Seventh Day Adventist Church and Abortion

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=Arglaze;4360574]But Go ahead and condemn with hellfire all those who do.In regards to the many complicated cases and very complex moral situations, the Catholic church is plainly wrong. And I will say that to the Pope’s face if he were in front of me.
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The teachings of the Catholic Church never contradict the Word of God. Not exceptions. And not exceptions to murder. I dont condemn anyone with hellfire. Only our Lord judges the souls of others. However, as a Christian, it is my duty to help my brothers and sisters follow our Lords commandments.
The RCC dares accuse women that abort, but dares not submit child rapists to face justice. I can’t respect that.****

The Catholic Church does not permit the murder of unborn children. The Church treats women who have had abortions with compassion and ministers to them to help them heal. Check out this website for more info. rachelsvineyard.org/

I am not sure what country you live in, but in the United States, all persons suspected of raping children are investigated. The Church is made of up of individual sinners and some Catholics have committed this sin. And they are brought to justice. There have been scandals throughout our church, and some individuals have not handled it in the proper way. You are confusing individuals with the Church. I recommend you read the following link. catholic.com/library/A_Crisis_of_Saints.asp Moreover, many parishes have Voice of the Faithful groups as a result of the scandals. My Church does. Check out the link. holytrinitydc.org/ParishLife/Groups/VOTF/index.htm

And the next time you make an accusation, provide proof. Otherwise you merely discredit yourself.

But again, murder of unborn children, violates Gods commandments, not that of the current Pope. Catholic doctrine/teaching never contradicts the Word of God. And it never changes. Thus the Catholic Church will never permit abortion. It is Gods teaching, and that is the reason why.

The only authority I respect is the Word of God.
The commandment is not Kill as in just taking life. The commandment is “Thou Shalt not Murder” and what God sent Israel to do to those babies was not murder, it was killing.

By respecting the Word of God, you respect the authority of the Catholic Church, although you may not realize it. Check out the history of the Bible and where it came from. It didn`t just fall out of the sky. You have the Catholic Church to thank for preserving the written word of God for 2,000 years.

The definition of murder, according to dictionary.com (see #5) is “to kill or slaughter inhumanly or barbarously.” That is what abortion is. To slaughter a unborn baby. You can try to make it not sound so bad by saying “terminate the fetus” but the action is the same.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
 
Patrick_Murebil said:
Nor could I if that were true. You obviously know about those molestation crimes, so they were not “hidden” very well as you claim. But have you read about the consequences and justice in those cases? Maybe not in your country, but it was all over the news in this country…priests going to jail, millions and milllions and millions paid out in damages. If you bring up a story you need to follow through to its conclusion.

And by the way, it is not now, nor has it ever been the teaching or policy of The Catholic Church to allow child abuse…not even in extreme or rare cases.

You cannot compare those acts, as heinous as they are, to SDA church policy regarding abortion.

God bless all!!!
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Extremely well-stated Patrick.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
 
Maria1212 said:
I just hope that whatever ones belief system is, the murder of unborn children will stop. As a Christian, I believe Gods Word must be obeyed. Without exception. Because God knows better than us.

Thank you again for your response. It helped me gain a lot of understanding.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
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Hi Maria,

Welcome back to the U.S. I did see Teresa Beem on The Journey Home…made a point of watching it and it probably could have been a three hour program. Unless you’ve made that switch from SDA to Catholic, you have no idea what a struggle it is…and yet now it all seems so easy to me…but it wasn’t at the time. Like her husband it was the Eucharist that reached me. It is Jesus, His sacrifice, His resurrection, His presence, and what makes us “His Body”, the Church, eternal life through our Saviour…I have to restrain myself or I could write all day about the blessing of that sacrament. I just went to my first sacrament of reconciliation…and much to my surpruse that sacrament was a very great blessing!!!

Early on I was pro-choice at least when the choice was abortion. I read Dr. Bernard Nathonson’s book “Aborting America”, and had a complete change of mind. He was one of the founders of NARAL in America, and the book reflects that work, and how he came to a change in thinking about abortion. There is no religious argument in the book, purely biological information…no emotion, no religion…just science, biology in his arguments. He was an agnostic, I believe, at the time. I see he has sinced converted to Catholicism. I highly recommend that book for an impartial look at the science of abortion, from one of the major players in getting abortion legalized in America.

