Several priests shut church door to petitions to block gay marriage

[Aussie_ukie]

Why would we accept rhetoric? The devil will always try to deceive people with lies of defeat. We have the promises of God and it is His faithfulness that we rely on. You must think the faith of people here is shallow if you think you can cuss and insult your way through an argument and somehow shake a faith grounded an almighty God and eternal truth.

whatever.

you wanta stick to ur guns that’s fine. but it wont change the outcome. the government’s duty is not to impose your religious truth on the masses.
democracy ended the churches complete rule over the people. democracy will now proside over the churches finial defeat.

 

[pnewton]

whatever.

you wanta stick to ur guns that’s fine. but it wont change the outcome. the government’s duty is not to impose your religious truth on the masses.
democracy ended the churches complete rule over the people. democracy will now proside over the churches finial defeat.

preside. Democracy is not a thing. It is a way to govern. Since you are not an American, and perhaps rather young, you may be unaware that we are not, strictly speaking, a democracy.

 

[Aussie_ukie]

preside. Democracy is not a thing. It is a way to govern. Since you are not an American, and perhaps rather young, you may be unaware that we are not, strictly speaking, a democracy.

A. im 30

B. your right Im not American. and here in Australia were appalled by the way you guys govern. we don’t really have much time for Americans actually. we kinda see you guys as extremists and yes your not really a democracy, more a wolf in sheep’s clothing.

Im very glad Australians have misgivings about America, and the bogus lies to get us into war with Iraq means you guys have less friends over here then you did a decade ago. we wont be running to help when America cries “wolf” again.

on a happy note cause we dont have your bogus political or economic system here we have had the equalivant of ‘Obama care’ here for many years (when we listen the nonsense u guys spew out most Australians say “only in America”

and cause we don’t have your bogus system gay marriage will be a reality here within a decade.

I thank God everyday he did not make me an American!

 

[pnewton]

I thank God everyday he did not make me an American!

I do not know why you came here to attack the Catholic Church and America, but the latter I take with a grain of salt, nor will I judge other Australians by your example. In the end, my citizenship is not of this world in which I am but a sojourner. Yet while we are here, we are asked by our Master to be the salt of the world. The thing is, while salt provides flavor, it is also painful to those wounded by sin. Bishops like Peter Sartain are doing the job God called them to. It is natural that if the Master was persecuted, then so will those that follow.

 

[Aussie_ukie]

I do not know why you came here to attack the Catholic Church and America, but the latter I take with a grain of salt, nor will I judge other Australians by your example. In the end, my citizenship is not of this world in which I am but a sojourner.

actually ull find most Australians have the same opinion about americans as I do…you make great tv shows, but thats where our love affair ends with you guys.

we cant stand American tourists always comming over saying in your stupid american twang “O MY GOD its so smaller than I thought”
or
“all I want when I come to foreign country is to eat Burger King”

as I said we have the equilavant of Obama care here for years…to us your a bunch of whiners. we like you guys…when your mouths are closed mostly. or when we you open them but your just on our tv. this is a common opinion here, and certainly not just my own…come over sometime if you like and find out for yourself.

As for the catholic church, well Im a catholic and I shall always be one (despite what u may say about that) but heck Catholic priests in WW2 shoved Serbian Orthodox people in gas chambers…my loyalty for the church ends when injustice begins. and right now the church particularly in America is unjust, cruel, heartless, cold, hostile, and down right anti-civilized. and frankly I don’t see any difference between the church of today and the legalistic herbrew religion that Jesus fought against.

 

[pnewton]

As for the catholic church, well Im a catholic and I shall always be one (despite what u may say about that) but heck Catholic priests in WW2 shoved Serbian Orthodox people in gas chambers…my loyalty for the church ends when injustice begins

Then consider the teaching of the Catholic Church.

Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.” They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

old.usccb.org/catechism/text/pt3sect2chpt2art6.shtml

Blessed John Paul II (who is Polish, not American) said of same sex marriage that it is, “new ideology of evil… which attempts to pit human rights against the family and against man.” (Memory and Identity).

This is Catholic teaching, not American politics.

 

[Aussie_ukie]

Then consider the teaching of the Catholic Church.

Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.” They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

old.usccb.org/catechism/text/pt3sect2chpt2art6.shtml

considered.
…
…
…
and ignored!

