Science Says I’m In The Back Of The COVID Vaccine Line, But Government And Corporations Will Force Me Through It

[Cathoholic]

Everest on new corona virus vaccine safety . . . .

THEY KNOW IT IS SAFE.

You do understand that you are making a blanket statement concerning over a dozen worldwide vaccines right?

The next question is: “How do you know”?

And WHY should a young person take any corona virus vaccine?

The chance of death for the young is less than influenza.

 

[Everest]

You do understand that you are making a blanket statement concerning over a dozen worldwide vaccines right?

The next question is: “How do you know”?

Stop being silly. I am talking about the Pfizer vaccine. Even a 5 year old would have known that!!

 

[Cathoholic]

Everest addressing the question with admixed insults to me (“Even a 5 year old would have known that!!”)

I am talking about the Pfizer vaccine. Even a 5 year old would have known that!!

How wold I know which vaccine you are talking about?

Good grief.

Which brings me right back to part of my original post to you:

HOW do you know the vaccine is “safe”?

 

[Everest]

HOW do you know the vaccine is “safe”?

Because ALL the medical experts have reviewed the data and said it is safe. FDA have also authorised it as have authorities in other countries,
They have specified who it is safe for and which groups should not get it.
Good grief. You sound like a Trump person who is anti-science!!

 

[Cathoholic]

Everest insisting he knows the vaccine he is referring to is safe because he/she claims others said it is, mixed in with more insults (“You sound like a . . . person who is anti-science!!”)

.

Because ALL the medical experts have reviewed the data and said it is safe. FDA have also authorised it as have authorities in other countries,
They have specified who it is safe for and which groups should not get it.
Good grief. You sound like a Trump person who is anti-science!!

Link it please.

I want to see it myself.

I want to see . . . .

• ALL the medical experts have reviewed the data and said it is safe
• FDA have also authorised it (This one I already know so you don’t need to post that)
• As have authorities in other countries (WHO are they? And . . . What other countries?)
• They have specified who it is safe for and which groups should not get it. (OK. Who is THAT and WHY?)

 

[Everest]

Link it please.

I want to see it myself.

Link what?? The FDA authorisation??

In case you are blind and deaf and have not seen or listened to any tv news for at least two weeks then you are just being silly again.
People who have severe allergies should not take it. Pregnant or breastfeeding women have a choice but should talk to their doctors first. If they are in high risk situations (e.g. a health worker) they may choose to take it. It should not be given to anyone under the age of 16 (trials did not include this group).
The UK and Canada have approved its use.
The EU is going through the approval process now.

You know all this but are just playing games.

 

[CradleRC58]

If you don’t want the vaccine just don’t get it. My doctor called me today to tell me my antibody test is positive. I had a somewhat mild case of Covid in early Nov.

He told me not to think the positive result means I’m immune to Covid now. And told me to distance, mask, and keep my hands clean until the vaccine is available.

I asked if the vaccine is mandatory. He said no, it would be unethical for any doctor to tell a patient it’s mandatory and don’t worry about any conspiracy theories. He added that in the US, physicians are actually planning on around 60 % of their patients wanting the vaccine.

I trust him. Anything he’s ever told me I’ve found to be true after I looked into it.

 

[Cathoholic]

CradleRC58 on throwing off mitigation now that CradleRC58 KNOWS that they have antibody against corona virus . . . .

He told me not to think the positive result means I’m immune to Covid now. And told me to distance, mask, and keep my hands clean until the vaccine is available.

Well hang onto your mask AFTER “the vaccine is available” too.

.

Published 2 days ago

Can I stop wearing a mask after getting a COVID-19 vaccine?​

Moncef Slaoui, head of the U.S. vaccine development effort, has estimated the US could reach herd immunity by May, based on the effectiveness of the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines if enough people are vaccinated​

Associated Press

Can I stop wearing a mask after getting a COVID-19 vaccine?

No. For a couple reasons, masks and social distancing will still be recommended for some time after people are vaccinated.

To start, the first coronavirus vaccines require two shots; Pfizer’s second dose comes three weeks after the first and Moderna’s comes after four weeks. And the effect of vaccinations generally aren’t immediate. . . .

. . . .It’s also not yet known whether the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines protect people from infection entirely, or just from symptoms. That means vaccinated people might still be able to get infected and pass the virus on . . .

. . . Moncef Slaoui, head of the U.S. vaccine development effort, has estimated the country could reach herd immunity as early as May, based on the effectiveness of the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines. That’s assuming there are no problems meeting manufacturers’ supply estimates, and enough people step forward to be vaccinated.

Can I stop wearing a mask after getting a COVID-19 vaccine? | Fox News

Can I stop wearing a mask after getting a COVID-19 vaccine? | Fox News

Also . . .

. . . Fuller also noted vaccine testing is just starting in children, who won’t be able to get shots until study data indicates they’re safe and effective for them as well. . . .

I have no idea WHY you’d even want to give a child shots of this?!

Children have almost nothing for morbidity and mortality with corona virus. They do not even vector it efficiently (which is part of WHY schools are opening back up).