As I thought about what SabbathKeeper said yesterday regarding those statistics being 20 years old, the thought occured to me to try and obtain some more statistics that are updated. When I initially contacted the compturer center, the man who sent me the report was kind and did not charge me for the first two years. When I call for 1993 statistics, he gave me the first 6 months of the year, which was all he had at the time, and told me that if I called him again he would have to charge me. Receiving those statistics was an answer to prayer at that time, I had no money to pay for those reports.

Anyway, I thought it might be a good idea to try and obtain more up to date statistics, so I called the computer center this morning, and left a voice mail. I’m waiting to hear back from a man, probably not the man I spoke with 15 years ago. I have been praying the Rosary that if it is God’s will I can once again obtain some statistics without cost. I would ask anyone reading this to pray for me in this new endeavor (which I had not planned on getting into). But I think SabbathKeeper makes a good point about the “datedness” of those first statistics. I also thought that this time I would request the statistics not only for Washington Adventist Hospital and Shady Grove Adventist Hospital, but also for Greater Baltimore Medical Center (a large public hospital) as well as Mercy Medical Center in Baltimore (a large Catholic hospital that is dedicated to women’s issues). Senator Barbara Mikulski of Maryland is always there at openings and promoting women’s health care at that hospital. She is very pro-choice…well at least when it comes to abortion…so it would be interesting to see if her influence carries over into any hospital policy or practices. My guess is that it does not, but as the SDAs who are informed will tell you, once you take government money and support, the government has an interesting way of worming into how you conduct your business. I remember the issue of having to serve pork in SDA hospitals who took government funds…I don’t know how that issue ever got resolved if it did at all.

So in an unscientific attempt to be fair, I will try to obtain statistics on the two SDA hospitals, the one public hospital, and the one Catholic hospital. For anyone interested in this other than me, please keep this in your prayers. Lives are at stake.

God bless all!!!
 
Patrick_Murebil said:
Hi Maria,

Welcome back to the U.S. I did see Teresa Beem on The Journey Home…made a point of watching it and it probably could have been a three hour program. Unless you’ve made that switch from SDA to Catholic, you have no idea what a struggle it is…and yet now it all seems so easy to me…but it wasn’t at the time. Like her husband it was the Eucharist that reached me. It is Jesus, His sacrifice, His resurrection, His presence, and what makes us “His Body”, the Church, eternal life through our Saviour…I have to restrain myself or I could write all day about the blessing of that sacrament. I just went to my first sacrament of reconciliation…and much to my surpruse that sacrament was a very great blessing!!!

Early on I was pro-choice at least when the choice was abortion. I read Dr. Bernard Nathonson’s book “Aborting America”, and had a complete change of mind. He was one of the founders of NARAL in America, and the book reflects that work, and how he came to a change in thinking about abortion. There is no religious argument in the book, purely biological information…no emotion, no religion…just science, biology in his arguments. He was an agnostic, I believe, at the time. I see he has sinced converted to Catholicism. I highly recommend that book for an impartial look at the science of abortion, from one of the major players in getting abortion legalized in America.

As I thought about what SabbathKeeper said yesterday regarding those statistics being 20 years old, the thought occured to me to try and obtain some more statistics that are updated. When I initially contacted the compturer center, the man who sent me the report was kind and did not charge me for the first two years. When I call for 1993 statistics, he gave me the first 6 months of the year, which was all he had at the time, and told me that if I called him again he would have to charge me. Receiving those statistics was an answer to prayer at that time, I had no money to pay for those reports.

Anyway, I thought it might be a good idea to try and obtain more up to date statistics, so I called the computer center this morning, and left a voice mail. I’m waiting to hear back from a man, probably not the man I spoke with 15 years ago. I have been praying the Rosary that if it is God’s will I can once again obtain some statistics without cost. I would ask anyone reading this to pray for me in this new endeavor (which I had not planned on getting into). But I think SabbathKeeper makes a good point about the “datedness” of those first statistics. I also thought that this time I would request the statistics not only for Washington Adventist Hospital and Shady Grove Adventist Hospital, but also for Greater Baltimore Medical Center (a large public hospital) as well as Mercy Medical Center in Baltimore (a large Catholic hospital that is dedicated to women’s issues). Senator Barbara Mikulski of Maryland is always there at openings and promoting women’s health care at that hospital. She is very pro-choice…well at least when it comes to abortion…so it would be interesting to see if her influence carries over into any hospital policy or practices. My guess is that it does not, but as the SDAs who are informed will tell you, once you take government money and support, the government has an interesting way of worming into how you conduct your business. I remember the issue of having to serve pork in SDA hospitals who took government funds…I don’t know how that issue ever got resolved if it did at all.

