Religion of peace?? Please explain.

[Ed_Rand]

Muslims go through 9/11 type things everyday because of ME? I sincerely dount that-you wanna explain how that is, or just make accusations you cant back up?

I was speaking of the Muslims in Iraq. What happened to you on 9/11? My guess is that you probably sat somewhere watching the news. You sat and watched the US get seriously attacked on its own soil for the first time in decades. You didn’t know a single person that died there. The vast majority of Americans were essentially unaffected in their daily lives by the events of 9/11. How many Iraqi’s have lost their homes? How many Iraqi’s have lost a family member? a friend? The fact is that the vast majority of Iraqi’s have had their lives upended by you and I.

“Peaceful religion?” PUHLEEEEEESE-you will NEVER ocnvince me-especially if you want to keep denying history, and keep making two sets of rules-one for Mohammedans, one for “infidels”!

I have already said that Islam is much less peaceful than Christianity–as taught in the two scriptures, NOT as practiced by their respective adherents. And there are two sets of rules. They are commanded to take “life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth”. We are commanded “love your enemy and pray for those who persecute you” and “turn to him the other cheek”. I didn’t make two sets of rules, God did.

 

[wth1257]

I was speaking of the Muslims in Iraq. What happened to you on 9/11? My guess is that you probably sat somewhere watching the news. You sat and watched the US get seriously attacked on its own soil for the first time in decades. You didn’t know a single person that died there. The vast majority of Americans were essentially unaffected in their daily lives by the events of 9/11. How many Iraqi’s have lost their homes? How many Iraqi’s have lost a family member? a friend? The fact is that the vast majority of Iraqi’s have had their lives upended by you and I.

I have already said that Islam is much less peaceful than Christianity–as taught in the two scriptures, NOT as practiced by their respective adherents. And there are two sets of rules. They are commanded to take “life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth”. We are commanded “love your enemy and pray for those who persecute you” and “turn to him the other cheek”. I didn’t make two sets of rules, God did.

the Quran says it is just to take an eye for an eye, but the best option is forgiveness.

I would agrea with your overall thesis however, and have enjoyed reading your posts

 

[Ed_Rand]

the Quran says it is just to take an eye for an eye, but the best option is forgiveness.

I would agrea with your overall thesis however, and have enjoyed reading your posts

And I have been following you too!!!

No, but really, don’t give up hope.

 

[GemmaRose]

I wonder how your nice, polite, generous neighbors would feel reading what you write about them and their dearly held religion here.

What a two faced joke

All people are basically good because all people are made by God and God does not create us evil.

I believe that a very large group of people who have been created good have been brainwashed by a “religion” that came from the devil.

Some of these people are a little less religious, and maybe that’s why they even speak to me. However, since 9/11, there have been many arrests of more “serious” Muslims in my neighborhood.

I believe that those who have been 110% indoctrinated into the Muslim religion by fanatical Muslim clerics are those who seem to have no other life or hobby than to kill, or plot to kill, innocent people.

I started this thread with the hope that maybe someone, even just one person, would look at the facts and see the falsity and violence of Islam.

 

[R_not]

Muslims go through 9/11 type things everyday because of ME?

I sincerely dount that-you wanna explain how that is, or just make accusations you cant back up?

Shiites and Sunnis were killing maiming and mutilating each other before the United States existed; Muslims were killing mutilating maiming and enslaving Christians before the United States existed!

I cannot help but laugh when an African American says “Islam is a black man’s religion”-Muslims were killing mutilating maiming enslaving and forcibly converting Africans before the United States existed, AND who do you think most of the “Slave Traders” who sold millions of Africans to be sailed into slavery in the United States were? MUSLIMS, thats who!

And I suppose all of the above is also the fault of the US and those who l ive there, even though the US didnt exist yet when these things happened, right? I wouldnt doubt it!

In fact, the mass killings that are considered the first historical “genocide” of the 20th century, and the one that inspired Hitler to attempt to wipe out the Jews was the Muslim genocide against the Armenians in the early 20th century! And believe me, the Armenians were both innocent of any wrongdoing against the Muslim Ottoman Turks, as well as completely unable to mount any kind of defense against the savages who murdered them.

