Protestants: The Eucharist Is A Sacrifice

[Athanasiy]

Evangelical Baptists in the Slavic world have a very responsible approach to bread-breaking.
I think that if the Roman Catholic communion is also a spiritual cleansing power, and for the Roman Catholic this sacrament is fundamental necessity, for Evangelical Christians in the Slavic world not everyone can proceed with a bread-breaking.
Here there is also an emphasis on possible negative consequences in case of a guilty conscience, аnd the consequences can affect a person not only in the hereafter but in the present life.

 

[Reuben_J]

Interesting. What is their concept of ‘bread breaking’? What is it and what it supposed to do? How does it function to affect negative consequence in real life?

 

[De_Maria]

I find it interesting that so many insist that wine should be used and not grape juice and yet use a manufactured host instead of a loaf of bread like Jesus instructed.

Who says that Jesus used a loaf of bread? The Passover Meal, and the Mass is the Christian Passover, prescribes the use of Matzah, which is unleavened bread. The consistency is not important. But the ingredients must be wheat flour and water. Nothing else.

And the Cup must contain wine, because that is what God prescribed in the Passover Meal. And what Jesus prescribed for the Mass.

 

[De_Maria]

Protestants: The Eucharist Is A Sacrifice

That’s true.

The Eucharist is the Sacrifice of our Lord, Jesus Christ. That is explicitly taught by the Catholic Church. But, if you’re going by Scripture alone, you’ll have to piece together several Scriptures in order to understand why this is so.

Jesus transformed the Jewish Passover into the Christian Mass.

No one denies that the Jewish Passover is a sacrifice, right?

Matthew 26:16 And from that time he sought opportunity to betray him. 17 Now the first day of the feast of unleavened bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, Where wilt thou that we prepare for thee to eat the passover? 18 And he said, Go into the city to such a man, and say unto him, The Master saith, My time is at hand; I will keep the passover at thy house with my disciples.

Note that Jesus prepares the disciples for a Passover. But this is what He says during that Passover:

26 And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body. 27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Jesus prepared the disciples for a Passover. But during that Passover, celebrated the Mass. St. Paul obviously understands this:

1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

So what does it mean that YOU are now UNLEAVENED?

St. Paul is using “leavening” in a metaphorical sense. To understand the metaphor, you must go to the Old Testament. God would not accept any offering with leaven:

Leviticus 2:11 No meat offering, which ye shall bring unto the Lord, shall be made with leaven: for ye shall burn no leaven, nor any honey, in any offering of the Lord made by fire.

This is the KJV so, it’s a bit deceiving to our ears. By meat, he means “bread”.

Leviticus 2:11 No grain offering that you bring to the Lord shall be made with leaven, …

Before the Passover, the Jews were supposed to clean house by throwing out all leavening.

cont’d

 

[De_Maria]

cont’d

Exodus 12:15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.

Why? Because leavening is a form of putrefaction. Yeast is a germ. Have you ever heard of a “yeast infection”?

This is why “leavening” is associated with sin. Because sin can corrupt the body, the way that yeast “corrupts” its host. When St. Paul says, “Purge out therefore the old leaven”, he is referring to sin. We must purge out the sin in our lives and become one bread, one body with Christ. And Christ is unleavened. He is totally without sin.

Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

And before we eat of the Eucharist, our Passover, we must purge out the sin in our lives by examining our conscience, repenting of our sins and going to Confession. Because we don’t want to eat of the Bread of Life with sin on our souls:

1 Corinthians 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. 29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body. 30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

When we unite ourselves to Christ in the Holy Eucharist, we must be a pure lump, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened, without sin.

Christ is the True Passover. And long ago, it was prophesied that Christ would become the Pure Offering acceptable to God:

Malachi 1:11 For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the Lord of hosts.

Furthermore, Christ is our Passover. As St. Paul said above.

1 Corinthians 5:7 …For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

How is Christ our Passover? Well, have you read in Scripture where Jesus is called the “Lamb of God”?

John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

And you do know that in the Passover, a lamb was sacrificed, right?

Exodus 12:21Then Moses called for all the elders of Israel, and said unto them, Draw out and take you a lamb according to your families, and kill the passover.

And so, Christ has replaced the Lamb with the bread that is His Flesh.

John 6:51I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Notice that this Bread, is from heaven.

 

[Athanasiy]

According to conservative Slavic Evangelical understanding the Scriptures, sickness and even death happen if a Christian participates in the bread-breaking, unworthy, but the main problem of unconfessed sins is the bread-breaking in its condemnation.
In Roman Catholic communities, especially on the West, on the contrary-not participation in the sacrament is perceived as a disregard for the sacrifice of Christ.
In the first case - it is better not to participate than to be condemned by the sacrifice of Christ, in the second -it is better to participate than to neglect the sacrifice of Christ.

 

[Reuben_J]

First time I hear such belief that receiving Communion unworthily can cause sickness and death. How do they ‘break the bread’, who do it and by what authority the person/'persons do it?

I am a Catholic too. It is certainly not a Catholic belief that not receiving Communion is to disregard it. The opposite is true - it is because Catholics regard the Body of Christ in high esteem that they will not receive it if they are in a state of sin for fear of desecrating it by receiving what it holy (God) into what is unholy (us, in a state of sin).

 

[rcwitness]

Good question. Does “broke” refer to breaking His body or sharing with each other? Did Jesus symbolically break His own body? Are we suppose to symbolically break Him?

