Protestants listen up

[rinnie]

Paul did not say to reconcile with any church but to Christ. That is what the ministry of reconciliation is all about. We are to reconcile sinners to Christ. God does not give any one the power to bind or loose. What we are doing is making a declaration of what is done already in Heaven. The church is to declare the judgment of heaven based on the principles of God’s Word, they can be sure heaven is in accord. In other words whatever they “bind or loose on earth is already bound or loosed in heaven.” We are just making a declaration, not actually binding or loosing anyone from their sins.

yes he did. Who do you think the CHurch is. Jesus Christ is the church you cannot separate them!

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

I don’t know how many times I have given you scriptures to support my statements. If you don’t believe them then don’t respond. But you are just wasting time. Move on to someone else or go to another thread.

You said you were trying to understand confession and I responded with the post you quoted. You did not address the response at all. Instead, you’ve asked me to move on or leave the thread? It appears you cannot explain the non-scriptural beliefs you follow or the scriptural explanations given for Catholic beliefs.

I have provided verses with explanations. You simply reject them without discussion. When you have provided scriptures, you fail to address our refutation or explanation of how we interpret the scriptures. Catholics have given many examples of reading scriptures with other scriptures. That’s something I haven’t seen from you and others yet. Some Protestants use single verses, or pieces of verses, with additions of things clearly not written.

When you compare the scriptures you provided against the scriptures Catholics have provided, you fail to address a clear contradiction of scriptures.

Just as you reject our interpretations, we reject yours, and even though we feel you are wasting time we haven’t told you to move on or go to another thread. It seems to lack charitability, in my opinion.

I will continue to put up the Catholic perspective to prevent anyone reading through to accept non-scriptural arguments of sola scriptura, self-ordination, private interpretation and to show that Catholic beliefs come from an interpretation of scriptures and are not man-made traditions as some accuse. I am quite comfortable with the Catholic explanations on these threads and the fact that the arguments speak for themselves.

 

[almightyservant]

Are all beleivers the arc of the New Covenant?

I guess a personal opinion could be given, but I don’t see the benefit of the particular opinion to be useful in this thread. Why not just focus on what has been revealed through Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture?

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Are all beleivers the arc of the New Covenant?

The arc of the covenant was the place where God Himself dwelled. Mary carried Jesus within her womb. She was the arc of the new covenant. Believers are members of the body of Christ, which is the Church. By free will we dwell within or outside the body of Christ.

 

[ppasa316]

You said you were trying to understand confession and I responded with the post you quoted. You did not address the response at all. Instead, you’ve asked me to move on or leave the thread? It appears you cannot explain the non-scriptural beliefs you follow or the scriptural explanations given for Catholic beliefs.

I have provided verses with explanations. You simply reject them without discussion. When you have provided scriptures, you fail to address our refutation or explanation of how we interpret the scriptures. Catholics have given many examples of reading scriptures with other scriptures. That’s something I haven’t seen from you and others yet. Some Protestants use single verses, or pieces of verses, with additions of things clearly not written.

When you compare the scriptures you provided against the scriptures Catholics have provided, you fail to address a clear contradiction of scriptures.

Just as you reject our interpretations, we reject yours, and even though we feel you are wasting time we haven’t told you to move on or go to another thread. It seems to lack charitability, in my opinion.

I will continue to put up the Catholic perspective to prevent anyone reading through to accept non-scriptural arguments of sola scriptura, self-ordination, private interpretation and to show that Catholic beliefs come from an interpretation of scriptures and are not man-made traditions as some accuse. I am quite comfortable with the Catholic explanations on these threads and the fact that the arguments speak for themselves.

I am not talking to all but you seem to continue with the same issuses we have already discussed. Like I said I have already provided you scriptures and you rejected them. But if you want to continue going round and round go ahead. As a former Catholic I will continue to provide scriptures to others.:thumbsup:Like I said if you want to go round and round lets do it because i feel some of these interpretations that you give are false. As a Christian i will continue to expose them.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

I am not talking to all but you seem to continue with the same issuses we have already discussed. Like I said I have already provided you scriptures and you rejected them. But if you want to continue going round and round go ahead. As a former Catholic I will continue to provide scriptures to others.:thumbsup:Like I said if you want to go round and round lets do it because i feel some of these interpretations that you give are false. As a Christian i will continue to expose them.