So in an unscientific attempt to be fair, I will try to obtain statistics on the two SDA hospitals, the one public hospital, and the one Catholic hospital. For anyone interested in this other than me, please keep this in your prayers. Lives are at stake.

God bless all!!!
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Hi Patrick,

I am a big fan of the Sacrament of Reconciliation. It is such an amazing feeling to experience the Lord`s mercy and forgiveness, directly, and first-hand, through this sacrament. The Lord is so merciful, and this sacrament is such a healing one. The Eucharist is also so amazing. I share your feelings. There are no words to describe it. I long for my non-Catholic Christian brothers and sisters to one day share this experience.

I will definitely keep you in my prayers. May God bless you for your work and efforts to stop abortion. The best way I can help you is by praying. But if I can help you in another way I would like to. I live in the Washington, DC area and will see what I can dig up. But I am recovering from eye surgery, so it will be a while before I am up to full speed. Reading is still very draining but I am fortunate at home to have a Mac where I can enlarge the text and make it talk by using a screen reader when necessary. But once my eyes are back up to speed I would like to help you on this.

Sorry to go off topic. And welcome home! I will keep you in my prayers.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
 
Maria1212 said:
Hi Patrick,

I am a big fan of the Sacrament of Reconciliation. It is such an amazing feeling to experience the Lord`s mercy and forgiveness, directly, and first-hand, through this sacrament. The Lord is so merciful, and this sacrament is such a healing one. The Eucharist is also so amazing. I share your feelings. There are no words to describe it. I long for my non-Catholic Christian brothers and sisters to one day share this experience.

I will definitely keep you in my prayers. May God bless you for your work and efforts to stop abortion. The best way I can help you is by praying. But if I can help you in another way I would like to. I live in the Washington, DC area and will see what I can dig up. But I am recovering from eye surgery, so it will be a while before I am up to full speed. Reading is still very draining but I am fortunate at home to have a Mac where I can enlarge the text and make it talk by using a screen reader when necessary. But once my eyes are back up to speed I would like to help you on this.

Sorry to go off topic. And welcome home! I will keep you in my prayers.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
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Hi Maria,

Thank you so much for your prayers in this matter!!! They are greatly appreciated!!! We’ll keep your eye surgery recovery in our prayers as well!!!

I’m in R.C.I.A. right now and I am waiting with anxious patience for Easter when I will receive Jesus in the Eucharist for the first time. I too long for Christians to reconcile with the Church and receive Jesus in the Eucharist…it fills in all those cracks in our spiritual lives where we just can’t make sense of why we feel that emptiness at times…not a very good description, but you know what I mean.

D.C…it is rare that I meet anyone on here who isn’t at least a thousand miles away…LOL. I live north of Baltimore and work in College Park. Perhaps we should meet at The Old Ebbit Grille by the Treasury Department for lunch some day.🙂 It’s nice because I go to the Shrine of the Immaculate Conception at C.U. often to pray the Rosary in the Blessed Sacrament Chapel there.

Anyway, I’ll keep you posted on the progress of obtaining those stats. Perhaps SabbathKeeper will be willing to kick in a couple hundred dollars for the stats if I can’t get them for free:thumbsup: After all, he inspired me with this…thanks SabbathKeeper;)

God bless all!!!
 
Patrick_Murebil said:
Hi Maria,

Anyway, I’ll keep you posted on the progress of obtaining those stats. Perhaps SabbathKeeper will be willing to kick in a couple hundred dollars for the stats if I can’t get them for free:thumbsup: After all, he inspired me with this…thanks SabbathKeeper;)

God bless all!!!
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Hi,

Well the Lord is good (but I don’t need to tell you all that). No sooner had I pressed the button to put my last post above online that the phone rang. It was the man from the computer center. I told him what I would like and he asked me if I was charged the last time I requested the stats. I told him no, and he seemed agreeable that there would be no charge this time. And then he asked me for what YEAR I wanted the stats. When I replied EVERY year since 1992 he laughed and laughed…but he didn’t hang up. It looks like he is willing to do one year free of charge, but the codes have changed, so he is in the process of sending me the new MSDRG codes that supercede the old DRG codes. Once I determine what the new codes are I will request the stats for the four hospitals mentioned above…and I’m going to ask him for as many years from this current year back as he can supply for free. I’ll also get the prices, if any, and since we don’t know each other on here in real life, I’ll have to decide if I’m willing to pay for the stats myself. And I would not dream of asking anyone else for their help in that area…besides, it seems that is probably against the rules of this forum…so pray pray pray for many years of free stats!!!

