Romney stands by message in secret video

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rlg94086 said:
Cardinal Dolan made it clear that Romney’s Mormonism was not a reason to not vote for the man. Starsmurf, and others, provide it as the primary reason. Whom do you agree with - the Cardinal or the bigoted posters?
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I am not in any way bigoted. I find that a most hurtful and un-Christian assertion. Simply because I do not agree with your political views doesn’t make me a bigot. I’ve had to endure real bigotry in my converting to Catholicism, so you obviously don’t even understand what it is.

Cardinal Dolan may not understand the Mormon faith’s teachings with regard to abortion, contraception and divorce. The Cardinal is obviously very learned in the Catholic faith, he does not seem to be learned in the Mormon one (understandably).
 
seekerz said:
What is “not true”? Seriously, you write a 6-paragraph post to convince me that I see a difference which I have clearly stated that I don’t see? I don’t need a road map to find (or express) what is in MY OWN mind. I don’t see a difference between the two candidates on abortion, based on their faith - I stand by that.
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Im sure you do stand by that. I think this is pertinent to your response(or lack of one)

“…for thirty-five years I’ve watched prominent “pro-choice” Catholics justify themselves with the kind of moral and verbal gymnastics that should qualify as an Olympic event. All they’ve really done is capitulate to Roe v. Wade.”

Read more: blog.beliefnet.com/pontifications/2008/08/while-cardinal-george-the-pres.html#ixzz27Uw9rrQ3

Archbishop Charles Chaput
 
seekerz said:
Yet you have failed to cite a single news (or other reliable) source for allegations of a personal nature that you freely made against the president.

That’s all it really boils down to: failing to back with objective proof the words you presented as fact.
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Agreed.

Just as I don’t cite a source to “prove” Santa Clause doesn’t deliver presents around the world every Christmas either. But then usually I’m dealing with more knowledgeable company.
 
starsmurf said:
I am not in any way bigoted. I find that a most hurtful and un-Christian assertion. Simply because I do not agree with your political views doesn’t make me a bigot. I’ve had to endure real bigotry in my converting to Catholicism, so you obviously don’t even understand what it is.

Cardinal Dolan may not understand the Mormon faith’s teachings with regard to abortion, contraception and divorce. The Cardinal is obviously very learned in the Catholic faith, he does not seem to be learned in the Mormon one (understandably).
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Starsmurf, I may not agree with how you apply some of what you know about Mormonism, but I have to agree that my own research has shown me things which gave me pause. There are just some basics of faith which cannot be compromised on - and no, for those of you poised to type the question - they have nothing to do with abortion. They have to do with such basic Catechism facts such as “Who is God”, “Where is God”… and other beliefs pertaining to God and His interaction with human beings.

While I do not believe that religious identity is a criterion on which to judge someone’s suitability for office, I do believe that it gives us insight into who candidates are as people. For the life of me, after the stuff that various politicians have gotten pounded on for listening to while sitting in pews over the years, I can’t believe the pass that Romney is getting - from Catholics, no less. Yet Pastors Wright and Hagee were fair game…why again?
 
starsmurf said:
I am not in any way bigoted. I find that a most hurtful and un-Christian assertion. Simply because I do not agree with your political views doesn’t make me a bigot. I’ve had to endure real bigotry in my converting to Catholicism, so you obviously don’t even understand what it is.

Cardinal Dolan may not understand the Mormon faith’s teachings with regard to abortion, contraception and divorce. The Cardinal is obviously very learned in the Catholic faith, he does not seem to be learned in the Mormon one (understandably).
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Disagreeing politically is not bigoted. If you were posting about Romney’s political views or even hos values, you would have a valid point. Instead, you are dismissing a Cardinal’s, and at least one Archbishop (Chaput) as being more knowledgable than you and putting your bigoted position ahead of their clear statements.
 
seekerz said:
While I do not believe that religious identity is a criterion on which to judge someone’s suitability for office, I do believe that it gives us insight into who candidates are as people. For the life of me, after the stuff that various politicians have gotten pounded on for listening to while sitting in pews over the years, I can’t believe the pass that Romney is getting - from Catholics, no less. Yet Pastors Wright and Hagee were fair game…why again?
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Interesting. So, you agree with the protestations over Pastor Wright? Or, do you just believe two wrongs make a right?
 
starsmurf said:
I am not in any way bigoted. I find that a most hurtful and un-Christian assertion. Simply because I do not agree with your political views doesn’t make me a bigot. I’ve had to endure real bigotry in my converting to Catholicism, so you obviously don’t even understand what it is.

