Question re: Husband staring at other females

[bmaj]

I completely agree - you shouldn’t have to explain why him staring at other women hurts you. I would turn this around on him - ask him why he thinks it’s perfectly acceptable to do it, even when he knows how it makes you feel.

Lou

Thanks so much for that suggestion, Lou. That excellent question will be part of the next discussion with him. I’m not good with thinking of quick responses to him off the tip of my tongue, unfortunately. This fact seems to usually work in his favor, but I truly appreciate hearing an appropriate come-back to use. May Our Lord bless you always.

 

[bmaj]

I’m not married, but from what I have seen in my own parents’ marriage, this is not normal. My mother would be quite upset if my father lusted after women right in front of her, especially if he stared for as long as your husband does. He needs to consider how his actions are affecting you. Perhaps you could try to be tougher and insist he consider your feelings. This is from a single person, though, so it might not be the best advice.

Thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts and suggestions on this, Confiteor Deo. I often wish could be a lot tougher, but I’m working on it. God’s blessings to you.

 

[estesbob]

When in the presence of his wife a married man must view attractive females like Dracula views a cross . A quick glance and then quickly turn away

 

[LethalMouse]

…my husband insists he’s doing absolutely nothing wrong and harshly verbally admonishes me, even continuing to the point of giving me the cold shoulder for days afterwards as “punishment.”

Ignoring the quote for a moment, I am going to approach this slightly “worldly” for a moment.

There are like a bizillion comedy shows, commercials and internet videos with guys doing this and getting the arm swing etc…

Men are visual and such but at the same token (prepare the pitchforks and torches) in my experience less attractive people tend to be overly into celebrity crushes etc… idk your situation in any regard to this, and he is still fairly wrong but if one spouse is maintaining their original shape ans the other is in shape because round is a shape… eh… and whtnot…

However! Based on the piece I quoted I see only two options… either he is a freaking jack butt in this regard (based on your claim he is otherwise “good”)

Or perhaps to give what little defense he could possibly warrant I had my Dad one time help me do something because I sought my parents assistance in saving something I was unable to move without breaking. It was from my dead mother…

My Dad misunderstood the issue and moved it like ripping off a bandaid. And it was ruined, causing a maybe 13yr old to have the face of sad destruction on his face with the expressed “That was my Mom’s I thought you could do it without ruining it”

Well there was a slight moment of horror on my dad’s face as his crushing me crushed him…

So how does he live with himself? Well about six months prior I had messed up and failed a math quarter in school (it was toward the end of summer now)

And he switched from his sad face to re putting me in troubke for having failed math. Because nothing soothes the concious for some like yelling at another.

So your Husband’s verbal assault could be rooted in guilt which could be half a good sign and perhaps some counseling would help?

If not rooted in guilt then idk… this part of the story I quoted is distressing a bit as the intial issue of a half wandering gaze does not sound so horrible but if I were to do so and called out on it I would surely apologize as I know of no justification for such a thing. Tbh as a guy I am not the best at not peeking though also I would not say I stare unceasingly…

So really I would suggest counseling because IMO his looking is not “good” but is much less an issue than the temper tantrum you describe especially if you spend a day or so of negative relations because you got annoyed he looked… that is odd

 

[bmaj]

Married or not, it is creepy when a man, or woman for that matter, “ogles” someone they are attracted to. I don’t think you’re being overly sensitive at all.

This has never happened to me with my husband (he has always been very respectful of me and other women in general, and would consider it rude to look at someone like that even if I was not with him). If it were me in your position, I would probably stop going places with him until he could show me that he respected me by keeping his attention on me when we were out. You can’t make him act any differently, but you can be clear with him about what you will and will not put up with.

Thank you very much for your insight, Lorelei, and for the suggestion. I appreciate the recommendation involving boundaries. It sounds like a wise idea if I’m able to get the courage to put it into action as needed. Will work on that. God’s blessings to you.

 

[bmaj]

And yet he feels he never does anything wrong, and never needs confession?..Interesting!

Uh…no, you’re in no way being overly sensitive. I can’t even begin to imagine the anguish that you’re being put through. God Bless you bmaj! Saint Louis and Saint Zélie Martin, pray for them!