.

Either the principles of these people will have to change mandating mere mitigation as widespread as they have, . . . .

. . . . or this is going to have to be PERMANENT.

 

[CradleRC58]

Of course I’m going to wear a mask until this pandemic winds down. I’m high risk and already dodged a bullet, maybe. There hasn’t been enough time to know all the traits of the virus. I saw an article that noted some doctors in India want to know if this virus can lay dormant in someone like the herpes virus for example.

Covid is the number one cause of deaths in the US as of a couple of weeks ago. And if the surge doesn’t wane soon we are going to see an increase in refridgerated trailers full of bodies.

So yea, Uncle Sam doesn’t need to force me to wear a mask. The bozos who think they don’t need to mask or social distance are enough to motivate me to wear a mask and stay away from them.

It would be easy for me to say “I had Covid and I’m high risk. I survived it so it must not be as bad as they say” But why ? Why would I do that even if I believed it ? I’m not because cherry picking articles and studies for a year doesn’t qualify me to pop off about a virus that will be studied for perhaps the next 5-10 years.

And that antibody test tells me I had a coronavirus. Might be Covid(and probably was), but could be one of the other coronaviruses. So I’m not going to trust it or assume I’m immune to Covid 19.

 

[Cathoholic]

Of course I’m going to wear a mask until this pandemic winds down.

I think that’s fine. I’m high risk too.

But in principle at least, you were not my point.

My point is even AFTER the “pandemic winds down” unless principles change, these mitigations will be PERMANENT.

And think about “why”.

Because if there is risk now to others, there will be risk ten or twenty years from now (we are not going to eradicate the virus with a partially effective vaccine. They are already admitting they want to give you two shots. In a few months or a year, it will go up to three. Or four. Or a new formulation for you to take ANNUALLY like the flu. Animals harbor this too. Should we mandate vaccinations for cats? Chipmunks? And even if they were 100% effective could you beat the race for a virus mutating?).

.

Someone might object and say . . .

Well there is MORE risk NOW.

And I might agree.

But then the principle would still be changing to
“risk acceptance” in the face of mitigation.

The only difference is, I think people should be making those decisions. Not Government.

But regardless of if you want self-imposed mitigatory efforts, the Government will still MANDATE it for you.

You might not have a problem with the government making your decisions for you.

Other people do have a problem with that.

 

[Everest]

My point is even AFTER the “pandemic winds down” unless principles change, these mitigations will be PERMANENT .

This is simply a ridiculous comment. These mitigations will NOT be permanent.
Necessary until “herd immunity” is achieved which should be by third quarter next year unless the dangerous anti-vaxxers have their way.

Anyone who thinks they will have to wear a mask for the rest of their lives is living in the same fantasyland as Trump who says he won the election!

 

[Cathoholic]

These mitigations will NOT be permanent.

You changed what I said.

Necessary until “herd immunity” is achieved . . .

Why do you think vaccination and herd immunity eliminates masking-up?

After all, we already have people (10-12 million) who have HAD corona virus and are STILL required to “mask-up”.

 

[Everest]

Why do you think vaccination and herd immunity eliminates masking-up?

After all, we already have people (10-12 million) who have HAD corona virus and are STILL required to “mask-up”.

Once herd immunity is achieved which means over 70% of population vaccinated the need for mitigants will be gone.
If you really need long explanation about herd immunity and what is actually means and achieves you can google it yourself!

By the way all data so far on those who have actually had covid-19 shows two things. The immunity appears to be short term (several months) and the antibodies are significantly less than those from the vaccine.

Before you ask, yes the scientists are saying that those who have had covid-19 still need to be vaccinated.

 

[Anesti33]

Ha ha ha, lol,

We already have people claiming that reinfections are not just possible but common. If reinfection is common, then a vaccine imputing antibodies means nothing to immunity and anyone with a vaccine will still need to practice all the same mitigations as before.

 

[Everest]

Ha ha ha, lol,

We already have people claiming that reinfections are not just possible but common. If reinfection is common, then a vaccine imputing antibodies means nothing to immunity and anyone with a vaccine will still need to practice all the same mitigations as before.

Absolute nonsense. When more than 70% of the population are vaccinated wearing masks will not be necessary.

 

[Cathoholic]

Once herd immunity is achieved which means over 70% of population vaccinated the need for mitigants will be gone.

No it doesn’t.

There is no guarantee that immunity means you cannot still be a vector for the virus.

The immunity appears to be short term (several months) and the antibodies are significantly less than those from the vaccine.

Why do you think more antibodies will make the B-Cells more responsive and have a longer immunoresponsiveness? What makes you think that?

And WHY do you think B-Cell immunity is the ONLY form of corona virus immunoprotection (which your answer has that built-in pre-supposition. And it is a wrong pre-supposition.)

And if not WHY do you think someone with antibodies from a vaccination cannot be a transmission vector of virus?

Where did you learn that?

Before you ask, yes the scientists are saying that those who have had covid-19 still need to be vaccinated.

