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Socrates92
Guest
Also don’t assume collections will be flowing at normal levels.
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Socrates92
Guest
I agree. These are both important things to do.
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Maximus1
Guest
May first may be to early.
Japan reopened and the outcome this week was a disastrous flare up of infection and need to close.
Once you close a second time, the damage to the economy is much worse.
And of course there are all the new dead people the decision generates
Japan reopened and the outcome this week was a disastrous flare up of infection and need to close.
Once you close a second time, the damage to the economy is much worse.
And of course there are all the new dead people the decision generates
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whatistrue
Guest
I don’t think anyone is saying it won’t be bad. Maybe even historically bad. No one is saying the recovery will be instant, or that it will be as if there was never a problem as soon as the isolation protocols are over. But what some are saying is that the alternative would be even worse.
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TheLittleLady
Guest
This is contrary to our Faith. Protecting life from conception til natural death is more important than “the economy”
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Anrakyr
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No we aren’t.
Millions of people will die. That’s not an exaggeration that’s a fact. Virus has a mortality of 5-10% healthcare permitting. Even if you assume half the world population is too remote to reach 40 million people will die if we do nothing.
Do you want a ressession or mass graves?
Maybe in the US. Don’t make your poorly structured government our problem.
No one rightly believes this.
Remember polio? We expect that, even if the virus burns though there will be pockets burning back up until we get a vaccine. That’s our new normal.
Better that then bodies in bags.
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tafan2
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Your parish must have a heck of a cash reserve. There were parishes around here that had to furlough employees before the SBA loans became available. Money doesn’t grow on tress, and there were parishes that literally were broke. No money at all. I understand that most of them are doing their applications now and that will save a lot of parish jobs. Some of the more wealthy parishes get over 50% of their donations online, so they are doing better. Other parishes have seen a 95% drop in revenue.
Schools are faring a little better since tuition is still being paid.
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tafan2
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“the economy” is just a part of society, its how we interact and exchange goods and services. It had to be a balanced approach. THe idea that we just need to stay locked up indefinitely simply won’t work. It is an idea, IMO, born by people who live in somewhat of a “financial bubble”, they can work at home and are the professional class and are still getting paid just fine. They don’t realize how many families are having trouble simply buying food. We do things all the time, due to our economy, that cause people to die. We fly from city to city, we drive down the high way, we build skyscrapers. It all has to be balanced, make it as safe as possibleo but carry on with our lives. This is no different.
So while the sentiment expressed by @HomeschoolDad is a little blunt, it is not contrary to our faith.
So while the sentiment expressed by @HomeschoolDad is a little blunt, it is not contrary to our faith.
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TheLittleLady
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No, we live in an area of poverty, a tourist town which has been shut down because of the virus. God has provided each week what we need. Parishes in our Diocese have begun to receive their forgivable loans from SBA, ours will be here within a few days.
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tafan2
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Well, your parish was luck to have enough cash to make payroll. Some were not.
We need to get/keep our economy going but we can do things in steps.
The thing to remember is that there is not --NOR SHOULD THERE BE-- a one size, er, one location, only way of doing things.
There are just too many variables based on types of jobs, types of living situations, etc. to make all encompassing rules.
Trying to treat all people and situations “equally” is not noble. Sometimes it is just stupidity.
The thing to remember is that there is not --NOR SHOULD THERE BE-- a one size, er, one location, only way of doing things.
There are just too many variables based on types of jobs, types of living situations, etc. to make all encompassing rules.
Trying to treat all people and situations “equally” is not noble. Sometimes it is just stupidity.
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What is a “moral wrong”? Is that another way of saying “sin”?
Your situation is similar to mine. I, myself, am big and robust with an excellent immune system. I take care of myself and get the best nutrition possible. I rarely get sick, and when I do, I slough it off very quickly. My parents are another story. While they are not deathly ill, they are disabled and in their late 80s. My son is lower-percentile body weight and doesn’t have my kind of resistance. I could probably get CV, feel a little puny for a few days, then be back to normal with antibodies acquired on top of that. But then there is the issue of making my family sick. I can’t take that chance, and Deo gratias, I am not in life circumstances where I have to be out in public constantly.