---

Peace, Mark***

Thank you so much, Mark. I appreciate it. God’s blessings to you always as well.

 

[twf]

I agree that his behaviour is unusual, disrespectful and somewhat creepy. Even in a secular context, it is not socially acceptable to stare at a woman to the extent the OP described (visually following her until he is out of sight- adjusting angle or seat etc). There appears to be deeper issues (refusing to apologize or even recognize it hurts you) so I would echo those who recommend marital counselling.
That being said, we need some perspective. I don’t think the OP should expect a perfect ideal right off the bat. As long as he recognizes his behaviour is disrespectful and seeks to do better, I would ease off. Some of the men posting on this thread are saints (I say this with no sarcasm). As a married man, I certainly would not oogle women in front of my wife, but I would be a liar if I pretended I’ve never “checked out” other women while out and about- especially in the summer when women here tend to wear very revealing clothes. For most men who are not living saints, it is a constant temptation. However, out of love for our wives, we actively fight against it.

 

[bmaj]

In my opinion, you have a serious problem. First is his creepy gawking behavior. Second is he does not respond to your nice, clear protest about it. Third is that he puts you down for your opinion. All three are red flags - they just get worse and worse. If you want to find out if your marriage can be saved - because its NOT looking good - you should get some good Catholic marraige counseling. Even if you have to go alone - in case he is the type who says, “I’'m fine. I don’t need counseling.” Because he might be…

I think this is a very good response. You already told him how it makes your feel - and that truly seems to egg him one. So better off making like it doesn’t make you feel bad - you just think it makes him look* creepy.* He may well respond to that. And its the truth! Gross. Also, you need to know what is going on in his head. If you truly put on like you do not care, only that he seems like a creep when he does it, then you will find out if he is doing it particularly to make you squirm. It actually sure sounds like that to me. But best to get a professional opinion on that. Which I really think you need. A good Catholic counselor, not some counselor that might say being attracted to others can add pep to your sex life.

Thank you for the perceptive insight, Eliza. I’ve been trying to figure out what’s going on inside his head for years. Sometimes I even succeed. You’re correct, he refused to go to counseling several years ago when I discovered the porn use, so I went alone. It helped in that regard. I appreciate the recommendations. God’s blessings to you.

 

[bmaj]

I’m glad you like this suggestion that I like too. I suggest you keep it BRIEF - since you found that explaining yourself means nothing. Focus on NOT acting like it insults or bothers you, ONLY that you are looking at him looking like a creep with this weird behavior. And creeps are bores, so, don’t give it too much attention! If he does not respond to you, just WALK AWAY. (You can explain, you were acting like a creep, and I didn’t want to be seen with you acting that way).

In college in a nearby park there was a flasher, who shocked me when bike-riding alone - called my attention and there he was in all his exposure. My first and only such experience. Apparently he was always there. Well when my roommate (from the city, more savvy, even though she looked small and frail) was walking alone and he flashed her, she spoke and said as if mildly annoyed, “Go away! You are bothering my peaceful walk!” It implied that she was NOT shocked (what he was going for, and what he got from me - I made his day) but simply found him like a bothersome fly. She was smart (and more learned on the matter).

So if the reaction he is hoping to get is pleading nice talks from you about how you are hurt, so he can pretend that you are ridiculous for having an pinion, better not give him that reaction. Sometimes you have to be *smart, *instead of sincere or transparent, especially when you have been clearly taught that your sincerity is tread upon like hooves on pearls…

I just spotted your second post, Eliza, and the part about making it brief like swatting away a bothersome fly seems perfectly EXCELLENT to me. I am truly weary of having my feelings and opinion tread upon, so I will definitely try your suggestion next time. Maybe there won’t even be a next time - at least I pray there won’t be. He seems to be acting somewhat contrite now (always a good thing), but no apology has been put forth as usual. This can often be his way, so maybe my statement to him has hit a nerve which will help in the future. Thanks again, and God bless.

 

[bmaj]

As a widower and blessed by God to have found another wonderful woman, I say your husband is wrong and disrespectful on so many levels. I am not perfect and will never claim to be but I believe men should always show respect to their wife or significant other. You most definitely are not being overly sensitive.