Ok, but your statement brings me to ask you to please show the scriptures that give you the infallible authority over interpretation of scriptures and “expose” those that you consider false. Most Catholics here are not going to drink the kool-aid of any individual until they can do so.

See ppasa316, there are many Christian denominations that claim Holy Spirit guidance on interpretations, yet they disagree. This leaves us to discern the conflicting interpretations and contradictions. As one who believes Christ is with His Church, it’s hard for me to understand the individualism some claim with Holy Spirit guidance, especially in light of the disagreements between them. We trust our salvation to interpretations. One will have to, logically and spiritually, convince me that they truly have the correct interpretation to talk me away from what I believe is His Church. So far no one has come close.

Upon reflecting on the conflicts and contradictions, I believe the “essentials”, that many Protestants use to describe a unity between them and Catholics, is from the Holy Spirit because it is one truth all agree on. Of course this leaves me to believe that the “non-essentials” cannot be from the Holy Spirit, as I do not believe he would give us different answers of truth that conflict and contradict each other. That is chaos and I don’t believe God is chaos or confusion. This is one reason I cannot believe that God would leave His inspired word to be interpreted privately by each and everyone of us. I believe He did give us an authority, but some refuse to submit to more authority than they want too. One seems to be obedient and the other seems to be obedient as long as it’s convenient to their lifestyle.

You offer being a “former Catholic” as if it’s supposed to convince us. I am a “former Protestant”, who converted in 1985, after 29 years of being raised a Protestant. Does my personal conversion convince you in anyway? I don’t imagine it does, but offer it to give an example of how your conversion is perceived by Catholics.

So as you say, when you present a scriptural argument, I and other Catholics will be there to “expose” them for what we believe they are, which is another Gospel than the one we’ve been taught.

By the way, in your latest post you again failed to address the explanation provided for your request to try and understand confession.

 

[racing59]

I am not talking to all but you seem to continue with the same issuses we have already discussed. Like I said I have already provided you scriptures and you rejected them. But if you want to continue going round and round go ahead. As a former Catholic I will continue to provide scriptures to others.:thumbsup:Like I said if you want to go round and round lets do it because i feel some of these interpretations that you give are false. As a Christian i will continue to expose them.

I’m getting dizzy reading this thread.:whacky:

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

I’m getting dizzy reading this thread.:whacky:

While the CATholic’s away, the mice will play. I’m just trying to catch up. :knight2:

Let me know if you get too dizzy. :stretcher:

 

[po18guy]

The first claim is that no one searching for the truth is lead away from the Catholic Church then you claim that if you were lead away from the Catholic Church it was Satan that did it----hogwash.

OK, so does the Holy Spirit lead to division? Impossible, as the Holy Spirit is unity itself. It is the demon who divides us by appealing to our egos and by planting dissension. At some level, the demon is behind all heresy. Satan’s greatest deception was when he convinced some of us that he does not exist.

 

[racing59]

While the CATholic’s away, the mice will play. I’m just trying to catch up. :knight2:

Let me know if you get too dizzy. :stretcher:

That’s a good one Prodigal Humor is good for the soul.I’ve been reading your Scriptures you post and you present a very good argument.I can see where you are coming from. You have done an excellent job supporting your beliefs.
Peace

 

[1beleevr]

Hi, rinnie; are we trying your patience? You know, if you truly had the Peace of Christ, you could smile, and wade through all of these annoying posts, from non-catholics! Let’s see, where do I start; in Mark 1:4, who does Mark say those, who were being baptized, turned to for forgiveness? I’m like some other non-catholics; I haven’t found anything in the sayings of Christ, that tell us Christians to confess sins to a priest? I do see in 1John 1:9, that he says(John), For IF we confess our sins unto HIM, He is faithful to forgive us, and cleanse us of all wickedness:thumbsup:And I can’t speak for all non-catholics, but I do not believe that IF we confess our sins to each other(James 5:16), that they are forgiven! only God can forgive sins. If I share with fellow Christians, about a sin, it is to receive mercy, and support, instead of judgement or condemnation! But usually, by the time I confess a sin to a fellow believer, I have already confessed to God! I should have actually said that Jesus is my middle man; He pleads my case before the Father, when I enter the throneroom of grace! And I think as far as the topic of the crucifix, or no crucifix, we are now beginning to beat a “horse”, that appears to be on life support You believe in wearing a crucifix, I do not! The empty Cross to me, shouts V-I-C-T-O-R-Y!!! Every time I see it, it reminds me that my Saviour defeated death, and sin! We are no longer slaves to sin, and have victory over death! But, if it is the doctrine of the catholic church, to wear a crucifix, or to have one displayed in the sanctuary, then that is their choice! You do not have the authority to tell others, that they have no unity with the Cross, because they choose not to wear a crucifix:thumbsup:

