I came across another statement by the current Pope concerning Protestants and Protestantism that is of a different character than his most recent ones.
"Ultimately it is due to the fact that there is no appropriate category in Catholic thought for the phenomenon of Protestantism today (one could say the same of the relationship to the separated churches of the East).
It is obvious that the old category of ‘heresy’ is no longer of any value. Heresy, for Scripture and the early Church, includes the idea of a personal decision against the unity of the Church, and
heresy’s characteristic is pertinacia, the obstinacy of him who persists in his own private way. This, however, cannot be regarded as an appropriate description of the spiritual situation of the Protestant Christian. In the course of a now centuries-old history, Protestantism has made an important contribution to the realization of Christian faith, fulfilling a positive function in the development of the Christian message and, above all, often giving rise to a sincere and profound faith in the individual non-Catholic Christian,
whose separation from the Catholic affirmation has nothing to do with the pertinacia characteristic of heresy. Perhaps we may here invert a saying of St. Augustine’s: that an old schism becomes a heresy. The very passage of time alters the character of a division, so that an old division is something essentially different from a new one. Something that was once rightly condemned as heresy cannot later simply become true, but it can gradually develop its own positive ecclesial nature, with which
the individual is presented as his church and in which he lives as a believer, not as a heretic. This organization of one group, however, ultimately has an effect on the whole.
The conclusion is inescapable, then: Protestantism today is something different from heresy in the traditional sense, a phenomenon whose true theological place has not yet been determined.”
“The Meaning of Christian Brotherhood,” pp. 87-88.
I think this is the first time I’ve ever said this, but here it is: Thanks, Pope Benedict XVI! Let’s take these one at a time. I have, on numerous occasions, been referred to as a heretic due to the fact that I am a Protestant. I have also, and quite recently, been referred to as “obstinate” (dauphin, with buffalo seconding the motion), and then more recently by w_stewart. To that I quote this from your pope.
[SIGN]“Heresy, for Scripture and the early Church, includes the idea of a personal decision against the unity of the Church, and heresy’s characteristic is pertinacia, the obstinacy of him who persists in his own private way. This, however, cannot be regarded as an appropriate description of the spiritual situation of the Protestant Christian.”[/SIGN]
Read the sign right above this and decide for yourselves (especially Dauphin) if you’d like to amend your statement- specifically, this one:
“God does not raise to heaven those who separate themselves from the Church in an obstinate way or who culpably fail to enter it.”
You were referring to Protestants who allegedly separate themselves from the Church in an obstinate way. All that is left for you to say now is “Oops”- unless you wish to suggest that Pope Benedict XVI was in error when he said the exact opposite of what you believe. Let me know which one your choose.
That takes care of the Protestant on the individual level. But what about Protestantism as a whole?
[SIGN]“The conclusion is inescapable, then: Protestantism today is something different from heresy in the traditional sense, a phenomenon whose true theological place has not yet been determined.”[/SIGN]This obviously doesn’t mean I’m going to submit myself to papal authority and give my full assent to everything he says. But all of you do, so that puts you in a bit of an interesting situation. My issue to work on at this point is reconciling these kinds of statements from the Pope with his more recent ones that I reference in the OP, and it has been helpful to see all of your reactions and responses, especially the material from Dominus Iesus. Thanks to you guys I no longer see Pope Benedict XVI as the Protestant-condemner I once thought he was.
For the moment, though, I still see Genesis315, Dauphin, Buffalo, duckbill, centralfljames, paul c, w_stewart, underhill, and SteveGC as people who have a different issue: you claim that you espouse Catholic doctrine while simultaneously standing in direct contradiction of the statements of your pope quoted earlier in this post.
In other words, all of the individuals just listed take it for granted that Protestantism is heresy and that Protestants are heretics, and some of these individuals have stated quite plainly that due to this very presupposition, Protestants can’t be in heaven (see posts 9, 10, 17, 39, 59, 85, 95). For all of you who happen to see this, know that the next time you call me a heretic or Protestantism heresy, you will be confronted with this statement from your Pope, among others:
[SIGN]Heresy, for Scripture and the early Church, includes the idea of a personal decision against the unity of the Church, and heresy’s characteristic is pertinacia, the obstinacy of him who persists in his own private way.
This, however, cannot be regarded as an appropriate description of the spiritual situation of the Protestant Christian.[/SIGN]
See what you can do with that. And please do take his advice and stop regarding the label “heretic” as an appropriate description of my spiritual situation. Not only is it dead wrong, but the Pope says it cannot be regarded as an appropriate description. I know you won’t listen to me (because many of you will somehow go on saying I’m a heretic), but at least listen to your pope.
Don’t ever call me a heretic again. Do we have an understanding?
) that Protestantism has gone on so long it is hard to call it a typical heresy, i.e. in the traditional sense.