Thank you so much for the insight, David. I’m very glad you were able to find another wonderful woman after becoming a widower. God is so good. It’s wonderful that there are men out there who believe in respecting their wives as you do. It gives me hope that perhaps my husband can learn some much better ways – and the sooner, the better. I pray for it! May Our Lord bless you always.

 

[bmaj]

“What do you think you are doing? Staring at a woman like that is just creepy and you need to just knock it off right now. It is disrespectful to me, and it is just wrong. You look like a pervert leering at her.”

And then, I would walk away.

And probably be willing to not talk to him for the rest of the day.

Wonderful suggestion, Irishmom! Thanks so much for sharing. I hope I have the courage to use it someday if needed. It definitely will be filed away in my mind if the right occasion arises and God gives me the strength! May Our Lord bless you always!

 

[bmaj]

Yes. Tell him also that it’s immature and hurtful.
That the woman in question would likely call the police if she realized it.
He doesn’t want to be labeled by cops as a predator, now does he?
Immature. He needs custody of his eyes.
Tell him the creep meter is pinging. Bigtime.

Excellent points, pianistclare. Thanks for the reminder. God’s love to you always.

 

[bmaj]

I second marital counseling because it sounds like a bigger problem than just his leering at other women. However, I don’t think I would be in public with a man who was doing that. I would say to him, “Both she and I deserve more respect than that an its embarrassing to be seen with you in public behaving in this immature and boorish manner. If you continue to do it, I’m leaving and I’ll find better company on the beach.”

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut, Allegra. I’m guessing that he thinks his dark sunglasses hide where his eyes are looking, so he probably doesn’t realize anyone else notices. Now he definitely knows I’m aware, and I pray it helps for the future. Good comeback for me to keep in mind. God’s blessings always to you.

 

[bmaj]

Someone once said “The eyes are the window to the soul”. But better still Matthew 6:22-23
22 “The lamp of the body is the eye. If your eye is sound, your whole body will be filled with light; 23 but if your eye is bad, your whole body will be in darkness. And if the light in you is darkness, how great will the darkness be."

Very important quote from the most important book in the world, TobyLue. Thanks for sharing. So, so true. I fear for that darkness in my husband and pray to have the strength to battle against it. God’s love to you always.

 

[bmaj]

My husband has never looked at another woman that I have noticed. Im sure many men sneak a quick glance now and then but to the extent to which you are describing is just plain wrong (especially as he does it in front of you, not that him doing out of your sight would make it right!)

I may be reading too much into this, but I am slightly concerned by some of what I am reading and I wonder if there is more to this?

You say he has watched pornography but doesnt think he has ever done anything wrong? You also say that he clearly disrespects you in public by staring at other women, but then punishes you when you mention it? However you also say he is a good husband and provider?

These are red flags for me for a controlling relationship. Maybe some marriage counselling would help?

Thanks for that insight, TrueFaith. You’re right, I’ve often felt he has a controlling personality. Some days it’s worse than others. It is true, however, that he’s also a good husband in other ways, a very hard worker, and a good provider. He wouldn’t go to marriage counseling with me years ago, so I went alone, and it seemed to help - at least it helped me. Am trying to figure this out on my own this time, but we’ll see. You’ve all given great suggestions. May God bless you.

 

[bmaj]

When in the presence of his wife a married man must view attractive females like Dracula views a cross . A quick glance and then quickly turn away

Sure wish he would follow that advice, estesbob. Maybe someday. Until then, thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut. God bless.

 

[pianistclare]

When in the presence of his wife a married man must view attractive females like Dracula views a cross . A quick glance and then quickly turn away

 

[bmaj]

Ignoring the quote for a moment, I am going to approach this slightly “worldly” for a moment.