 

[rinnie]

I am not talking to all but you seem to continue with the same issuses we have already discussed. Like I said I have already provided you scriptures and you rejected them. But if you want to continue going round and round go ahead. As a former Catholic I will continue to provide scriptures to others.:thumbsup:Like I said if you want to go round and round lets do it because i feel some of these interpretations that you give are false. As a Christian i will continue to expose them.

But the problem is on what authority do you go by to reject the teachings of the Catholic Church. If you say that you are a Catholic and you left the Catholic Faith your soul is in grave danger.

 

[CWBetts]

Hi, rinnie; are we trying your patience? You know, if you truly had the Peace of Christ, you could smile, and wade through all of these annoying posts, from non-catholics! Let’s see, where do I start; in Mark 1:4, who does Mark say those, who were being baptized, turned to for forgiveness? I’m like some other non-catholics; I haven’t found anything in the sayings of Christ, that tell us Christians to confess sins to a priest? I do see in 1John 1:9, that he says(John), For IF we confess our sins unto HIM, He is faithful to forgive us, and cleanse us of all wickedness:thumbsup:And I can’t speak for all non-catholics, but I do not believe that IF we confess our sins to each other(James 5:16), that they are forgiven! only God can forgive sins. If I share with fellow Christians, about a sin, it is to receive mercy, and support, instead of judgement or condemnation! But usually, by the time I confess a sin to a fellow believer, I have already confessed to God! I should have actually said that Jesus is my middle man; He pleads my case before the Father, when I enter the throneroom of grace! And I think as far as the topic of the crucifix, or no crucifix, we are now beginning to beat a “horse”, that appears to be on life support You believe in wearing a crucifix, I do not! The empty Cross to me, shouts V-I-C-T-O-R-Y!!! Every time I see it, it reminds me that my Saviour defeated death, and sin! We are no longer slaves to sin, and have victory over death! But, if it is the doctrine of the catholic church, to wear a crucifix, or to have one displayed in the sanctuary, then that is their choice! You do not have the authority to tell others, that they have no unity with the Cross, because they choose not to wear a crucifix:thumbsup:

Who are you?!? If you choose to elevate a torture device used to crucivy untold thousands, that is your choice! I choose to display the cross that displays the very reason we are Christian. But as a Protestant Fundamentalist, I wouldn’t expect you to understand. Easter for you is a day.For us it is a season. From Holy Thursday to Pentacost, we celebrate Christ’s victory over sin. Fundamentalists dress up for a sunday, and it is back to business as usual on monday. You ignore the period of penance and fasting in prparation for Easter, you ignore the bulk of Easter, you ignore the preparation for the coming of the Savior (Advent). You ignore the saints, you ignore the role of the Blessed Virgin Mary, you ignore the feasts dedicated to various aspects of Christ’s life (Epiphany, for example). Instead you elevate an inantimate object, a book, as worthy of worship. You never look to the living breathing Body of Christ, the Church, for direction, but only the Bible, which is admittedly incomplete. There is nothing about how the Church should conduct itself, or even anything as basic as the order of service to be found there. Or even anything about dispalying any cross (with or without corpus). Yet you conveniently ignore the fact that it is the Church that is the pillar and bulwark of truth. And you have the nerve to come to a CAtholic forum, and tell us that we don’t know how to worship, and your church in its few short years of existance is more holy than the 2000 year old Catholic Church. That is why we get aggrivated. FUndamentalist hubris.