“Peaceful religion?” PUHLEEEEEESE-you will NEVER ocnvince me-especially if you want to keep denying history, and keep making two sets of rules-one for Mohammedans, one for “infidels”!

 

[wth1257]

All people are basically good because all people are made by God and God does not create us evil.

I believe that a very large group of people who have been created good have been brainwashed by a “religion” that came from the devil.

Some of these people are a little less religious, and maybe that’s why they even speak to me. However, since 9/11, there have been many arrests of more “serious” Muslims in my neighborhood.

I believe that those who have been 110% indoctrinated into the Muslim religion by fanatical Muslim clerics are those who seem to have no other life or hobby than to kill, or plot to kill, innocent people.

I started this thread with the hope that maybe someone, even just one person, would look at the facts and see the falsity and violence of Islam.

No you didn’t, you posted a tragic story and attempted to use these petty atrocities to stir up hatred and then laced your OP with cheep polemics and strawmen.

You spew all sorts of libel, classifying theft, murder, destruction et cetera as simply a continuation of typical Muslim behavior , and now have somehow summoned up the gall to assign some higher motive to your vulgarity?

I’m sure you are overall a good person, however even good people like yourself can be vehicles of terrible hatred and suffering. You smile at your neighbors, and then not only inadvertently advance, but actively propagate the atmosphere of fear, hatred, and suspicion in this country that often makes Muslims feel like second class citizens. Generalized platitudes are easy, understanding and love are much more difficult, but inevitable much more profitable

 

[R_not]

If you want to become a martyr, buy a ticket for Saudi Arabia, sneak to Mecca (non Muslims are not allwoed there, thank you!)
when all the Hajjis (pilgrims) are running around the stone building that contains an ancent pagan idol (the kaaba and the balck stone), stop, and start screaming out that Mohammed is a false prophet, and that you worship Christ as God, not the false god of the false prophet Mohammed. I GUARANTEE you will get our wish!

You don’t even have to do that - just do yell out that in an area that has a lot of muslims around and about. I wouldn’t put any money on one’s life being too long.

Look at the cartoons and the movie Fitna - innocents are killed for that who didn’t even have any tie to doing those things. And those who did do them have to have 24 hour guards now or go into hiding.

article on Danes dying in Pakistan - the embassy was blown up - June 2, 2008.
jihadwatch.org/archives/021351.php

Gee, how come no great outcry that innocents were killed - those who had nothing to do with the cartoons being killed from any others either in Denmark - but anywhere in the West - not a peep out of any ‘peaceful or moderate’ muslim in Europe, the USA, Canada, Australia, etc. And then if one insignificant muslim does get cornered they will give the standard, ‘we do not believe in the killing of innocents’ and then not say that there are no innocent infidels.

I guess you can read the disgust in my post. I find all these ‘moderates’ just as bad as the violent jihadists. All these ‘peaceful’ neighbors that everyone tells me about is just a facade. they know they are outnumbered and what does anyone expect?! When they grow in numbers - infidels better watch it because in the koran it says that doing anything against the infidel is a-ok.

 

[A_Sombra]

quote: I was speaking of the Muslims in Iraq. What happened to you on 9/11? My guess is that you probably sat somewhere watching the news. You sat and watched the US get seriously attacked on its own soil for the first time in decades. You didn’t know a single person that died there. The vast majority of Americans were essentially unaffected in their daily lives by the events of 9/11. How many Iraqi’s have lost their homes? How many Iraqi’s have lost a family member? a friend? The fact is that the vast majority of Iraqi’s have had their lives upended by you and I.

I wasnt watching TV-sorry your guess was wrong. Like most of your post. I did not run a plane into the Twin Towers; I did not vote for Bush; I did not agree with Bush’s War for Oil; I did not go to Iraq as a US soldier and upend anyone’s life; so, I have absolutely no idea of how I have upended any Iraqi’s life. You need to explain it a bit more plainly than you have-you know, cause-effect type of explanation. Otherwise you are just typing words and making no sense.
And, NO God did not make two sets of rules. God made one set-the rules for Mohammedans were made byu Mohammed-God had nothing at all to do with it!

