Protestants: The Eucharist Is A Sacrifice

[thephilosopher6]

"And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me.” - Luke 22:19

“τοῦτο ποιεῖτε εἰς τὴν ἐμὴν ἀνάμνησιν.”

The word “ἀνάμνησις”, often translated as “remembrance”, specifically refers to a memorial sacrifice rather than just simply recalling something. Indeed, this is how the earliest Christians saw the Eucharist.

“Assemble on the Lord’s day, and break bread and offer the Eucharist; but first make confession of your faults, so that your sacrifice may be a pure one. Anyone who has a difference with his fellow is not to take part with you until he has been reconciled, so as to avoid any profanation of your sacrifice. For this is the offering of which the Lord has said, ‘Everywhere and always bring me a sacrifice that is undefiled, for I am a great king, says the Lord, and my name is the wonder of nations’” - Didache 14 [A.D. 85]

 

[AugustTherese]

Oh, I am sure most Protestants will read and understand the “sacrifice”, as stated in the Didache and also prophesied in Malachi 1, as a sacrifice of sole praise and thanksgiving, and not one of propitiation. But, lo and behold, many Protestant communities have altars and many of their pastors will even “consecrate” on those altars; as if altars were meant to offer mere oblations of thanksgiving and praise and not a spotless victim of atonement and propitiation.

 

[thatcatholicguy]

The word “ἀνάμνησις”, often translated as “remembrance”, specifically refers to a memorial sacrifice rather than just simply recalling something. Indeed, this is how the earliest Christians saw the Eucharist.

Can you flesh this out a bit more? I looked up the word, but I am not getting much of anything other than a remembrance. Thanks!

 

[steido01]

The word ἀνάμνησις means precisely what’s translated in the English: remembrance or not-forgetting.

Remove the first two letters and the root, άμνησις, has a few semi-cognates in English: amnesia, amnesty, etc. It very clearly has to do with memory.

 

[steido01]

Ah. Didn’t see that before posting.

 

[thephilosopher6]

anámnēsis (from 363 /anamimnḗskō, “bring to mind”) – properly, deliberate recollection, done to better appreciate the effects (intended results) of what happened; active, self-prompted recollection especially as a memorial (memorial sacrifice).

 

[thephilosopher6]

This word often appeared in the context of sacrifice, take Hebrews 10:3 for a good example.

But those sacrifices are an annual reminder of sins. - Hebrews 10:3

ἀλλ’ ἐν αὐταῖς ἀνάμνησις ἁμαρτιῶν κατ’ ἐνιαυτόν,

 

[steido01]

I understand your point: Something done for the forgiveness of sins has a natural connection to sacrifice – or, rather, the Sacrifice.

But let’s be careful not to ascribe a meaning to a word simply due to proximity to another. For example, ἁμαρτια will appear almost every time Scriptures reference “sacrifice,” but we don’t pretend sin actually means sacrifice. That’s just silly.

There are real arguments to be made for understanding the Lord’s Supper to be a sacrifice, of various sorts. The Greek here is not one of them.

 

[steido01]

I’m not sure where you’re copy and pasting that from, but “memorial sacrifice” is not the literal meaning of the word. That’s someone’s musing on an already-loose interpretation.

The meaning is really rather straightforward: remembrance.

 

[thephilosopher6]

You’re missing the point, the word “ἀνάμνησις” is directly used to refer to sacrifice. It’s not just a generic word for “remembrance”. There are other words in Greek for “remembrance” or “memory” such as “μνεία”, and “μνήμη”, and “ἀναμιμνήσκω”. None of them have the same connection to sacrifice as “ἀνάμνησις”.

 

[Wannano]

"And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me.” - Luke 22:19

What is the significance in taking a loaf of bread and breaking it? The Didache makes reference to doing that as well as offering the Eucharist.

 

[steido01]

It does not refer to sacrifice in the least.