There are like a bizillion comedy shows, commercials and internet videos with guys doing this and getting the arm swing etc…

Men are visual and such but at the same token (prepare the pitchforks and torches) in my experience less attractive people tend to be overly into celebrity crushes etc… idk your situation in any regard to this, and he is still fairly wrong but if one spouse is maintaining their original shape ans the other is in shape because round is a shape… eh… and whtnot…

However! Based on the piece I quoted I see only two options… either he is a freaking jack butt in this regard (based on your claim he is otherwise “good”)

Or perhaps to give what little defense he could possibly warrant I had my Dad one time help me do something because I sought my parents assistance in saving something I was unable to move without breaking. It was from my dead mother…

My Dad misunderstood the issue and moved it like ripping off a bandaid. And it was ruined, causing a maybe 13yr old to have the face of sad destruction on his face with the expressed “That was my Mom’s I thought you could do it without ruining it”

Well there was a slight moment of horror on my dad’s face as his crushing me crushed him…

So how does he live with himself? Well about six months prior I had messed up and failed a math quarter in school (it was toward the end of summer now)

And he switched from his sad face to re putting me in troubke for having failed math. Because nothing soothes the concious for some like yelling at another.

So your Husband’s verbal assault could be rooted in guilt which could be half a good sign and perhaps some counseling would help?

If not rooted in guilt then idk… this part of the story I quoted is distressing a bit as the intial issue of a half wandering gaze does not sound so horrible but if I were to do so and called out on it I would surely apologize as I know of no justification for such a thing. Tbh as a guy I am not the best at not peeking though also I would not say I stare unceasingly…

So really I would suggest counseling because IMO his looking is not “good” but is much less an issue than the temper tantrum you describe especially if you spend a day or so of negative relations because you got annoyed he looked… that is odd

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut from a male point of view, LethalMouse. I’ve tried to be understanding of the fact that men are VERY visual. I wish it weren’t so, though. We both stay active and keep ourselves in good shape - neither of us is overweight, although my husband always feels like he should lose about five pounds. He seems to be a bit insecure in some ways but just the opposite in others. Hard to figure sometimes. He doesn’t believe he does anything wrong and therefore has never agreed to counseling in the past, unfortunately. When I went by myself several years ago, it did help me, though. Thank you for the suggestions, and God bless.

 

[bmaj]

I agree that his behaviour is unusual, disrespectful and somewhat creepy. Even in a secular context, it is not socially acceptable to stare at a woman to the extent the OP described (visually following her until he is out of sight- adjusting angle or seat etc). There appears to be deeper issues (refusing to apologize or even recognize it hurts you) so I would echo those who recommend marital counselling.
That being said, we need some perspective. I don’t think the OP should expect a perfect ideal right off the bat. As long as he recognizes his behaviour is disrespectful and seeks to do better, I would ease off. Some of the men posting on this thread are saints (I say this with no sarcasm). As a married man, I certainly would not oogle women in front of my wife, but I would be a liar if I pretended I’ve never “checked out” other women while out and about- especially in the summer when women here tend to wear very revealing clothes. For most men who are not living saints, it is a constant temptation. However, out of love for our wives, we actively fight against it.

Thank you for that honest opinion from a husband’s point of view, twf. I’m definitely aware that many of the men who post here are very conscientious Catholics with a very different mindset than my husband’s. I would venture to guess that many, if not most, even go to Confession – which is just wonderful! I wish my husband would, but such is not the case yet. I keep praying. Since he believes he does no wrong, he never has agreed to counseling in the past either, unfortunately. We’ve been through much worse than this in our many years of marriage, so hopefully we will both learn from it. All of the suggestions here are definitely helping me. Thanks again, and God’s blessings to you.

 

[LethalMouse]

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut from a male point of view, LethalMouse. I’ve tried to be understanding of the fact that men are VERY visual. I wish it weren’t so, though. We both stay active and keep ourselves in good shape - neither of us is overweight, although my husband always feels like he should lose about five pounds. He seems to be a bit insecure in some ways but just the opposite in others. Hard to figure sometimes. He doesn’t believe he does anything wrong and therefore has never agreed to counseling in the past, unfortunately. When I went by myself several years ago, it did help me, though. Thank you for the suggestions, and God bless.

To the visual, if you are in shape and he is allowed to touch you, I think him a bit silly.

I am no where near the sweet innocence of many posters here but if I have an in shape touchable lady around, my eyes don’t wander much beyond my tendency for tactical awareness (which inadvertently aquires pretty and hilariously not pretty things in my view)