I think its a sign of sharing.

Wine is quite different than un-fermented grape juice. Imagine if Jesus turned the water into juice at Cana!

While unlevened bread was for liturgical use, no?

Btw, i believe the symbolic uses of bread and wine are that bread gives nurishment to the body, and wine is for celebration/joy/rejoicing. Also, if im not mistaken, blood contains the life.

 

[goout]

I didn’t see this mentioned, and it is one of (if not THE) keys to understanding the Eucharist.

Fact:
Jesus is a first Century Jew.

Jesus was well versed in covenant theology and had a full Jewish understanding of sacrifice in that context, as expressed through the Old Testament.

It’s not possible to imagine the Eucharist outside the concept of sacrifice. To do that is to impose a modern understanding of Jesus that is foreign to who Jesus really is.

Jesus was incarnate as a first century Jew, not a child of western enlightenment.
Brant Pitre’s book
Jesus and the Jewish Roots of the Eucharist: Unlocking the Secrets of the Last Supper is a great read here.
https://www.amazon.com/Jesus-Jewish-Roots-Eucharist-Unlocking/dp/0385531842

 

[AugustTherese]

Jesus is a first Century Jew.

Love it! I love how you said ‘is’ and not ‘was’; Saint Josemaria Escriva said the exact same thing!

 

[goout]

Thumbs up.
He is also God.
His incarnation is not separable, God from man.
The way he speaks and acts is rooted in history as well as eternity.
Brant Pitre’s book is very edifying for firmly placing the Incarnation in salvation history.
To take the last Supper and Calvary outside the Jewish idea of atoning sacrifice would be unthinkable for Jesus.

 

[AugustTherese]

To take the last Supper and Calvary outside the Jewish idea of atoning sacrifice would be unthinkable for Jesus

It would have also been unthinkable for any Jew to convert to Christianity in the first century “outside the Jewish idea of atoning sacrifice”. The Jews were waiting for the prophesied new Temple (Mt. Zion, Catholic Church) where there would be a “pure sacrifice” (Mal.1) offered in every nation, everyday, at all times. The only place that happens is in the Universal Church, i.e. the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church.

 

[Benadam]

I like how St John Paul II put it. I paraphrase, “in the Christ Event eternity entered time and history.”

Understanding Jesus as being naturally eternal leads to an understanding of how the Eucharist is a re-presentation of the sacrifice accomplished by Jesus in history. Jesus always was, is, and is yet to come.

 

[AugustTherese]

I like how St John Paul II put it. I paraphrase, “in the Christ Event eternity entered time and history.”

Understanding Jesus as being naturally eternal leads to an understanding of how the Eucharist is a re-presentation of the sacrifice accomplished by Jesus in history. Jesus always was, is, and is yet to come.

Which echoes this: “And all that dwell upon the earth adored him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb, which was slain from the beginning of the world” - Rev 13:8

 

[GKMotley]

As time and eternity intersect, brought to the foot of the cross of the One Sacrifice, once offered, offered in eternity, for eternity…

Was wondering if and when this was going to be brought up.

 

[Athanasiy]

A verse of Scripture which shows the responsibility of the believer.
“That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep.” 1 Corinthian 11:30
Yes, but in Corinth the believers abused and underestimated the Lord’s table.

 

[Peebo]

Well. I clearly am out of my league discussing the theology of the Eucharist…but why is it so hard to understand the words of Jesus Christ in John 6…“unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood you have no life in you”…and so some of his disciples left him because they found it to hard to believe…Jesus did not try to stop them because he meant what he said…and yet we have the same thing today among many Protestants…they cannot accept what Jesus plainly stated…do they not see that they are doing exactly what those early followers of Jesus could not accept…are they protesting because it is Catholic doctrine…there are Orthodox churches that believe in the real presence…even some Protestant churches…although they are not in communion with the Catholic church still believe Christ is present in the Eucharist…( or Holy Communion )…they don’t a problem with what Jesus said…it’s as plain as the nose on your face…so…it boils down to thing that I can see…they can’t accept the fact it has always been part of doctrine of the Catholic church so they just made up their own “theory” or fallacy would be a better word…of what Christ said…it’s sad they are so blinded by what is the most precious of gifts our Savior gave to us in remembrance of his sacrifice…his body blood soul and divinity…I know that because I was one of those who couldn’t see the truth as a Pentecostal many years ago…but now I see.

 

[Reuben_J]

Okay. Thank anyway for the cusory information.

 

[AugustTherese]

but why is it so hard to understand the words of Jesus Christ in John 6

I would presume because when Protestant communities do not have the Real Presence in the Eucharist due to lack of valid Orders, they are left to believe in the reality of what they have; bread and wine that can only symbolize the words of Our Lord.

 

[rcwitness]

Benadam:

I like how St John Paul II put it. I paraphrase, “in the Christ Event eternity entered time and history.”

Understanding Jesus as being naturally eternal leads to an understanding of how the Eucharist is a re-presentation of the sacrifice accomplished by Jesus in history. Jesus always was, is, and is yet to come.

Which echoes this: “And all that dwell upon the earth adored him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb, which was slain from the beginning of the world” - Rev 13:8

Which Bible translation are you quoting???

Rev. 13:8
"and all who dwell on earth will worship it, every one whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb that was slain." RSV-CE