Questions my baptist friend had about the catholic faith

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While I was talking to a friend of mine yesterday, we got on the topic of religion and catholicism. He had alot of questions and I answered most of them. But there where some that I wasn’t sure about so I told him to send me the questions he had and I would find them out and get back to him as soon as possible. This is what he sent me, if you could help me out that would be great, thanks.

How could Mary remain a virgin in light of Luke 8:19, Mark 3:31, Matthew 12:46, and Matthew 13:55, 56?

Why do we pray to Saints and Mary to intercede for us? The Bible tells us to pray in the name of Jesus, and He will intercede for us as he sits at the right hand of the Father. Clearly, this is possible because Jesus is NOT dead, He is God, and He is omnipotent. He can hear all our prayers. Yet, dead Saints and Mary are mere humans. They are not even as powerful as angels, (the Bible tells us that humans were made a little lower than the angels). To pray to these dead ancestors is to assert that they can hear all our prayers and “watch over us”, which is not Biblically supported in any way. In fact, when Jesus died and the Temple curtain was torn in two, revealing the Holy of Holies, it symbolized our direct access to God. We no longer need anyone to intercede for us, because Jesus does so now instead of the High Priest. Jesus IS the High Priest.

Catholics believe that Communion turns into the actually Body and Blood of Christ upon consumption. Not only does the Bible condemn cannibalism, but Jesus’ favoritism towards parables and metaphors means that his words spoken at the Last Supper should not be taken literally, as the context does not support doing so. How do you explain this interpretation then?

How do you defend the Catholic confessional system? If Jesus’ death forgives us of our sins and gave us direct access to God, why should anyone confess their sins to anyone other than God? Why else did the Temple curtain tear but to demonstrate this truth?..
 
holtster15 said:
While I was talking to a friend of mine yesterday, we got on the topic of religion and catholicism. He had alot of questions and I answered most of them. But there where some that I wasn’t sure about so I told him to send me the questions he had and I would find them out and get back to him as soon as possible. This is what he sent me, if you could help me out that would be great, thanks.

How could Mary remain a virgin in light of Luke 8:19, Mark 3:31, Matthew 12:46, and Matthew 13:55, 56?

Why do we pray to Saints and Mary to intercede for us? The Bible tells us to pray in the name of Jesus, and He will intercede for us as he sits at the right hand of the Father. Clearly, this is possible because Jesus is NOT dead, He is God, and He is omnipotent. He can hear all our prayers. Yet, dead Saints and Mary are mere humans. They are not even as powerful as angels, (the Bible tells us that humans were made a little lower than the angels). To pray to these dead ancestors is to assert that they can hear all our prayers and “watch over us”, which is not Biblically supported in any way. In fact, when Jesus died and the Temple curtain was torn in two, revealing the Holy of Holies, it symbolized our direct access to God. We no longer need anyone to intercede for us, because Jesus does so now instead of the High Priest. Jesus IS the High Priest.

Catholics believe that Communion turns into the actually Body and Blood of Christ upon consumption. Not only does the Bible condemn cannibalism, but Jesus’ favoritism towards parables and metaphors means that his words spoken at the Last Supper should not be taken literally, as the context does not support doing so. How do you explain this interpretation then?

How do you defend the Catholic confessional system? If Jesus’ death forgives us of our sins and gave us direct access to God, why should anyone confess their sins to anyone other than God? Why else did the Temple curtain tear but to demonstrate this truth?..
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There are lots of quick and dirty answers, that are easily understood by Catholics, but will have no effect on your Baptist friend. Something with a little meat in it will greatly help in the long run. I say get a copy of Catholicism for Dummies and read it, then lend it to your friend. Better yet, get two copies.
 