Before you reply, ask yourself “why”?
Why does ANYONE young for instance “need” to be vaccinated.

You just got done being told how children rarely get significant corona virus, and how they are an extremely low likelihood of transmitting it (which is WHY Fauci told you last week that schools should be OPEN and Dr. Rand Paul told us the same thing . . . Last Summer.)

So “why” do you think children “need” to be vaccinated?
Or do you think they should NOT be vaccinated?

 

[Everest]

Before you reply, ask yourself “why”?
Why does ANYONE young for instance “need” to be vaccinated.

You just got done being told how children rarely get significant corona virus, and how they are an extremely low likelihood of transmitting it (which is WHY Fauci told you last week that schools should be OPEN and Dr. Rand Paul told us the same thing . . . Last Summer.)

So “why” do you think children “need” to be vaccinated?
Or do you think they should NOT be vaccinated?

. . . . I already answered you specifically about children but you ignored it (post #26). . . .

Well I will be standing in line for the vaccination whenever it becomes available where I live.
I have two cancers. Well for one I had surgery last year to remove a spindle cell fibrosarcoma and then I had 33 sessions of radiation treatment (Tomotherapy). The MRI test I had a few months ago showed it had not come back so hopefully that is still the case.
I separately have chronic lymphocytic leukemia so you can imagine the state of my immune system.
I will have no hesitation in getting the vaccination.

 

[Cathoholic]

Stupid comments. I already answered you specifically about children but you ignored it (post #26).
Obviously an anti-vaxxer.

To the readers here. That would be a response to my question . . . .

I want to see . . . .

• ALL the medical experts have reviewed the data and said it is safe
• FDA have also authorised it (This one I already know so you don’t need to post that)
• As have authorities in other countries (WHO are they? And . . . What other countries?)
• They have specified who it is safe for and which groups should not get it. (OK. Who is THAT and WHY?)

.

Everest’s “response” in post 26 began this way . . .

In case you are blind and deaf and have not seen or listened to any tv news for at least two weeks then you are just being silly again.

Lot’s of insults but still no answers.

Everest went on . . .

People who have severe allergies should not take it. Pregnant or breastfeeding women have a choice but should talk to their doctors first. If they are in high risk situations (e.g. a health worker) they may choose to take it. It should not be given to anyone under the age of 16 (trials did not include this group).

So what? There is MORE than one vaccine?

Are you saying kids under sixteen no longer need to “mask-up”?

Pregnant women can toss away their masks too?

How bout if they are not showing yet? Then what?

People with allergies can toss the mask in your paradigm right? Why not right now?

I’m still waiting for any substantive answer on WHY you think mitigation will go away.

Lots of insults directed against me, and nothing for science to speak of other than what you think news people are saying and an FDA approval which can be changed in a matter of weeks.

I’m still waiting.

 

[Cathoholic]

Everest to me about FDA approval . . .

In case you are blind and deaf and have not seen or listened to any tv news for at least two weeks then you are just being silly again.

It wasn’t approved “at least two weeks” ago. At least in America.

It has only been approved for several hours and even then, it is not clear how it crossed that approval hurdle as CNN reported earlier several hours ago . . . .

White House chief of staff told FDA chief vaccine must be authorized Friday or he needs to resign​

By Kaitlan Collins, Kevin Liptak and Jim Acosta, CNN

Updated 9:44 PM EST, Fri December 11, 2020

Washington (CNN) White House chief of staff Mark Meadows told Food and Drug Administration Commissioner Dr. Stephen Hahn he needed to grant an emergency use authorization for Pfizer/BioNTech’s coronavirus vaccine by the end of Friday, and if not, he would have to resign, an administration official and a source familiar with the situation tell CNN. . . .

White House chief of staff Mark Meadows told FDA chief Stephen Hahn vaccine must be authorized Friday or he needs to resign - CNNPolitics

Collins and Accosta are implying Trump is playing politics FORCING the approval process.

My guess is, it is the other way around with the FDA dragging their feet, in hopes that this does not get approved during the Trump administration, and the White House was fed up.

Either way, with the speed that this was rushed to completion, I am not trusting the vaccine. At least for now. Maybe later but not now.

Moderna’s mrna vaccine was even quicker (through the lab. Not regarding the FDA process) . . .

Moderna’s Covid-19 vaccine was designed in just two days​

From CNN’s John Bonifield

Covid-19 vaccine maker Moderna designed its vaccine against the novel coronavirus in just two days.

On Jan. 11, Chinese authorities shared the genetic sequence of the novel coronavirus, according to Moderna’s website.

Two days later, on Jan. 13, the National Institutes of Health and Moderna’s infectious disease research team finalized the sequence for mRNA-1273, the formal name of the company’s Covid-19 vaccine. . . .

Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine was designed in just two days

 

[CradleRC58]

Even flu shots need to be given yearly, unless you want to risk it.

I don’t intend to avoid a Covid vaccine. I’m just not going to get an mRDA one anytime soon. I’m not convinced they are safe yet.