Cardinal Dolan may not understand the Mormon faith’s teachings with regard to abortion, contraception and divorce. The Cardinal is obviously very learned in the Catholic faith, he does not seem to be learned in the Mormon one (understandably).
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Really???
 
SamH said:
Agreed.

Just as I don’t cite a source to “prove” Santa Clause doesn’t deliver presents around the world every Christmas either. But then usually I’m dealing with more knowledgeable company.
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You generally can’t prove a negative Sam, we’re been down that road once before.

However, if you are claiming events as positive occurrences, as in your reference to the economic circumstances of POTUS’ family and his contribution or lack thereof, then you need to prove it’s true or present it as your unfounded personal OPINION.
 
estesbob said:
Im sure you do stand by that. I think this is pertinent to your response(or lack of one)

“…for thirty-five years I’ve watched prominent “pro-choice” Catholics justify themselves with the kind of moral and verbal gymnastics that should qualify as an Olympic event. All they’ve really done is capitulate to Roe v. Wade.”

Read more: blog.beliefnet.com/pontifications/2008/08/while-cardinal-george-the-pres.html#ixzz27Uw9rrQ3

Archbishop Charles Chaput
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Do I owe you a response? You have your stance, I have mine. I never demanded an explanation from you.

I know what my faith teaches and what it does not teach. I also educated myself on what Mormonism teaches. I see a big difference between those two sets of teaching, regarding unborn life and its sanctity, as well as regarding other basic tenets of faith.

Now I think I’ll just go read the Pied Piper just so that I remember the moral of the story…
 
rlg94086 said:
Yes, two wrongs. You are defending one now, so you must have been okay with the other…or just hypocritical.
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Wrong. I’m asking why one was pounced on in 2004 while the other one is being firmly swept under the carpet now (except of course the fit is so bad that it’s like trying to cover an elephant with a postage stamp). 🤷
 
seekerz said:
You generally can’t prove a negative Sam, we’re been down that road once before.

However, if you are claiming events as positive occurrences, as in your reference to the economic circumstances of POTUS’ family and his contribution or lack thereof, then you need to prove it’s true or present it as your unfounded personal OPINION.
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My opinion is that you are uniformed or disingenuous. The events I spoke of concerning the president are common knowledge and documented fact.
 
SamH said:
My opinion is that you are uniformed or disingenuous. The events I spoke of concerning the president are common knowledge and documented fact.
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Documented where, by who? Sam, Sam…if I were truly uninformed, you would be doing a terrible job of correcting that.
 
seekerz said:
Wrong. I’m asking why one was pounced on in 2004 while the other one is being firmly swept under the carpet now (except of course the fit is so bad that it’s like trying to cover an elephant with a postage stamp). 🤷
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I haven’t seen a video of a Mormon leader whose anti-American views Romney has been listening to in the pews. Do you have one?

I’m a values voter, not a bigot. I will vote for someone of a different faith, even if they are anti-Catholic (plenty of our presidents have been), as long as they share my values. Obama does not share my values.
 
rlg94086 said:
I haven’t seen a video of a Mormon leader whose anti-American views Romney has been listening to in the pews. Do you have one?

I’m a values voter, not a bigot. I will vote for someone of a different faith, even if they are anti-Catholic (plenty of our presidents have been), as long as they share my values. Obama does not share my values.
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Oh, so anti-American is the standard? I guess that makes sense. Not anti-any group of Amerians… that explains it. So those ‘values’ you talk about, are they secular ones as well?
 
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