How could Mary remain a virgin in light of Luke 8:19, Mark 3:31, Matthew 12:46, and Matthew 13:55, 56?
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Easily! Your friend has a poor interpretation and apparently does not understand that terms in a different language and culture have different meanings. Jesus was a Jew,not an English speaking Jew. More important, your friend apparently never reads early church history. Ask your friend to present the overwhelming evidence of Mary having other children
from the early church?
Why do we pray to Saints and Mary to intercede for us? The Bible tells us to pray in the name of Jesus, and He will intercede for us as he sits at the right hand of the Father. Clearly, this is possible because Jesus is NOT dead, He is God, and He is omnipotent. He can hear all our prayers.
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Thus, in Psalm 103 we pray, “Bless the Lord, O you his angels, you mighty ones who do his word, hearkening to the voice of his word! Bless the Lord, all his hosts, his ministers that do his will!” (Ps. 103:20–21). And in the opening verses of Psalms 148 we pray, “Praise the Lord! Praise the Lord from the heavens, praise him in the heights! Praise him, all his angels, praise him, all his host!”

Not only do those in heaven pray with us, they also pray for us. In the book of Revelation, John sees that “the twenty-four elders [the leaders of the people of God in heaven] fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints” (Rev. 5:8). Thus the saints in heaven offer to God the prayers of the saints on earth.

Angels do the same thing: “[An] angel came and stood at the altar [in heaven] with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God” (Rev. 8:3–4).

Because he is the only God-man and the Mediator of the New Covenant, Jesus is the only mediator between man and God (1 Tim. 2:5), but this in no way means we cannot or should not ask our fellow Christians to pray with us and for us (1 Tim. 2:1–4). In particular, we should ask the intercession of those Christians in heaven, who have already had their sanctification completed, for “[t]he prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects” (Jas. 5:16).
Yet, dead Saints and Mary are mere humans.
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Dead? Where does it state in scripture state they are dead? I thought God is the God of the living,not dead?
They are not even as powerful as angels, (the Bible tells us that humans were made a little lower than the angels). To pray to these dead ancestors is to assert that they can hear all our prayers and “watch over us”, which is not Biblically supported in any way. In fact, when Jesus died and the Temple curtain was torn in two, revealing the Holy of Holies, it symbolized our direct access to God. We no longer need anyone to intercede for us, because Jesus does so now instead of the High Priest. Jesus IS the High Priest.
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The same information as above.
Catholics believe that Communion turns into the actually Body and Blood of Christ upon consumption. Not only does the Bible condemn cannibalism, but Jesus’ favoritism towards parables and metaphors means that his words spoken at the Last Supper should not be taken literally, as the context does not support doing so. How do you explain this interpretation then?
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So one consumes a symbol which gives everlasting life? If Jesus spoke in a symolic way,then why so much offense over his teaching? Why would he ask the 12 they too were OFFENDED? Why didn’t Jesus correct their confusion,if he meant it to be symbolic? Does he not correct misunderstandings? Likewise, ask your buddy to present ancient historical records confirming the early Christians taught and believed a symbolic Eucharist? Second,if the True Presence is wrong,where are the countless writings from the early church teaching it is a heresy or usurpation of Christ?
How do you defend the Catholic confessional system? If Jesus’ death forgives us of our sins and gave us direct access to God, why should anyone confess their sins to anyone other than God? Why else did the Temple curtain tear but to demonstrate this truth?..
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Ask your friend what certitude does he/she have they have been forgiven?
 
holtster15 said:
While I was talking to a friend of mine yesterday, we got on the topic of religion and catholicism. He had alot of questions and I answered most of them. But there where some that I wasn’t sure about so I told him to send me the questions he had and I would find them out and get back to him as soon as possible. This is what he sent me, if you could help me out that would be great, thanks.

How could Mary remain a virgin in light of Luke 8:19, Mark 3:31, Matthew 12:46, and Matthew 13:55, 56?

Why do we pray to Saints and Mary to intercede for us? The Bible tells us to pray in the name of Jesus, and He will intercede for us as he sits at the right hand of the Father. Clearly, this is possible because Jesus is NOT dead, He is God, and He is omnipotent. He can hear all our prayers. Yet, dead Saints and Mary are mere humans. They are not even as powerful as angels, (the Bible tells us that humans were made a little lower than the angels). To pray to these dead ancestors is to assert that they can hear all our prayers and “watch over us”, which is not Biblically supported in any way. In fact, when Jesus died and the Temple curtain was torn in two, revealing the Holy of Holies, it symbolized our direct access to God. We no longer need anyone to intercede for us, because Jesus does so now instead of the High Priest. Jesus IS the High Priest.

