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olds442
Guest
I was a catholic for forty two years before I left.
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CWBetts
Guest
May God have mercy on your soul for abandoning Him.
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jmcrae
Guest
It is simply a case of Jesus making and keeping His promises to those to whom He has made them.
A Fundamentalist might say, “If you pray the Sinner’s Prayer, Jesus will come to you and live in your heart for the rest of Eternity.”
Does he mean by this that the words of the Sinner’s Prayer are a magical incantation that Jesus cannot help but obey? That any mere sinner can “command” Jesus to forgive him, and come to stay with him in his heart?
Or is it more likely that he means that the Sinner’s Prayer contains the sentiments that Jesus has promised that He will respond to, whenever anyone expresses this desire to repent of their sins and come to know His ways?
I am thinking that our Fundamentalist friend has in mind that Jesus is faithful to His promises, rather than that any mere sinner can “make” Jesus forgive him, on command.
It’s the same thing here - people are using hyperbolic language to describe how it is that, having commanded His priests to do these things and say these words, Christ is faithful to His promise that He fulfills, whenever they do these things.
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jmcrae
Guest
The Catholic Church is like a big playground with a fence around it. Inside the playground are all kinds of ideas and different kinds of spirituality, and all manner of good deeds that we can do.
Outside the fence are things we can’t touch - heresies, falsehoods, schisms, sins, and the like.
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
That appears to say, ‘The world is without God’s true Church.’ Would you care to share your opinion of a Church without any disagreements?
Christ knew He would not remain on earth, in a physical form, to personally lead His Church. Christ knew ‘men’ would do this. He chose Judas, Peter, Thomas and others. Others who constantly questioned His teachings, Judas who betrayed Him, Peter who denied Him and Thomas who doubted Him.
Mat 23:1 Then Jesus spoke to the multitudes and to his disciples,
Mat 23:2 Saying: The scribes and the Pharisees have sitten on the chair of Moses.
Mat 23:3 All things therefore whatsoever they shall say to you, observe and do: but according to their works do ye not. For they say, and do not.
Christ showed confidence that God’s truth could be trusted through ‘sinful’ men. He taught to listen to those who sat in Moses’ seat, as they taught the old covenant. Christ knew He was building a new Church, with a new and everlasting covenant, and He knew ‘men’ were going to be in authority over His Church, just as those who sat upon the seat of Moses were in authority over the Temple.
As He had confidence that God’s truth could be protected, even through sinful men, we have to have faith in His confidence and promises.
**Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you. And behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world. **
Christ is with us ALL, until the consummation of the world. That statement was not limited to those He appointed, as He knew they would all die a mortal death eventually.
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CWBetts
Guest
Translation: Nobody take this personally, but I am going to insult the Church in the most hypocritical way possible.
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olds442
Guest
I never left God. God is across the Street at The Lutheran church as well. God is not Catholic or Methodist he is wherever two or three are gathered in his name
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CWBetts
Guest
Ok. Then why did you leave the fullness of truth for some watered-down partial truth?
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Ignatius
Guest
I certainly wouldn’t encourage anyone to leave, but if they are determined to leave but if they will not accept the Truth then : From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.Ignatius:
One should never be encouraged to leave the True Church.
It is truly a tragedy whenever someone leaves Christ and His Church for whatever reason.
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olds442
Guest
My faith is is as strong as it ever was. It is by your defintion that my faith is watered down or a part of the truth.
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Guyonthestreet
Guest
That’s an interesting point actually.
I’ve struggled with posting here lately as I’ve stopped attending RCIA - but I struggle with what exactly to post here now, as I’m acutely aware that my negativity may impact on someone going through the same searchign process as me, and lead them astray, and I don’t want that for them.
Equally, this is a non catholic part of the forum so as long as the rules are respected and adhered to - why not criticise the catholic church and point out why for someone, it isn’t and can’t be the church for them.
Hmmmm…
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LindaSK
Guest
Maybe I missed it, but why exactly did you stop attending RCIA?
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CWBetts
Guest
All non-Catholic faiths are incomplete. It is the Catholic Church alone that possesses the fullness of truth. Everyone else only has a portion. Some are more full than others. Lutherans, for example, have a stronger access to Truth than Baptists, who in turn have more than Muslims, who in turn have more than Buddhists. It is not my personal standard. I fully believe that anyone who is truly searching for Truth will never leave the Church.
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Priscilla_Ann
Guest
So do you believe that former Catholics who join a non-Catholic Christian church go to hell? Is that what the Catholic Church teaches?
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CWBetts
Guest
I am not so arrogant as to judge the state of another’s soul. That being said, no non-Catholic faith has the fullness of truth. And a Catholic who leaves the Faith has much more to answer for than a Protestant who never learned the teachings of Holy Mother Church.
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Priscilla_Ann
Guest
Actually, the former Catholics I know who have embraced non-Catholic Christianity are much more committed to Christ than when they were Catholic. Nearly all of them left the Catholic Church after confessing faith in Christ alone. As for myself, it was my Catholic pride that kept me from leaving the Catholic Church sooner than I did. Believe it or not, I was once just as proud of Catholicism as you are! What a humbling experience to admit that I needed to trust in Christ alone for my salvation!
Only God knows our hearts; and thankfully, God is the judge – not the Catholic Church.
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Pixie_Dust
Guest
The official teaching is that if a person knows/believes that the Catholic Church is the Church founded by Christ and contains the fullness of the faith, and yet refuses to join/walks away from the Catholic Church, they cannot be saved. Not all Catholics who walk away from the Church know or believe that, so they may still be saved. It’s up to God to judge them. The Catholic Church never has and never will declare anyone to be in Hell. The Church can warn you that if you do/don’t do this, that, or the other you are in danger of going to Hell, but that’s all. The Church can’t read your heart and know what you believe - that’s God’s job and it’s best to let Him do it.
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CWBetts
Guest
If you thing that the Catholic Church does not “preach Christ and Him crucified” then you were woefully ignorant of your own faith. The Head of the Catholic Church is Jesus Christ. To suggest otherwise is to misrepresent Holy Mother Church.
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Guyonthestreet
Guest
No you didn’t miss it because I didn’t say - but now you ask:
In no particular order of importance and as briefly as possible:
The lack of evidence in catholics lives around me of their catholic faith - the sunday brigade.
The hypocracy - telling others how to live their lives while the statistics from the church’s own research shows the vast majority of catholics (in name) contracept, engage in premarital sex, abort, and are either ambivolent to, or plain don’t believe in transubstantiation.
The abuse - and the evil and contrived way the leaders of the church piled pain upon pain on the victims calling them liars, crooks, gold diggers, opportunists, while covering up hard evidence to the truth the victims told.
Papal infallability.
The Filioque.
Marionology.
RICA itself - it became apparent that the class was not about asking questions and getting answers, buut about being fed information which you signed up to. I had read more of the catechism than the catechist !!!
That will do for starters.
I don’t regret the time I spend in RICA. I met some good people. But it’s not for me.
So what to do now? Who knows.
I feel like I’m back in a hole - nightsights on - waiting and watching for the next sound, because that sound, and my reaction to it, will determine what happens next, and whether I will be dead or alive at the end of it.
Only this time it’s spiritual.
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Gabriel_of_12
Guest
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