• In Mark 11, when Peter remembered what Jesus had said about the fig tree, was that a sacrificial remembrance? Same word.
• In Mark 14, when Peter remembered Jesus’s words about the cock crowing, was that a sacrificial remembrance?
• In 1 Corinthians 4:17, is Paul asking the Corinthians to let Timothy sacrifice them?
• In 2 Corinthians 7:15, does Titus sacrifice the congregation?
• Maybe Paul sacrifices Timothy in 2 Timothy 1:6?

Or, maybe, you done gone engaged in some biased eisegesis instead of letting the text learn you a thing or three through some good ol’ exegesis.

 

[AugustTherese]

It does not refer to sacrifice in the least.

• In Mark 11, when Peter remembered what Jesus had said about the fig tree, was that a sacrificial remembrance? Same word.
• In Mark 14, when Peter remembered Jesus’s words about the cock crowing, was that a sacrificial remembrance?
• In 1 Corinthians 4:17, is Paul asking the Corinthians to let Timothy sacrifice them?
• In 2 Corinthians 7:15, does Titus sacrifice the congregation?
• Maybe Paul sacrifices Timothy in 2 Timothy 1:6?

Or, maybe, you done gone engaged in some biased eisegesis instead of letting the text learn you a thing or three through some good ol’ exegesis.

You do realize Koine Greek verbs have different moods with different tenses, yes?

 

[thephilosopher6]

You’re simply wrong. Every instance of it occurring in the New Testament is in reference to sacrifice, and likewise, nearly every instance of it outside of the New Testament is used in reference for sacrifice.

Take Paul in 1 Corinthians 11

"In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.” - 1 Corinthians 11:25

“ὡσαύτως καὶ τὸ ποτήριον μετὰ τὸ δειπνῆσαι, λέγων Τοῦτο τὸ ποτήριον ἡ καινὴ διαθήκη ἐστὶν ἐν τῷ ἐμῷ αἵματι· τοῦτο ποιεῖτε, ὁσάκις ἐὰν πίνητε, εἰς τὴν ἐμὴν ἀνάμνησιν.”

Now take Paul in Philippians 1, for example, he used the word “μνείᾳ” for “remember”, a much different word, and a word which also occurs far more often in the New Testament for “memory”, “remembrance”, or “mention of.”

“I thank my God every time I remember you.” - Philippians 1:3

Εὐχαριστῶ τῷ θεῷ μου ἐπὶ πάσῃ τῇ μνείᾳ ὑμῶν

 

[thephilosopher6]

You clearly don’t understand Koine Greek. The word for “remembrance” in those verses are very different.

 

[steido01]

Every instance of it occurring in the New Testament is in reference to sacrifice, and likewise, nearly every instance of it outside of the New Testament is used in reference for sacrifice.

False. I just provided 5 times in the New Testament where the word is used. It clearly does not have a ‘sacrificial’ connotation.

Does it have a ‘deeper’ sense of ‘remembering’ than other words? Possibly, depending on the use. It can mean to really feel as if you were there again, a heavy sort of deja-vu more than simply recalling a fact. But ascribe a sacrificial meaning? No.

 

[thephilosopher6]

No, ἀναμιμνήσκω is distinguishable from ἀνάμνησιν, I see you can’t tell the difference between them though.

 

[thephilosopher6]

You are very very wrong, and I just proved you wrong by showing you that every instance of it in the NT occurs in the context of sacrifice.

 

[thephilosopher6]

363 anamimnḗskō (from 303 /aná, “up, completing a process” and 3403 /mimnḗskō, “turn the mind towards”) – properly, to recollect by going through a process – i.e. to journey where the remembrance leads (extends) to.

vs

anámnēsis (from 363 /anamimnḗskō, “bring to mind”) – properly, deliberate recollection, done to better appreciate the effects (intended results) of what happened; active, self-prompted recollection especially as a memorial (memorial sacrifice).

 

[steido01]

You keep re-posting this copy-and-pasted text as if its some final word on the subject. Look, I’m telling you that whatever you’re regurgitating is an opinion of an opinion. It’s so far removed from the original meaning of the actual word that it has no weight.