Catholics believe that Communion turns into the actually Body and Blood of Christ upon consumption. Not only does the Bible condemn cannibalism, but Jesus’ favoritism towards parables and metaphors means that his words spoken at the Last Supper should not be taken literally, as the context does not support doing so. How do you explain this interpretation then?

How do you defend the Catholic confessional system? If Jesus’ death forgives us of our sins and gave us direct access to God, why should anyone confess their sins to anyone other than God? Why else did the Temple curtain tear but to demonstrate this truth?..
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Actually this is what I also believe. Fascinating that the beliefs of the various Baptists are the same, although people here keep telling that it isn’t…
 
Esdra said:
Actually this is what I also believe. Fascinating that the beliefs of the various Baptists are the same, although people here keep telling that it isn’t…
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Key word: Various. Not ALL Baptists
 
holtster15 said:
In fact, when Jesus died and the Temple curtain was torn in two, revealing the Holy of Holies, it symbolized our direct access to God. We no longer need anyone to intercede for us, because Jesus does so now instead of the High Priest. Jesus IS the High Priest.
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Our direct access to God is manifested fully through our reception of the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist. The Eucharist is possible only through the hands of a priest. Priests therefor are absolutely necessary if we are to have full access to God directly, not just in our hearts and minds, but physically, just like the people who walked with him two thousand years ago.

You cover a lot of ground on behalf of your friend. You must be a great friend to bring all that with you to this website and to ask all those questions on your baptist friend’s behalf. I realy hope he appreciates you when you, as a Catholic, take the responses on this thread back to him.

Please tell your friend that many of us here are praying for him. And for you. 😉

-Tim-
 
holtster15 said:
How could Mary remain a virgin in light of Luke 8:19, Mark 3:31, Matthew 12:46, and Matthew 13:55, 56?
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Of the listed verses, only Matthew 13:55 lists any of the brothers by name.

catholicsource.net/articles/perpetualvirginity.htm shows that none of the named brothers of Jesus can be his literal blood brothers.

You might also ask your friend why Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, Bullinger and Wesley all strongly proclaimed the doctrine of the Perpetual Virginity of Mary, whereas most Protestants today do not (i.e. what changed, and when)?
 
holtster15 said:
While I was talking to a friend of mine yesterday, we got on the topic of religion and catholicism. He had alot of questions and I answered most of them. But there where some that I wasn’t sure about so I told him to send me the questions he had and I would find them out and get back to him as soon as possible. This is what he sent me, if you could help me out that would be great, thanks.
Click to expand...
Ok hopefully these responses will be helpful.
holtster15 said:
How could Mary remain a virgin in light of Luke 8:19, Mark 3:31, Matthew 12:46, and Matthew 13:55, 56?
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If Jesus had brothers why wouldn’t they have simply have taken responsibility for the care of Mary when instead Jesus gave it to the apostle John on Calvary?

Also this Video:** How did the Church Fathers explain the perpetual virginity of Mary?** youtube.com/watch?v=wWy3lUX6azU
holtster15 said:
Why do we pray to Saints and Mary to intercede for us? The Bible tells us to pray in the name of Jesus, and He will intercede for us as he sits at the right hand of the Father. Clearly, this is possible because Jesus is NOT dead, He is God, and He is omnipotent. He can hear all our prayers. Yet, dead Saints and Mary are mere humans. They are not even as powerful as angels, (the Bible tells us that humans were made a little lower than the angels). To pray to these dead ancestors is to assert that they can hear all our prayers and “watch over us”, which is not Biblically supported in any way. In fact, when Jesus died and the Temple curtain was torn in two, revealing the Holy of Holies, it symbolized our direct access to God. We no longer need anyone to intercede for us, because Jesus does so now instead of the High Priest. Jesus IS the High Priest.
Click to expand...
Another Video witch includes a defense of praying to saints in General: Praying to Mary - A Biblical Defense youtube.com/watch?v=V6OwlfNwc9A
holtster15 said:
Catholics believe that Communion turns into the actually Body and Blood of Christ upon consumption. Not only does the Bible condemn cannibalism, but Jesus’ favoritism towards parables and metaphors means that his words spoken at the Last Supper should not be taken literally, as the context does not support doing so. How do you explain this interpretation then?
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Because Christ said so, read John 6, 1 Corinthians 10.