 

[inJESUS]

Wth, just because many muslims are nice people, should you give a total blind eye to the ideologies triggering the millions of Muslims who you do not call nice?

just because my neighbor is a nice Muslim, i must forget that Hizbullah’s aim is to annihilate the Jews on the expense of all Lebanese people?

it wiuld be stupid to keep talking on that level of some nice Muslim neighbor or friend and wake up to some major dangerous ideologies.

 

[wth1257]

You don’t even have to do that - just do yell out that in an area that has a lot of muslims around and about. I wouldn’t put any money on one’s life being too long.

Look at the cartoons and the movie Fitna - innocents are killed for that who didn’t even have any tie to doing those things. And those who did do them have to have 24 hour guards now or go into hiding.

article on Danes dying in Pakistan - the embassy was blown up - June 2, 2008.
jihadwatch.org/archives/021351.php

Gee, how come no great outcry that innocents were killed - those who had nothing to do with the cartoons being killed from any others either in Denmark - but anywhere in the West - not a peep out of any ‘peaceful or moderate’ muslim in Europe, the USA, Canada, Australia, etc. And then if one insignificant muslim does get cornered they will give the standard, ‘we do not believe in the killing of innocents’ and then not say that there are no innocent infidels.

I guess you can read the disgust in my post. I find all these ‘moderates’ just as bad as the violent jihadists. All these ‘peaceful’ neighbors that everyone tells me about is just a facade. they know they are outnumbered and what does anyone expect?! When they grow in numbers - infidels better watch it because in the koran it says that doing anything against the infidel is a-ok.

I originally called you a “liar”, “Bigot” and a few other rude things, but I’m not going to lower myself to the sewer in which you reside, you are worthy neither of being taken seriously as a individual with a credible opinion, nor as a plausible representative of the Christian faith. I will be adding you to my ignore list and I would encourage everyone else to do the same

 

[R_not]

I already did earlier on this thread. I made some good points that no one addressed. Here it is again:

As for Saddam and what he has done… The modern state of Iraq was drawn together by the British empire. It is composed of many people who are not fond of each other. In order to control Iraq, he had to instill fear into all. Our own govenment documents from the 80’s admit that while Saddam had done some horrible things, he was a secular leader who had brought stability to one of the most volatile nations on Earth. Saddam was convicted and executed for the killing of many people in a village in which there was an assassination plot against him (in the 80’s, when we were his #1 supporters). What would Andrew Jackson have done if he found out that a certain group of Indians had attempted his assassination? My point is that all states are founded and maintained by violence. How bout the new Iraqi government? Torturing, kidnapping, etc. same ol stuff. It looks like al-Sadr may be one of the most powerful men in the new Iraq. Say what you will of Saddam, but he did a better job controlling the place than we have. And with much less to work with.

sort of like how we hop over the ocean and kill.

My short memory? Have you ever heard of an Iranian leader named Mossadegh? His democratic government was overthrown with help from the CIA. And then the US propped up the brutal Shah dictatorship that terrorized the Iranian people for 30 years.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Mossadegh

Here are some of the numerous relevant declassified CIA documents that show the details of what happened:

gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/

Just search “Mossadeq”

The Truth is not in all your silly little weblinks. Nor is the Truth in any of my weblinks. The Truth is taught to us in the Gospels friend, and it is decidedly different than what you are trying to teach here.

I only look to the news for facts. I interpret these facts in light of the Gospels. This is my “agenda”. Like I said to Arbito,
You have all this hatred for Islam and Muslims, yet your views are advocated throughout the Qur’an. And not in the Gospels which you claim to believe in.

PS: It is a good tactic for you to keep regurgitating the fact that there are so many Muslims who are full of hatred and rage, because when we begin to examine our own actions in light of what we are taught by Christ Jesus, your “agenda” and your rationalizations mean nothing. As I said before,

If your eye itches, pull out the plank.

There is no plank in my eye - I cannot say the same for you. As for Hussein - I cannot believe that you defend him. But, I suppose it figures.

A dead Hussein is much better for Iraqis. But, if you are into ‘hugging a thug’ right along with Carter, Glover, Penn, etc - go for it. I will not.

