Release of pope's comments on condoms a blunder or apologetic genius?

[Yorkshireman]

Perhaps just an example and his comments were not meant to be all encompassing?

If the Pope now believes condoms can stop the AIDS virus from spreading when gay sex is purchased why doesn’t he think the virus can be stopped when two gays are doing it for nothing?

Previously the church had said minute holes in condoms allow the virus to pass. Now condoms are a barrier apparently. Does anybody know what scienctific study has made the Pope change his mind?

 

[PPeterson]

I like how any statement that isn’t a “blunder” is “apologetic genius.” lol. I drove a different way to work yesterday and it got me there. NAVIGATION GENIUS!!!

 

[yellowbird]

I’m trying to imagine how this would play out if I were a faithful Catholic, African wife whose philandering husband was infected with HIV.

If my husband wants sex with a man, a step in the right moral direction is the use of a condom to protect the health of his partner.

If my husband wants sex with me - his wife, he should NOT wear a condom.

I’m not a proponent of ABC - I totally “get it” that it’s wrong. I’m just trying to imagine how I would feel if I were that African wife hearing the the Pope say it’s a good thing if my deadbeat husband uses condoms to prevent the spread of his disease to men, but not to women - specifically me.

I would feel like my life matter less.

 

[John_Pascendi]

I think this is another hoax…why would any church leader endorse cheating…after all one wears those things to prevent the gal from getting pregnant or the guy from getting a disease and why would you have a sexual affair with a unknown person.one whom you dont know slept with whatever!!!The timing is also suspect…since we have been inudated with reports of the church of england etc swinging over to our side over the homosexual bit and this comes out…in a book yet!Remember,lets take a deep breath…FDR was silent over the anguish of Germanys Jews while Pope PiusX11 spoke out .from 1939 to 1945 some 35 times.in articles from the NYTImes of which I have the dates,titles etc…yet FDR is lauded as a saint by the establishment while PiusX11 is condemned as being silent…lets wait and see what develops…as to earth warming…

 

[Soler]

I’m sure many of you have by now heard the story.

Apparently, the Italian version of the extract from Seewald’s book referred to a *female *prostitute and said that the use of condoms could be “justified”.

The English version referred to a *male *prostitute and never mentioned the word “justified”.

Does anyone have the ORIGINAL GERMAN TEXT to hand?

 

[PJM]

=Catholic Press;7287844]By JOHN L. ALLEN JR.

Pope Benedict XVI has signaled that in some limited cases, where the intent is to prevent the transmission of disease rather than to prevent pregnancy, the use of condoms might be morally justified.

While that position is hardly new, in the sense that a large number of Catholic theologians and even a special Vatican commission requested by Benedict XVI have endorsed it, this is the first time the pope himself has publicly espoused such a view.

The comments do not yet rise to the level of official church teaching, but they do suggest that Benedict might be open to such a development.

More…

***My dear friends in Christ,

I commend the poster pointing out “The comments do not yet rise to the level of official church teaching, but they do suggest that Benedict might be open to such a development.”…

No doubt there will me Liberal Moral Theologians, some bishops, priest and religious and a FLOCK of “human secularist” [Rationalist] who jump on the Band-Wagon, and proclaim that “at last!” the Church has come to Her senses!”

STOP! Can’t happen. Church doctrine and dogma are unchangeable! Clarification and understanding can change; BUT NOT THE BASE DOCTRINE ITSELF.

In reading the total news release, the final paragraph points out the following: [In my words]

This is an exception based on the Moral Principle of “THE GREATER GOOD.” It targets a SPECIFIC audience, for a SPECIFIC purpose. Saving life’s! The TARGET audience is male prostitutes, particularly in Africa, which has a BOOMING Catholic Population. The Purpose is the saving of Life’s and slowing down the epidemic - spreading of the sexually transmitted [primarily] AIDS disease.

It DOES NOT target married unions. WHY? Because in a chaste marriage there is ZERRO risk of spreading AIDS! Nor does it offer in any way, shape, or form a blanket reversal of LONG HELD Church position on the immorality of “Contraceptive sex,” IN or OUT of married life.

One would be prudent and Morally wise to wait for further Magisterium Teaching on this matter, BEFORE assuming * that as the Secular Press, known for there support of abortion, same sex unions, and “freewill -sex” will certainly report as a “long awaited SHIFT in Moral teaching by the Church.” It’s NOT going to happen!

Love and prayers,
Pat
11/19/10****

 

[Yorkshireman]

I think this is another hoax…why would any church leader endorse cheating

Hoax? The story first appeared in L’Osservatore Romano the Vatican newspaper.

 

[Des]

Um, I’m not angry at the Pope. I applaud this statement. I just think it’s funny how you people get your panties all in a bunch just because the Pope indicated that a male prostitute with AIDS using a condom isn’t the worst thing that could ever possibly happen. You’ve all been defending the CC’s position on ABC for so long that your whole world comes crashing down around you if the Pope makes a tiny step in another direction. Sheesh.

You people? I make sure to check the facts before I start eating up the media’s interpretation then rant how He “intentionally” is trying to slip the condom issue in little by little because He wants to change it in the future. Sorry but that really got my goat.

