist worshipping the Bible.

I might.

And those in heaven are focused on worshiping God alone while still remembering the saints who are running the race here on earth. They are our cheering section, rooting for us, interceding for us, that we might win the prize, also.

I would tacitly agree to that, but that’s not a problem for anyone I don’t think.

Agreed. But I wonder if any President has ever sat in the Oval Office facing a national crisis and seeing a bust of Washington or portrait of Lincoln said, “Well, sir, what would you do in this situation?”

But we would both agree that isn’t the same thing as what happens when asking intercession from a Saint.

The thread is about Our Lady of Guadalupe. That can be really hard for a Protestant to get their mind around. They see it as taking away from the ministry of Christ. Some even believe it is a hoax or something created by the Church (CARM) lol. Statues will not win the hearts of the masses but maybe a better understanding of the Blessed Mother and how she desires our love for her Son may.

In a weird way, I think many of my protestant brothers and sisters would see something like the Lady of Guadalupe as a type of red herring (please don’t take offense, I’m using it as a logical term). What I mean is we tend to believe to approach God directly in all circumstances, and not to go a round about route.