I don’t know where you hear your news - but Iraq is not only doing better economically, but their military and police are taking over much more. I guess it is dead silence for the left on this now because their agenda of ‘I hate Bush’ can’t be done with Iraq anymore. So, you tell me old mantras of the left.

Al Sadr is in hiding, as all cockroaches do when the light gets turned on. He is an Iranian puppet who knows his toady self will be one big target.

As for the Shah - that was a Carter debacle. Yep, you certainly proved your case there - NOT! Yes, the Shah was propped up by us and had to talk out of both sides of his face like Musharraf has to now.

This is getting inane. While you are trying to defend evil, such as Hussein and the Baathists - and then agree with muslims that it is everyone else’s fault that they have to kill - maybe you should read the post #97. It is written much better than I write it.

 

[wth1257]

Wth, just because many muslims are nice people, should you give a total blind eye to the ideologies triggering the millions of Muslims who you do not call nice?

just because my neighbor is a nice Muslim, i must forget that Hizbullah’s aim is to annihilate the Jews on the expense of all Lebanese people?

it wiuld be stupid to keep talking on that level of some nice Muslim neighbor or friend and wake up to some major dangerous ideologies.

She did not offer, in the OP and it’s continuation, a thoughtful, intelligent critique of Islamic Jurisprudence or just war theory, she libeled all Muslims.

I find some of Judaism’s blatant ethnocentric teachings unappealing, that is an acadamic dispute for me to have with Jewish theologians. If I went on a vulgar anti-semetic rant, I could not hide behind my legitimate grievances with some structural elements of the religions as justification for my slander against all Jews

 

[wth1257]

As for the Shah - that was a Carter debacle. Yep, you certainly proved your case there - NOT! Yes, the Shah was propped up by us and had to talk out of both sides of his face like Musharraf has to now.

Muhammad Mossadegh was overthrown my the CIA long before Carter ever took over, that was the handy work of Eisenhower and Churchill

 

[Ed_Rand]

I wasnt watching TV-sorry your guess was wrong. Like most of your post. I did not run a plane into the Twin Towers; I did not vote for Bush; I did not agree with Bush’s War for Oil; I did not go to Iraq as a US soldier and upend anyone’s life; so, I have absolutely no idea of how I have upended any Iraqi’s life. You need to explain it a bit more plainly than you have-you know, cause-effect type of explanation. Otherwise you are just typing words and making no sense.

If you are not a US citizen, then I was wrong and am sorry for assuming things. I you are a US citizen, and you still go to work to generate taxes for your government, you are directly responsible for what is going on in Iraq.

I thought that you were asserting that the Muslim on Muslim violence in Iraq was somehow not connected to the US invasion. If I have totally misunderstood you, I am truly sorry.

And, NO God did not make two sets of rules. God made one set-the rules for Mohammedans were made byu Mohammed-God had nothing at all to do with it!

I won’t even start with that…

 

[R_not]

You are a liar, a bigot, and a truly disgusting individual

So call me names - it is the usual thing that I have heard. It is easier to do that than to refute the facts that I posted.

As for disgusting - those who defend a ‘religion’ and worry about its image rather than start doing something about those who THEY say are distorting islam - well, I would say that they have the problem as do those who also appease them.

#1. I don’t lie on these threads.
#2. I could have lived until the day I died with muslims - but it wasn’t me who declared war on them - it was them who declared war on me. 9/11 just woke me up - after reading about attack after attack by them against us for years - even back when I was in the USMC.
#3. As for disgusting - well, yeah sometimes - I fart and burp and do things like that. It can be disgusting sometimes.

I applaud our brave troops who went in and liberated a land. Unlike the muslims who have imperialistic intentions on all our lands - we do not have that same intention. Our guys are there to keep the peace. Hussein attacked the Kurds, the Iranians, the Arabs, and he just couldn’t stop himself and he attacked his own people.