The fact is, the secular media were wrong and you were wrong and you seemed all too eager to be.

 

[Des]

Face Reality:
Faithful Catholics know that Pope Benedict XVI is a faithful, Supreme Vicar of Christ.
Useful commentary on the Pope’s statements and how they are twisted are also here:
ncregister.com/blog/the-pope-said-what-about-condoms?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+NCRegisterDailyBlog+%2540The+Daily+Register%2541#When:22:09:44Z

and here:
splendoroftruth.com/curtjester/2010/11/ginger-factor-the-pope-approves-of-condoms/

and here:
thatthebonesyouhavecrushedmaythrill.blogspot.com/2010/11/why-pope-benedict-xvis-next-visit-will.html

Very nice. Thanks Abu.

Every news article and TV news report about the condom thing COMPLETELY misrepresents what the pope said.

BUT, they are also stating when the book goes on sale and implying that it worth reading.I bet it sells like hot cakes.

What does everyone think? Mistake?? or brilliant way of getting the Catholic position heard (or read)?

Like I said, I bet the book is going to be a HUGE seller.

The thing I worry about is non Catholics may still continue to misinterpret His words without bringing it into context together with the full Catholic teaching. Very easy to do as we see this has been done in the past and even to this day.

 

[Yorkshireman]

The Pope has now said condom use is just about acceptable in some circumstances.

Where or when did he ever say that before?

 

[Thoughtfulone]

You people? I make sure to check the facts before I start eating up the media’s interpretation then rant how He “intentionally” is trying to slip the condom issue in little by little because He wants to change it in the future. Sorry but that really got my goat.

The fact is, the secular media were wrong and you were wrong and you seemed all too eager to be.

Um, I wasn’t “eating up” the media’s interpretation. I read what the Pope said, and like it or not, it is very clear that he is coming very close to making an exception for the use of condoms here. Hey, I know! Let’s wait and see if the Vatican bothers trying to clarify this. They are doubtless aware of the controversy this is causing and have only to say a few words to clear the whole thing up for everyone.

 

[Hlafdige]

kath.net has promised to post an excerpt in a few days, as soon as they get permission. In the meantime, Auxiliary Bishop Laun of Salzburg has posted an editoriat on what Pope Benedict really said, including a quote:

“Im einen oder anderen Fall kann es in der Absicht, Ansteckungsgefahr zu verringern, jedoch ein erster Schritt sein auf dem Weg hin zu einer anders gelebten, menschlicheren Sexualität”.

The context given was the example of a prostitute with scant concept of sexual mores who takes a first step towards realizing that not everything that can be done, should be done.

 

[ddarko]

The Pope has now said condom use is just about acceptable in some circumstances.

Where or when did he ever say that before?

He didn’t have to say it before. Think about it, if you want to use a condom as a piece of rubber to chew on, is that morally evil? Obviously not. So the pope in a way pointed out the obvious.

Condom use is bad only when it is contraceptive.Contraception IS THE sin. Not the condom. In the case of male prostitution, there is no contraception due to Condoms. The act of sex it-self in that case is morally wrong.

As you can see with the chewing the condom example. The more I read comments like yours, the more I think it was a good thing the Pope said this. You seemed to have been living with the impression that the condom is intrinsically evil when it is just a piece of Latex. It is how you use it that makes it morally evil.

God Bless

 

[Yorkshireman]

You just don’t get it Ddarko.

 

[ddarko]

You just don’t get it Ddarko.

Sigh* I think you are just seeing what you want to see now.

When you are hellbent on wanting it to be that “Pope broke with teachings”, “Pope introduced something new”, well… all logic goes out of the window for you.

God Bless

 

[kelvinf]

I’m sure many of you have by now heard the story.

Apparently, the Italian version of the extract from Seewald’s book referred to a *female *prostitute and said that the use of condoms could be “justified”.

The English version referred to a *male *prostitute and never mentioned the word “justified”.

Does anyone have the ORIGINAL GERMAN TEXT to hand?

I haven’t come across the original german text and it seems as if the original text is not yet available. But most of the media outlets here are using the term “justified”

Just go to google.de and enter: „begründeten Einzelfällen“ (justified single cases). It’s interesting that all the search results will associate this term with the pope.

About the use of the term “female/male/prostitute”, most of the german versions I have seen simply use “prostitute” but I have seen another one that uses “male prostitute”.

 

[joandarc2008]

Here is the link to Vatican Information Service It is where the news agencies get most of their official releases from the Vatican. The Vatican for having the “Pope just take us in a new direction” has been silent. I think this is something of at best a misdirection and less charitably a hoax.

 

[kelvinf]

Just to add that some german online news outlets have quoted comments made by the Vatican spokesperson Federico Lombardi on this issue (on Sunday).

 

[Yorkshireman]

Does anyone think there are many gay male prostitutes out there who up till now had never used a condom but will do so now that the pope says so.

 

[joandarc2008]

Just to add that some german online news outlets have quoted comments made by the Vatican spokesperson Federico Lombardi on this issue (on Sunday).

Yes, he did but he made them to NCR but not a single Vatican press release - check the Vatican press releases office - are you going to trust the secular media or are you going to use your own eyes and brain and wait for an encyclical.