Tradition also stated the world was 5000 to 6000 yrs old, or that the sun revolved around the earth… tradition can be wrong, as can the bible…heck in the past popes have been excommunicated for heretical teaching by ecumenical councils…I love reading catholic apologists doing revisionist somersaults trying to play that one down lol

in other words tradition is not all that its cracked up to be. tradition can be wrong. and it’s wrong in regard to sexual orientation and the church is hurting people and families through it.
what the church is doing is WRONG! plain and simple!

 

[Aussie_ukie]

Then consider the teaching of the Catholic Church.

Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.” They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

old.usccb.org/catechism/text/pt3sect2chpt2art6.shtml

Blessed John Paul II (who is Polish, not American) said of same sex marriage that it is, “new ideology of evil… which attempts to pit human rights against the family and against man.” (Memory and Identity).

This is Catholic teaching, not American politics.

yes well I was one who cheered he croaked! little did I know we’d get the spiritual equliavant of Mein Kampf to replace him.

 

[pnewton]

yes well I was one who cheered he croaked! little did I know we’d get the spiritual equliavant of Mein Kampf to replace him.

That is the ablsolute, cruelest, and most provocative post I have ever seen. You are showing a lack of adult maturity and a lack of Christian charity. BTW, Mein Kampf is a book, not a person.

Perhaps some day you will reconsider whether you wish to spend your life in the vain pursuit of hurting others.

 

[Aussie_ukie]

That is the ablsolute, cruelest, and most provocative post I have ever seen. You are showing a lack of adult maturity and a lack of Christian charity. BTW, Mein Kampf is a book, not a person.

Perhaps some day you will reconsider whether you wish to spend your life in the vain pursuit of hurting others.

I know what Mein Kampf is thanks.
it was a pun, a way of identifying the pope with nazi-like hate for gay people without actually using Hitler’s name (which is too common an attack)

but it appears since you didn’t get it I’m dealing with a rather common person. a literalist from what I can see, biblical and otherwise.

learn to look beyond literalism.

 

[Ohana]

[Yes, I know what I’m talking about and I have taken a class in Philosophy of Science. If you want to debate about it, learn something about it first.
[/QUOTE]

Aren’t you the bees knees! Actually, I love some of what you said. To rephrase in my own terms, science is a lot more right brain than we might want to think!

 

[curlycool89]

Aren’t you the bees knees! Actually, I love some of what you said. To rephrase in my own terms, science is a lot more right brain than we might want to think!

Sorry, I just got a little upset there.

I really hate it when you get people who like to “question” everything you say just because you don’t like it. I have actually learned stuff in 5 years of undergrad.

The other point was that I’m getting sick of people misrepresenting history, especially the history of science. Some people treat science almost like a religion, giving infallibility to scientists because they sound impressive. Scientists can be wrong (like phlogiston theory).

 

[AnnaAnna]

I sure get tired of Catholics not caring. Of Catholics slipping down the slippery slope of immorality. Gay ‘marriage’ is a big deal. In some ways it is so easy to love sinners, especially loving sinners - it is so easy to relate to fellow sinners of any stripe - and not to wish anyone harm of any kind. But we must not forget to hate the sin and realize that sin has consequences. Dark consequences. Anything else is just wishy washy wishful thinking.

 

[Ohana]

Sorry, I just got a little upset there.

I really hate it when you get people who like to “question” everything you say just because you don’t like it. I have actually learned stuff in 5 years of undergrad.

The other point was that I’m getting sick of people misrepresenting history, especially the history of science. Some people treat science almost like a religion, giving infallibility to scientists because they sound impressive. Scientists can be wrong (like phlogiston theory).

I realize this is not a debate on the nature of science, but I agree with you. I heard a quote on TV the other day that started, “well science has proved. . .”. Actually science proves very little. Every scientific statement should start, “as far as we know now, , ,” Science tends to revolutionary change, that is one set of “proven truths” are supplanted by a new set. Things like the Evolution Theory has stood the test of what, about a century and is still being refined. It is a good answer which fits the facts of most of what we know. It certainly does not exclude Intelligent design, but kind of explains how that might operate.

When I said Science is a lot more right brain than we might think: It is not linear logic but often leaps to new and creative solutions. That is right brain at work!

**So with regard to petitions for gay marriage or not.**If you have read Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance you will remember that the central theme was that solutions breed more questions.

So my questions are: (Note: these are questions, not proposed answers)

How is this to impact society as a whole either positively or negatively that we have a group of people who have struggled for the mentally healthy declaration of who they are. Will this encourage them to avoid sin or will it send them to a position of hiding and denial.

If denied the opportunity to form stable relationships, will this encourage celibacy or promiscuity.

Time will tell