And as for muslims killing over cartoons - the real disgusting thing is that they killed an old nun - and so many others - and no outcry from any of the ‘moderates’. Not a peep. crickets. BUT, gee - say anything like the truth - and I get called names. tsk tsk tsk

Italian writer Oriana Fallaci, said: *“A moderate Islam does not exist. It does not exist because there is no difference between Good Islam and Bad Islam. There is Islam and that it the end of it. Islam is the Koran, and nothing other than the Koran.“ *(Oriana Fallaci”The Force of Reason” post-script page 305 February 2006)]
Wise and true words.

 

[A_Sombra]

quote: You are a liar, a bigot, and a truly disgusting individual

Why do you say that? I also heard no outcry from Mohammedans about the innocent people in the Dansh embassy who were killed-did you?

Why does a CARTOON excuse outright murder? What do you call the inhuman insane radical Mohammedans who killed people because a cartoon was published in a newspaper in the country they happened to be from?

This is my entire point-Christians persecuted in Egypt-nothing much is said anywhere; Christians persecuted in NIgeria-nothing much is said anywhere. These are people DYING-yet, a newspaper publishes a CARTOON and it is a killing matter! Death to the cartiin makers, to the cartoon newspaper, ans to everybody thatlives in the country where the cartoon appeared it seems! Yeh- the poor persecuted Muslims-I am about to cry!
Boo Hoo!

 

[R_not]

If you are not a US citizen, then I was wrong and am sorry for assuming things. I you are a US citizen, and you still go to work to generate taxes for your government, you are directly responsible for what is going on in Iraq.

I thought that you were asserting that the Muslim on Muslim violence in Iraq was somehow not connected to the US invasion. If I have totally misunderstood you, I am truly sorry.

I won’t even start with that…

The muslim on muslim violence in Iraq - and elsewhere is perpetrated by muslims themselves. Not any outside force. But they like blaming the West, the Jews, the Christians, etc - basically anyone except themselves for their poor behavior.

Read the koran, hadiths and about mohammed - it is all in there.

Italian writer Oriana Fallaci, said: *“A moderate Islam does not exist. It does not exist because there is no difference between Good Islam and Bad Islam. There is Islam and that it the end of it. Islam is the Koran, and nothing other than the Koran.“ *(Oriana Fallaci”The Force of Reason” post-script page 305 February 2006)]
Wise and true words.

 

[A_Sombra]

The United States should wake up, and it should wake up now! Muslim organizations here in the United States have spoke of their determination to keep their countrymen and co-religionists coming to this country, hopefully until they can constitute a majority, and then place a Muslim United States under Sharia-they have told us their plan. So what are we going to do?Sit back and watch it happen? I say NO!

If this country has any will to survive AT ALL, it should do two things immediately-return ALL foreign Mohammedans to their countries of origin; DO NOT allow any more foreign Mohammedans into this country for any reason whatsoever.

Theyhave spoken, they have told us what they want to do-lets stop it before its too late!

 

[wth1257]

Christians persecuted in NIgeria-nothing much is said anywhere.

A great deal is said about the Civil war the is presently going on and fueling much of the conflict

These are people DYING-yet, a newspaper publishes a CARTOON and it is a killing matter! Death to the cartiin makers, to the cartoon newspaper, ans to everybody thatlives in the country where the cartoon appeared it seems!

There was extensive coverage of the horrific murders that resulted from that cartoon.

People like you and that other…gentleman, don’t really care about these people, it’s just fodder to fuel your hate.

Yeh- the poor persecuted Muslims-I am about to cry!
Boo Hoo!

What a splendid Christian you are! Do you receive the Eucharist with the same tongue you use to mock the horrific suffering of Muslims in Iraq, Palestine, Bosnia, Somalia et cetera?

 

[wth1257]

The United States should wake up, and it should wake up now! Muslim organizations here in the United States have spoke of their determination to keep their countrymen and co-religionists coming to this country, hopefully until they can constitute a majority, and then place a Muslim United States under Sharia-they have told us their plan. So what are we going to do?Sit back and watch it happen? I say NO!

If this country has any will to survive AT ALL, it should do two things immediately-return ALL foreign Mohammedans to their countries of origin; DO NOT allow any more foreign Mohammedans into this country for any reason whatsoever.

Theyhave spoken, they have told us what they want to do-lets stop it before its too late!

THE TERM IS “MUSLIM”