Here is a link to a site with scripture references to The Eucharist among other things scripturecatholic.com/the_eucharist.html and another video on the real presence How can we know Jesus is really present in the Eucharist? youtube.com/watch?v=XI8ZFDY0YLw&feature=channel_video_title

Plus why would Christ include such a parable if He knew it would lead to the majority of Christians for two Milena to misunderstand it and fall into such sin?
holtster15 said:
How do you defend the Catholic confessional system? If Jesus’ death forgives us of our sins and gave us direct access to God, why should anyone confess their sins to anyone other than God? Why else did the Temple curtain tear but to demonstrate this truth?..
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John 20. i find it hard to think of another explanation for this chapter then by the Authority conferred on the apostles handed on through apostolic succession in The Church. Yes we do have access to forgiveness in prayer but we do need to Confess serious sins, otherwise Christ deliberately threw a monkey-wrench into His Church that has yet to be worked out after two Milena.
 
holtster15 said:
Catholics believe that Communion turns into the actually Body and Blood of Christ upon consumption. Not only does the Bible condemn cannibalism, but Jesus’ favoritism towards parables and metaphors means that his words spoken at the Last Supper should not be taken literally, as the context does not support doing so. How do you explain this interpretation then?
Click to expand...
Actually, the bread and wine become the actual Body and Blood of Christ *prior to *consumption, when the priest says “This is my body… This is my blood.” As St. Thomas Aquinas put it, back in the 13th century, “Some have held that the substance of the bread and wine remains in this sacrament [the Eucharist] after the consecration. But this opinion cannot stand… [T]he conclusion is that, saving the truth of this sacrament, the substance of the bread cannot remain after the consecration” (Summa Theologica, source).

I find it ironic that Baptists (who have divided mainly into the extremely liberal in matters of belief and the fundamentalists who adhere to a literal interpretation of the Bible) do not adhere to a literal interpretation of the Bible when it pertains to the Eucharist.
holtster15 said:
How do you defend the Catholic confessional system? If Jesus’ death forgives us of our sins and gave us direct access to God, why should anyone confess their sins to anyone other than God? Why else did the Temple curtain tear but to demonstrate this truth?..
Click to expand...
After his resurrection Jesus told the apostles, “‘As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.’ And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained’” (John 20:21–23). (This is one of only two times we are told that God breathed on man, the other being in Genesis 2:7, when he made man a living soul. It emphasizes how important the establishment of the sacrament of penance was.)

Now, why would Jesus give his apostles the power to forgive sins if he did not expect them to use it? And how would the apostles be expected to know which sins to forgive and which to retain if they weren’t told?
 
Erich said:
Actually, the bread and wine become the actual Body and Blood of Christ *prior to *consumption, when the priest says “This is my body… This is my blood.” As St. Thomas Aquinas put it, back in the 13th century, “Some have held that the substance of the bread and wine remains in this sacrament [the Eucharist] after the consecration. But this opinion cannot stand… [T]he conclusion is that, saving the truth of this sacrament, the substance of the bread cannot remain after the consecration” (Summa Theologica, source).

I find it ironic that Baptists (who have divided mainly into the extremely liberal in matters of belief and the fundamentalists who adhere to a literal interpretation of the Bible) do not adhere to a literal interpretation of the Bible when it pertains to the Eucharist.

After his resurrection Jesus told the apostles, “‘As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.’ And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained’” (John 20:21–23). (This is one of only two times we are told that God breathed on man, the other being in Genesis 2:7, when he made man a living soul. It emphasizes how important the establishment of the sacrament of penance was.)

Now, why would Jesus give his apostles the power to forgive sins if he did not expect them to use it? And how would the apostles be expected to know which sins to forgive and which to retain if they weren’t told?
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Now the real question, after they read all of this. how can they deny it.:confused:
 
holtster15 said:
To pray to these dead ancestors is to assert that they can hear all our prayers and “watch over us”, which is not Biblically supported in any way.
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On the contrary, those in heaven *are *aware of the prayers of those on earth. This can be seen, for example, in Revelation 5:8, where John depicts the saints in heaven offering our prayers to God under the form of “golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.” But if the saints in heaven are offering our prayers to God, then they must be aware of our prayers. They are aware of our petitions and present them to God by interceding for us.