I would prefer the stats come complementary, so I ask anyone reading this to pray for free stats for as many years as we can get, according to God’s will. After that we’ll see what happens.

Thanks to everyone in advance for your prayers!!

God bless all!!!
 
Patrick_Murebil said:
Hi,

Well the Lord is good (but I don’t need to tell you all that). No sooner had I pressed the button to put my last post above online that the phone rang. It was the man from the computer center. I told him what I would like and he asked me if I was charged the last time I requested the stats. I told him no, and he seemed agreeable that there would be no charge this time. And then he asked me for what YEAR I wanted the stats. When I replied EVERY year since 1992 he laughed and laughed…but he didn’t hang up. It looks like he is willing to do one year free of charge, but the codes have changed, so he is in the process of sending me the new MSDRG codes that supercede the old DRG codes. Once I determine what the new codes are I will request the stats for the four hospitals mentioned above…and I’m going to ask him for as many years from this current year back as he can supply for free. I’ll also get the prices, if any, and since we don’t know each other on here in real life, I’ll have to decide if I’m willing to pay for the stats myself. And I would not dream of asking anyone else for their help in that area…besides, it seems that is probably against the rules of this forum…so pray pray pray for many years of free stats!!!

I would prefer the stats come complementary, so I ask anyone reading this to pray for free stats for as many years as we can get, according to God’s will. After that we’ll see what happens.

Thanks to everyone in advance for your prayers!!

God bless all!!!
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Thanks for the update Patrick! I am praying!

Sincerely,

Maria1212
 
“The RCC is not immune from mistakes or teaching lies. Its only humble to accept that as humans, they too are subject to error.”

Here is the crux of the problem.You are confusing impeccability with infallibility.We have had a couple of rotten popes who were personally corrupt but NOT ONCE did they teach error or heresy because the Holy Spirit which guards the Church of Christ would not allow it.The Holy Spirit came to the Catholic Church at Pentecost and He’s still here.Come home to the Light of Christ and out of that woman’s cult.Please.
 
Maria1212 said:
Thanks for the update Patrick! I am praying!

Sincerely,

Maria1212
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Ok…I just sent the computer center man my request for the same stats I listed above, but with the two additional hospitals now. I asked for two years of “complimentary” stats…begged for 5 years of “complimentary” stats…and asked him what the cost would be per year back to 1990 for stats beyond any comps he might send. I just need to sign a data use agreement and fax it to him as soon as possible.

It will be interesting to see the results. It would do my heart good to see the numbers come down in the SDA hospitals, and it will give me a new endeavor if the Catholic hospital has any at all.

Thanks to all of you who are praying about this…please continue to pray since I don’t know how many stats I can get without cost. Facts are always better than rumor!

God bless all!!!
 
Patrick_Murebil said:
Ok…I just sent the computer center man my request for the same stats I listed above, but with the two additional hospitals now. I asked for two years of “complimentary” stats…begged for 5 years of “complimentary” stats…and asked him what the cost would be per year back to 1990 for stats beyond any comps he might send. I just need to sign a data use agreement and fax it to him as soon as possible.

It will be interesting to see the results. It would do my heart good to see the numbers come down in the SDA hospitals, and it will give me a new endeavor if the Catholic hospital has any at all.

Thanks to all of you who are praying about this…please continue to pray since I don’t know how many stats I can get without cost. Facts are always better than rumor!

God bless all!!!
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Thanks for all of your hard, and prompt work on this!

Out of curiosity, do they list D&C (performed after miscarriage or spontaneous abortion) under a separate medical code? I wonder if Adventist hospitals prescribe the drug for medically induced abortions at home ( I am blanking on the name of the drug, but it is the one commonly used in Europe that was made legal in the United States several years ago). Or does it all fall under the same code? I really hope the numbers have gone down as well!

And on a separate, but happier note, it would be very fun to met for lunch downtown some day! And congratulations on RCIA! That is wonderful! I am very happy for you and your wife!

Sincerely,

Maria1212
 
Soutane said:
“The RCC is not immune from mistakes or teaching lies. Its only humble to accept that as humans, they too are subject to error.”

