No, it’s wrong.In a marriage, my understanding is that it is not wrong to manually stimulate one’s spouse on their genitals, even to the point of orgasm, as long as one fully intends to consummate the act genitally. Is that correct?
No, it is sinful, then, too, sometimes even a mortal sin. Doesn’t matter if it’s the man or the woman.For the female, sure, but the male orgasm must take place within the vagina, which would be difficult though I suppose not impossible in all situations to do the way you describe.
That is not the catechism, that is a website made by Ron Conte, an unfortunately well-known self proclaimed but often very innacurate theologian.No, it is sinful, then, too, sometimes even a mortal sin. Doesn’t matter if it’s the man or the woman.
catechism.cc/articles/QA.htm#04
See number four in the above.
You were just joshing us about teaching moral theology, I hope.No, it is sinful, then, too, sometimes even a mortal sin. Doesn’t matter if it’s the man or the woman.
catechism.cc/articles/QA.htm#04
See number four in the above.
Christopher West would disagree with you. As would my husbands bioethics professor at Seminary. And that website is… not a good source of accurate Catholic teaching.No, it is sinful, then, too, sometimes even a mortal sin. Doesn’t matter if it’s the man or the woman.
catechism.cc/articles/QA.htm#04
See number four in the above.
This I am actually on board with, minus the Ron Conte reference. Happy to see some literature stating the contrary, but to me it seems to be not morally distinguishable from auto-eroticism if female climax does not require at least habitual penetration… unitive, procreative. Keep 'em together.No, it is sinful, then, too, sometimes even a mortal sin. Doesn’t matter if it’s the man or the woman.
catechism.cc/articles/QA.htm#04
See number four in the above.
Not all arguments from authority are created equal… sorry. Not nearly enough for me. Can you provide the ACTUAL argument itself? I seem to recall West going off the rails a bit and taking a hiatus from these discussions, and since I have no idea who this seminary professor is, and I happen to know that seminary professors and seminaries are not created equal, this ain’t much of an appeal.Christopher West would disagree with you. As would my husbands bioethics professor at Seminary.
Stimulation to orgasm “for man” (to mean ejaculation), what is that for?In a marriage, my understanding is that it is not wrong to manually stimulate one’s spouse on their genitals, even to the point of orgasm, as long as one fully intends to consummate the act genitally. Is that correct?
What about directly after the husband ejaculates into his wife?.. do you believe it is okay to manually stimulate the wife then, if she has not yet climaxed?You were just joshing us about teaching moral theology, I hope.
Search around Catholic answers and you will find that at least one Pope said it was a husbands obligation to ensure his wife is fulfilled as part of marital relations, even if it required manual stimulation.
And, as someone who has been married over thirty years, let me tell you, this idea that things always just happen without manual stimulation, for a husband or a wife, shows a lack of real world understanding. .
Yes, absolutely. If you do not make sure your wife is satisfied, isn’t there something missing from the act? Isn’t it a little selfish to think that only the man has to be satisfied?What about directly after the husband ejaculates into his wife?.. do you believe it is okay to manually stimulate the wife then, if she has not yet climaxed?
My understanding is that Christopher West says this is fine. (And of course I realize that sex should always be respectful and prayerful, etc(
Frenzy Jen’s post a few posts down gives a good start. Since most women are not satisfied with just penatration, why should we restrict ourselves to penetration?But where are these issues regarding manual stimulation on the woman–before or after ejaculation into the woman–officially addressed by the Church?
Then how am I to enjoy being with my partner at all? If I am worrying about sin all the time. I have honestly never heard that its wrong to do that when married sorry and I find it hard to believe.No, it’s wrong.
I am not married and don’t want to be married, but I am a professor of theology. This is not my specialty, however, Christology is. However, this semester, I am teaching a Moral Theology class, so I do know the answer to this question.
Masturbation, of oneself or one’s spouse, is always an intrinsically evil act and as such, no good intention can make it not intrinsically evil. It is sinful to engage in such behavior. Even for married persons. St. Pope John Paul II in the Theology of the Body recommends sexual counseling if the woman is unable to reach a climax during coitus.
catechism.cc/articles/QA.htm#04
See question and answer number four.
So if I get married should I just not touch my husband sexually at all? Because you are making things more complicated then I think you really need to. I am not trying to be rude but I just can not agree sorry.Stimulation to orgasm “for man” (to mean ejaculation), what is that for?
About orgasm in relation to ejaculation in relation to procreation, it is interestingly different between men and women, but allow me to make an exclusion in my argument basing on men’s orgasm (as the OP does not show exclusion).
Male ejaculation in conjugal act is primarily meant to facilitate procreation and secondarily to solidifying the marital bond and union as an important stage in the conjugal act. However it is acceptable for a couple to morally avert the primary aim only to seek the secondary one (planning).
From this perspective stimulation to orgasm does not meet the primary aim of the conjugal act, even if the man’s discharge (semen) is meant to be collected and perform artificial insemination (which is another moral topic). Nevertheless if doing this seeks the secondary goal, then it remains immoral in itself since it is not a conjugal act even if the couple is planning to do that after.
Therefore, male orgasm (in its complexity, i.e., necessity of ejaculation) should not be considered to be a foreplay since it is meant by creation to be more than that.