I don’t see how in the world they are ever going to reopen schools in the short term. You cannot social distance in schools. Schools are Petri dishes anyway, by their very nature, and I have noticed that my son does not get sick nearly as often since we started homeschooling two years ago. In fact, he hasn’t picked up any “bugs”, or flu, or anything like that. We did all get the flu back when I was working on a temporary contract job a couple of years ago — evidently I brought it home with me — but that is the last time I’ve worked, and we have all stayed well since then. If this rolls into the next school year, and schools are still doing the home-study thing, I think it’s going to be a fair question for private-school parents, Catholic and otherwise, to begin to say “and we are paying $10K per year for what?”.
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tafan2
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First of all, I agree that too many people are in denial, or just don’t realize, how bad the economy is going to be hurt. It is devastating.
Secondly, if the virus magically disappeared in May and the economy opened back up, I do think we would recover fairly quickly. The effect will be there for years, but in a more subtle form. We would likely turn into Japan, not much economic growth for a couple of decades, but we would muddle thought.
As to how it will actually end up, I am very concerned. There we may be in a depression for years, with high unemployment lasting a long time. The best case to hope for may be a Japanese scenario, people go back to work reasonably quickly but no real economic growth for years. It could be mitigated if we were to target a growing population, via immigration, but I do not thing we will be that smart or as the impact will be quite lagging from the policy decision and implementation.
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tafan2
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Yes to all of your quote. What we need to do right away is change the question from “what is essential” to “what can be done safely”.
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F_Marturana
Guest
Oh my goodness, thank you.
Until we can test and identify silent carriers large scale, how can we sentence so many to die a painful, agonizing, and lonely death. Covid patients are dying away from their loved ones.
How can we tell the weakest among us, the old, the immuno-compromised, the sick, that they don’t matter, that money matters more.
Ethically, I can decide to sacrifice my life to save someone else. How can we ask others to sacrifice themselves ?
Until we can test and identify silent carriers large scale, how can we sentence so many to die a painful, agonizing, and lonely death. Covid patients are dying away from their loved ones.
How can we tell the weakest among us, the old, the immuno-compromised, the sick, that they don’t matter, that money matters more.
Ethically, I can decide to sacrifice my life to save someone else. How can we ask others to sacrifice themselves ?
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Anrakyr
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That already is the case.
Yes/No/Not Quiet.
You can have an action that is neutral, picking up a rock. Neither virtuous not a sin.
If you pick up a rock in the presence of someone it can be taken as a threat.
As society is it would be morally wrong to take other peoples Heath in your hands with leaving your home.
Leaving you home isn’t a sin, calling it one is a over simplification.
No one is saying this.
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ontheway1
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News item:
Sweden is not doing any lockdowns. People are leaidng normal lives. Danmark has just re-opened its elemntary schools.
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tafan2
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No it is not. There are lots of jobs around here that can be done safely which are not considered essential. City’s building inspection and planning departments are shut down, which has a cascading effect through the construction industry. Hospitals have largely shutdown and are actually furloughing employees. I don’t understand why many medical tests cannot be performed. Quest Diagnostics announced that they were having to furlough employees. What is the ultimate danger for those being closed? The rule here is non-essential businesses have to stay at home.
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tafan2
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Not by their words, but certainly by the policies being implemented and advocated.
This would be an excellent question for someone to ask our Commander-in-Chief at one of those daily press conferences on live national TV. Of course, you’d get called a terrible reporter and your press pass would be revoked. Sticks and stones…
OK, I see what you are saying, something that is not intrinsically wrong, but could become wrong/evil/sinful depending upon circumstances. Opening a can of tuna fish and eating it is morally neutral. Opening the can of tuna fish that you’ve stolen from a poor person, and that was the only food they had left to eat, and eating it yourself while the poor person goes hungry, that’s another story.HomeschoolDad:
Yes/No/Not Quiet.
You can have an action that is neutral, picking up a rock. Neither virtuous not a sin.
If you pick up a rock in the presence of someone it can be taken as a threat.
As society is it would be morally wrong to take other peoples Heath in your hands with leaving your home.
Leaving you home isn’t a sin, calling it one is a over simplification.
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