Here is the crux of the problem.You are confusing impeccability with infallibility.We have had a couple of rotten popes who were personally corrupt but NOT ONCE did they teach error or heresy because the Holy Spirit which guards the Church of Christ would not allow it.The Holy Spirit came to the Catholic Church at Pentecost and He’s still here.Come home to the Light of Christ and out of that woman’s cult.Please.
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I definitely share your hope that our Adventist brothers and sisters will one day be united with us in the Catholic Church that Christ founded. I would add that the Catholic Church does not consider the SDA Church to be a cult.

*By virtue of their valid baptism, and their belief in Christ’s divinity and in the doctrine of the Trinity, Seventh-Day Adventists are both ontologically and theologically Christians. But Christians, once separated from the Church our Lord founded, are susceptible to being “tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine” (Eph. 4:14). *

The text is taken from the CAF tract at the following link. catholic.com/library/Seventh_Day_Adventism.asp

The CAF library has excellent resources on Adventism.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
 
Maria1212 said:
Thanks for all of your hard, and prompt work on this!

Out of curiosity, do they list D&C (performed after miscarriage or spontaneous abortion) under a separate medical code? I wonder if Adventist hospitals prescribe the drug for medically induced abortions at home ( I am blanking on the name of the drug, but it is the one commonly used in Europe that was made legal in the United States several years ago). Or does it all fall under the same code? I really hope the numbers have gone down as well!

And on a separate, but happier note, it would be very fun to met for lunch downtown some day! And congratulations on RCIA! That is wonderful! I am very happy for you and your wife!

Sincerely,

Maria1212
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That’s a good question, and as I looked through the 700 plus codes he sent me there are approximately 10 or so codes related to birth, post partum, etc. I will take a look at them again and see if I can find what you are describing. My wife, who worked for an ob/gyn for years, and I discussed the possibities of what these codes could mean and apply to, in particular to spontaneous abortions and miscarriages. I don’t know if they prescribe the “morning after pill” …I believe it’s clinical name is RU486…a bit ironic name don’t you think…if you read it as young people write their text messages, like a question, and understand what it means to “86” something.

I originally was told what codes to look for by a very activist pro-life ob/gyn in the D.C. area. She knew what codes were related to abortions other than spontaneous, and those are the ones I requested before, and now. It is important to note that doctors in any hospital, who are more interested in money than morals, can gather a team of complicit nurses and assistants and “conspire” to code deliberate abortions as procedures other than abortions. This does occur, but there is no way to prove that nor obtain statistics on that. But doctors know what hospital policies are and will, in most cases, not jepordize their medical license by performing procedures against hospital policy…much too risky.

It is also important to note that many people may seek abortions at clinics rather than hospitals…especially the younger and more economically stressed patients. So for hospitals to have high numbers of abortions indicates a very open policy. It is just difficult to get completely accurate pictures of the abortion crisis in America, be we can see big parts of the picture, if not the whole picture.

Well let’s plan to get together for lunch one of these days. Also, my wife and I extend an invitation to you to come visit us at our home out in the country and go to mass with us if you are interested. I’ll PM you!

God bless all!!!
 
Maria1212 said:
I definitely share your hope that our Adventist brothers and sisters will one day be united with us in the Catholic Church that Christ founded. I would add that the Catholic Church does not consider the SDA Church to be a cult.

*By virtue of their valid baptism, and their belief in Christ’s divinity and in the doctrine of the Trinity, Seventh-Day Adventists are both ontologically and theologically Christians. But Christians, once separated from the Church our Lord founded, are susceptible to being “tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine” (Eph. 4:14). *

The text is taken from the CAF tract at the following link. catholic.com/library/Seventh_Day_Adventism.asp

The CAF library has excellent resources on Adventism.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
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One of the oddest things I noticed when I was an Adventist was that most of the protestant denominations considered us a “cult”. And it was the Catholic Church of all churches who regarded us as legitimate Christians.

Sometimes you just have to sit back and laugh at this world.

God bless all!!!
 
Maria,

Thank you so much for bringing this to my (our) attention, even if this topic is over a year old.

This is very important information, and very useful for dialoging with SDAs. It is a good talking point which strips the SDA of options they might otherwise turn to (eg the Catholic Church is the “Whore of Babylon” and the Catholic Church invented Sunday worship by the Devil, etc, etc).

The one true Church of God cannot every say abortion is permitted, that disqualifies the SDA church right there and vindicates the Catholic Church as the one and only true Church.
 
Patrick_Murebil said:
Nor could I if that were true. You obviously know about those molestation crimes, so they were not “hidden” very well as you claim. But have you read about the consequences and justice in those cases? Maybe not in your country, but it was all over the news in this country…priests going to jail, millions and milllions and millions paid out in damages. If you bring up a story you need to follow through to its conclusion.