Moses and Elijah certainly weren’t dead when they appeared with Jesus at the Transfiguration… in fact, Jesus spoke with them. That would have been hard to do if they were dead 😉
 
Esdra said:
Okay, I’ll put differently: The Churches of the World Baptist Alliance believe the same I do.
But I really think you can say that, can you? 😉
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If all flavors of Baptists believe the same thing, why so many flavors of Baptists? Southern Baptists, Independent Baptists, Primitive Baptists, etc.

I had a friend who was Baptist and I asked him why. He said, “One reason. We get to vote.” I asked him what they got to vote on. He said, “Everything.” He went on to say that his particular Baptist church had just split over some doctrine they couldn’t agree on, so half stayed and the other half went form a different Baptist church. How does that work?
 
Scoobyshme said:
half stayed and the other half went form a different Baptist church. How does that work?
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It would appear that the Baptist denomination grows by splitting. First there was one Baptist church in town, now there are two 😉
 
Erich said:
It would appear that the Baptist denomination grows by splitting. First there was one Baptist church in town, now there are two 😉
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Yep! Those are pretty much the obvious trademarks of many denominations. 😦
 
Scoobyshme said:
If all flavors of Baptists believe the same thing, why so many flavors of Baptists? Southern Baptists, Independent Baptists, Primitive Baptists, etc.

I had a friend who was Baptist and I asked him why. He said, “One reason. We get to vote.” I asked him what they got to vote on. He said, “Everything.” He went on to say that his particular Baptist church had just split over some doctrine they couldn’t agree on, so half stayed and the other half went form a different Baptist church. How does that work?
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To be quite honest…most evangelical fellowships…including the various Baptist groups all share similar if not the same beliefs…they differ usually on church policy and government…example, while the Church of the Nazarene, Free Methodists and Weslyan groups all have similar beliefs…where they differ is that they stress certain points of Weslyan theology…which they share with the Methodists…and church government and structure…they agree on the “essentials”…but disagree on the “non-essentials”…

What I often read here at CAF is that different denomiantions believe “completly different things”…no a true statment and IMO down right dishonest. Evangelical Friends share much with the “Weslyan traditions”…where they differ…they do not believe santification is a “definte second work of grace subsequent to regeneration”.
 
holtster15 said:
While I was talking to a friend of mine yesterday, we got on the topic of religion and catholicism. He had alot of questions and I answered most of them. But there where some that I wasn’t sure about so I told him to send me the questions he had and I would find them out and get back to him as soon as possible. This is what he sent me, if you could help me out that would be great, thanks.

How could Mary remain a virgin in light of Luke 8:19, Mark 3:31, Matthew 12:46, and Matthew 13:55, 56?

Why do we pray to Saints and Mary to intercede for us? The Bible tells us to pray in the name of Jesus, and He will intercede for us as he sits at the right hand of the Father. Clearly, this is possible because Jesus is NOT dead, He is God, and He is omnipotent. He can hear all our prayers. Yet, dead Saints and Mary are mere humans. They are not even as powerful as angels, (the Bible tells us that humans were made a little lower than the angels). To pray to these dead ancestors is to assert that they can hear all our prayers and “watch over us”, which is not Biblically supported in any way. In fact, when Jesus died and the Temple curtain was torn in two, revealing the Holy of Holies, it symbolized our direct access to God. We no longer need anyone to intercede for us, because Jesus does so now instead of the High Priest. Jesus IS the High Priest.

Catholics believe that Communion turns into the actually Body and Blood of Christ upon consumption. Not only does the Bible condemn cannibalism, but Jesus’ favoritism towards parables and metaphors means that his words spoken at the Last Supper should not be taken literally, as the context does not support doing so. How do you explain this interpretation then?

How do you defend the Catholic confessional system? If Jesus’ death forgives us of our sins and gave us direct access to God, why should anyone confess their sins to anyone other than God? Why else did the Temple curtain tear but to demonstrate this truth?..
Click to expand...
jl: Mark for remarks
 
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