 

[rinnie]

Hi, rinnie; are we trying your patience? You know, if you truly had the Peace of Christ, you could smile, and wade through all of these annoying posts, from non-catholics! Let’s see, where do I start; in Mark 1:4, who does Mark say those, who were being baptized, turned to for forgiveness? I’m like some other non-catholics; I haven’t found anything in the sayings of Christ, that tell us Christians to confess sins to a priest? I do see in 1John 1:9, that he says(John), For IF we confess our sins unto HIM, He is faithful to forgive us, and cleanse us of all wickedness:thumbsup:And I can’t speak for all non-catholics, but I do not believe that IF we confess our sins to each other(James 5:16), that they are forgiven! only God can forgive sins. If I share with fellow Christians, about a sin, it is to receive mercy, and support, instead of judgement or condemnation! But usually, by the time I confess a sin to a fellow believer, I have already confessed to God! I should have actually said that Jesus is my middle man; He pleads my case before the Father, when I enter the throneroom of grace! And I think as far as the topic of the crucifix, or no crucifix, we are now beginning to beat a “horse”, that appears to be on life support You believe in wearing a crucifix, I do not! The empty Cross to me, shouts V-I-C-T-O-R-Y!!! Every time I see it, it reminds me that my Saviour defeated death, and sin! We are no longer slaves to sin, and have victory over death! But, if it is the doctrine of the catholic church, to wear a crucifix, or to have one displayed in the sanctuary, then that is their choice! You do not have the authority to tell others, that they have no unity with the Cross, because they choose not to wear a crucifix:thumbsup:

No only hisalone. ITs just over and over with her for ever. But I understand you don’t believe that. But we do. We believe the word of God and we believe that the Apostles teach it not every person and their views on it. That is why the Catholic Church it the true Church. It is ONE Holy Catholic and Apostolic, It is not many, non catholic and non Apostolic. We believe in the teachings of the Apostles led by the Holy Spirit. Not led by many that is never the same That us why we are separated. There are only 2 kinds of Church’s. THe holy Catholic Apostolic Church and the Protestant Church. God is but one bread one body. He has never separated himself from the Catholic CHurch and never will, he promised us that. You can say that our church is not guided by the Holy Spirit but you will never hear us say that. We believe!

But never has a protestant showed me authority! Oh I ask, time after time, but get ignored:shrug: Guess when you can’t prove something you ignore it! Oh well. We showed our proof. And the Proof is in the bible, the Church.

 

[rinnie]

Hi, rinnie; are we trying your patience? You know, if you truly had the Peace of Christ, you could smile, and wade through all of these annoying posts, from non-catholics! Let’s see, where do I start; in Mark 1:4, who does Mark say those, who were being baptized, turned to for forgiveness? I’m like some other non-catholics; I haven’t found anything in the sayings of Christ, that tell us Christians to confess sins to a priest? I do see in 1John 1:9, that he says(John), For IF we confess our sins unto HIM, He is faithful to forgive us, and cleanse us of all wickedness:thumbsup:And I can’t speak for all non-catholics, but I do not believe that IF we confess our sins to each other(James 5:16), that they are forgiven! only God can forgive sins. If I share with fellow Christians, about a sin, it is to receive mercy, and support, instead of judgement or condemnation! But usually, by the time I confess a sin to a fellow believer, I have already confessed to God! I should have actually said that Jesus is my middle man; He pleads my case before the Father, when I enter the throneroom of grace! And I think as far as the topic of the crucifix, or no crucifix, we are now beginning to beat a “horse”, that appears to be on life support You believe in wearing a crucifix, I do not! The empty Cross to me, shouts V-I-C-T-O-R-Y!!! Every time I see it, it reminds me that my Saviour defeated death, and sin! We are no longer slaves to sin, and have victory over death! But, if it is the doctrine of the catholic church, to wear a crucifix, or to have one displayed in the sanctuary, then that is their choice! You do not have the authority to tell others, that they have no unity with the Cross, because they choose not to wear a crucifix:thumbsup:

Also if I may say What would give you the right to say that I do not have the peace of Christ and I am not smiling Acutally I have more Peace and more Love from Christ in my life than I ever have. And believe it or not I smile alot. Especially this week, just got my teeth cleaned they are really white and pretty. Gotta get my moneys worth

 

[almightyservant]

You believe in wearing a crucifix, I do not! The empty Cross to me, shouts V-I-C-T-O-R-Y!!! Every time I see it, it reminds me that my Saviour defeated death, and sin! We are no longer slaves to sin, and have victory over death!