And by the way, it is not now, nor has it ever been the teaching or policy of The Catholic Church to allow child abuse…not even in extreme or rare cases.

You cannot compare those acts, as heinous as they are, to SDA church policy regarding abortion.

God bless all!!!
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Only after people wouldn’t let it go. But the church never voluntarily offered to do this until after the intervention of lawyers and politicians. A complete hypocrisy.
I don’t wanna single out Catholics only. My statement simply says that All churches are subject to these kind of things happening because we are humans. Catholics protect their own.

They didn’t open the threshold because they wanted to be nice about it, they were worried about what others might say. This happens in the RCC, it also happens everywhere.
That is planet earth.
 
Catholic_Dude said:
Maria,

Thank you so much for bringing this to my (our) attention, even if this topic is over a year old.

This is very important information, and very useful for dialoging with SDAs. It is a good talking point which strips the SDA of options they might otherwise turn to (eg the Catholic Church is the “Whore of Babylon” and the Catholic Church invented Sunday worship by the Devil, etc, etc).

The one true Church of God cannot every say abortion is permitted, that disqualifies the SDA church right there and vindicates the Catholic Church as the one and only true Church.
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Since you bring that up.

If a national Sunday Law passes that forces everyone to worship on Sunday, then reconsider on which side you are standing, because we will not be the ones hunting people for their day of worship with guns. I’d rather be called crazy now and see you in heaven some day, than not be called crazy and loosing a soul for God. I’m willing to give my life for that cause.

If it doesn’t occur, then feel free to say of us as you please.
Anyone reading this, mark our words.
 
Soutane said:
“The RCC is not immune from mistakes or teaching lies. Its only humble to accept that as humans, they too are subject to error.”

Here is the crux of the problem.You are confusing impeccability with infallibility.We have had a couple of rotten popes who were personally corrupt but NOT ONCE did they teach error or heresy because the Holy Spirit which guards the Church of Christ would not allow it.The Holy Spirit came to the Catholic Church at Pentecost and He’s still here.Come home to the Light of Christ and out of that woman’s cult.Please.
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So the Holy Spirit that descended on Israel in Moses days wouldn’t allow the Jewish leadership from teaching lies either, just because God wouldn’t allow that?

What kind of logic is that?

If Jesus’ disciples followed the same rules that Catholics use to say that the RCC is the Light, then the Christian Church would have never existed.

All the qualifications that the RCC claims to have, the Jewish church had.
  • Founded by Jesus
  • Even older than the RCC
  • Priests and Leadership
  • The written record of God’s Words
  • The Holy Spirit descending upon them just like the apostles
  • etc.
    And even with all that, God still allowed the leadership to teach lies and false doctrines when they became corrupt even to the point of crucifying Christ. Why? because God gives men the choice to teach truth or error. Time and time again God kept cleaning after someone started teaching lies. The Christian church was not superior to the church in Moses, Samuel or Solomon days. They all had the Spirit of God, and at some point, someone from the leadership started teaching lies in the name of God.
So this “infallibility” doctrine has no truth at all in light of what God has done before, or what the Scriptures clearly have record of. The only thing that’s infallible is the Word of God. I stand on God’s Word and that alone. Not the Pope, not a priest, not a pastor, not Ellen White. To stand on men doctrines is a house built on the sand.

I may believe their words only if they agree with the Word of God, otherwise I don’t have to accept it. Have I compelled anyone here of joining my church or accepting Ellen White’s testimony at all? No. But yet you expect us to accept the Pope’s teachings in matters of faith as infallible. Sorry, my God taught me better than that in his word.
 
Catholic_Dude said:
Maria,

Thank you so much for bringing this to my (our) attention, even if this topic is over a year old.

This is very important information, and very useful for dialoging with SDAs. It is a good talking point which strips the SDA of options they might otherwise turn to (eg the Catholic Church is the “Whore of Babylon” and the Catholic Church invented Sunday worship by the Devil, etc, etc).

The one true Church of God cannot every say abortion is permitted, that disqualifies the SDA church right there and vindicates the Catholic Church as the one and only true Church.
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Thanks for taking the time to write. You are exactly right. Christ`s Church would never say it was okay to murder/kill His unborn children. Please join me in praying for our Adventist brothers and sisters. They have a genuine love for our Lord but have been so misguided and have such deep fear of the Church that Jesus founded. They need all of our prayers.

Sincerely,

Maria1212
 
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