I beg to differ. We are all slaves to sin at some point in our life until we die (assuming we make it to heaven).

But, if it is the doctrine of the catholic church, to wear a crucifix, or to have one displayed in the sanctuary, then that is their choice! You do not have the authority to tell others, that they have no unity with the Cross, because they choose not to wear a crucifix:thumbsup:

We are not required to wear crucifixes. It’d be ideal to have at least one to look upon. I see how you look at the cross as VICTORY. The victory is significant and important to our faith. It is glorious! Try to look at this from my perspective though. I believe Christ’s victory over death to be just as important as his Passion. In someways it it is more important, because we are able to suffer daily as he did. We are also responsible for his wounds and death. In addition, he came into this world to die for us. That is why this image is so sacred. Seeing Christ on the cross directs us to him by seeing his body and what we’ve done to him.

 

[racing59]

Also if I may say What would give you the right to say that I do not have the peace of Christ and I am not smiling Acutally I have more Peace and more Love from Christ in my life than I ever have. And believe it or not I smile alot. Especially this week, just got my teeth cleaned they are really white and pretty. Gotta get my moneys worth

I love some one with a sense of humor to lighten the mood. You made my day with your teeth!

 

[rinnie]

I love some one with a sense of humor to lighten the mood. You made my day with your teeth!

You are a sweetheart racing. And you are right you have to have a sense of humor. Could you imagine this world if there was not laughter. Our family laughs so much. We make a joke out of everything. When I would get down I would visit my Dad. By the end of the visit we would end it laughing so hard I would forget what I was down about.

He was mad one day because my brother stopped off at a friends house and his friend bought a case of beer. Someone stopped by and asked where my brother was. My dad said he was working on a case. The Man said oh, so late he must be really busy. Daddy said yes he has cracked many cases wide open. Then we would look at each other and laugh. But I really believe that when you laugh it is the best stress reliever in the world.

God Bless you racing, you just made me think of a wonderful memory and you just made my day. Now I have one more customer and I am off tommorow so maybe I should work on a case myself. (just kidding)

 

[racing59]

You are a sweetheart racing. And you are right you have to have a sense of humor. Could you imagine this world if there was not laughter. Our family laughs so much. We make a joke out of everything. When I would get down I would visit my Dad. By the end of the visit we would end it laughing so hard I would forget what I was down about.

He was mad one day because my brother stopped off at a friends house and his friend bought a case of beer. Someone stopped by and asked where my brother was. My dad said he was working on a case. The Man said oh, so late he must be really busy. Daddy said yes he has cracked many cases wide open. Then we would look at each other and laugh. But I really believe that when you laugh it is the best stress reliever in the world.

God Bless you racing, you just made me think of a wonderful memory and you just made my day. Now I have one more customer and I am off tommorow so maybe I should work on a case myself. (just kidding)

God Bless you rinnie you stick to your faith and your humor! I may not be Roman Catholic, but I have a lot of friends that are. I have great respect for your faith. Pray for me as I’m on my Journey.
Your brother in Christ and the Peace of the Holy Spirit be with you all the days of your life.
For me and my house will love and serve the Lord.:bowdown2:

 

[rinnie]

God Bless you rinnie you stick to your faith and your humor! I may not be Roman Catholic, but I have a lot of friends that are. I have great respect for your faith. Pray for me as I’m on my Journey.
Your brother in Christ and the Peace of the Holy Spirit be with you all the days of your life.
For me and my house will love and serve the Lord.:bowdown2:

I will my love, and you for me. Keep studying, and do not stop asking questions. Questions are where you will get your answers. Father told my husband when we got married (he was a protestant) that if he does not have the answer he will get it for him, If he has to go to the Pope. He said if the Pope does not know the answer God has not revealed it to us yet!

I would not let my husband become Catholic right away. It had to be his choice. I let him go to his church for as long as he needed. I told him to ask God, God would lead him. It took 2-4 years then he wanted to turn. I told him God had to lead him I couldn’t. Just like God will lead you. You trust God I can see that, That is the most important thing.