Shocked by Song Choice at Mass

[Cat]

I’ve never heard or played Blessed Be Your Name. Y’all have me curious now!

Cool testimony, verdigirl!

 

[Scotty_PGH]

ScottyPGH, is there any way you can just accept that other Catholics prefer different music than you, and that as long as the Church has approved it, it’s OK? We are not committing a sin to like modern music in the Mass.

I’m absolutely fine with you preferring tradition and I hope that there will always be a traditional Mass near you. Just please stop ragging against the style and songs that I and many others prefer. Please? Thank you.

Oh I do accept it. What I don’t accept is one someone tells me that I should not be adoring my Savior after receiving Him in Holy Communion. That, I have a problem with.

 

[VAC]

From the USSCB site:

The Communion Song
62. The communion song should foster a sense of unity. It should be simple and not demand great effort. It gives expression to the joy of unity in the body of Christ and the fulfillment of the mystery being celebrated. Because they emphasize adoration rather than communion, most benediction hymns are not suitable.

 

[VAC]

I’ve never heard or played Blessed Be Your Name. Y’all have me curious now!

Cool testimony, verdigirl!

It’s on I-tunes

 

[PaixGioiaAmor]

From the USSCB site:

+1

 

[PatienceAndLove]

Dear PatienceAndLove,

Well, now I will probably have “Blessed Be Your Name” stuck in my head all night long!

It’s definitely a cool song and I like it … Wouldn’t be my choice for a Communion hymn though.

Exactly!

What sort of Communion hymns do you usually have at your parish? Was this one Mass a departure from the norm?

I have been attending my parents parish in Pittsburgh the last few weeks, so I don’t have a recent Communion song example for my home parish.
I do know that they have always been conducive to Eucharistic Meditation and reception of Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord.

As for charismatic style during all times of the year including Lent, am not familiar with Cowen by name. Having in the past attended Healing Masses presented in a “traditional charismatic” style, I can say that the lively music style seemed the same throughout the year, but what impressed me was that a high level of reverence was consistent throughout the year as well.

Something we definitely have! Some parishioners are not as reverent as others, but not everyone is at the same spiritual point, and many are still learning to fully Love Our Lord.

May your quest for prayerful meditation during Mass be fulfilled,
~~ the phoenix

Thanks Phoenix!
We have a 24-hour adoration Chapel, so there is great love for the Real Presence of Our Lord.
Like I said, I am just a bit confused about the timing of the song within the Mass.

 

[Wolseley]

Your post saddens me, as you seem to have no room in your heart for holy Christian reconciliation between brothers. I’ll pray for you anyway.

Thank you. I need all the prayers I can get. And I will apologize if I came on a little strong. This is a topic that grinds like sand in the swim trunks, and after years of being stonewalled by the Apostles of Newchurch, I tend to express myself somewhat bluntly.

It’s a necessity if rigid people cannot hear the voice of God except for in environments that suit them.

That’s a sword that cuts both ways, now, isn’t it?

Is the validity of the Sacrament somehow compromised because it’s too noisy for your concentration?

Is the validity of the Sacrament somehow compromised because it isn’t trendy and postmodern enough for your tastes?

No, those are your words. What chauvanism to suggest that those who pray while singing are not adoring!

I am merely making an observation. I myself, cannot pray or adore while I’m being forced to sing something out of the Gather songbook. It does not uplift me, it distracts me, annoys me, irritates me. I go to Mass to concentrate on Christ, and I end up being distanced from Him by the racket going on in there.

My brother, you can’t selectively read the GIRM, ok?

Again: that’s a sword that cuts both ways.

You are 100 percent right about abuses, etc. However, as St. Augustine says:

“Do not allow yourselves to be offended by the imperfect while you strive for the perfect.”

As I said: this side of the grave.

I am sorry that you have obviously have negative run-ins with hopefully well-meaning liturgists. I know exactly the type you’re talking about.

Then you know what I mean. I once approached a liturgist and quite innocently inquired why there were no kneelers in her particular church (which I was visiting), and I got a 10-minute lecture, full of the most arrogant, condescending, belittling rhetoric, complete with a full dossier on her academic credentials and my (assumed) lack thereof, with a generous dollop of rightous outrage that I would dare to question what choices and decisions that “she and Father” (notice who gets top billing) were making.

All over the simple question, “What happened to the kneelers?”

After that, I became convinced of the truth of the old saw: “A “liturgical expert” is an affliction sent by God, so that those Catholics who have not had the opportunity of suffering for their faith might not be deprived of the opportunity to do so.” I have never approached another one, about anything—I can tell you that. In the unlikely event that I feel the need to expose myself to that level of abuse again, I’ll go to an S&M club.

But why would your faith be so fragile that you would allow people like this to make you ignore the purpose of celebrating as one community, in spite of the imperfections?

Don’t make the mistake of thinking that my faith is fragile. There is a vast difference between fragility of faith and annoyance at substandard liturgics.

Gehen Sie mit Gott.

 

[Scotty_PGH]

After that, I became convinced of the truth of the old saw: “A “liturgical expert” is an affliction sent by God, so that those Catholics who have not had the opportunity of suffering for their faith might not be deprived of the opportunity to do so.”

 

[fix]

• The communion song can be any song that is fitting for the feast or the season; it can speak of the community aspects of the Eucharist. Most benediction hymns, by reason of their concentration on adoration, are not suitable. (PMEC IV B2 c3)
  Nothing in the Constitution on the Liturgy or in Musicam Sacram justifies either relegating parts of the Mass to “secondary”, or these requirements for the Communion hymn. No source is cited for these innovations either, though the preference for short refrains for the people with verses by a cantor is Jesuit Father Joseph Gélineau’s preferred method of liturgical singing. **20
  **
  
  http://www.adoremus.org/0501buriedtreasure.html

 

[verdigirl]

Thank you. I need all the prayers I can get. And I will apologize if I came on a little strong. This is a topic that grinds like sand in the swim trunks, and after years of being stonewalled by the Apostles of Newchurch, I tend to express myself somewhat bluntly.

I forgive you.

That’s a sword that cuts both ways, now, isn’t it?

No, actually I thought the GIRM is pretty clear.

Is the validity of the Sacrament somehow compromised because it isn’t trendy and postmodern enough for your tastes?

No, actually. I even enjoy Mass without music. I’m looking forward to more access to the TLM here locally, because I know I will enjoy that as well.

I am merely making an observation. I myself, cannot pray or adore while I’m being forced to sing something out of the Gather songbook. It does not uplift me, it distracts me, annoys me, irritates me. I go to Mass to concentrate on Christ, and I end up being distanced from Him by the racket going on in there.

That’s ok, I understand. Is it possible for you to offer it up? There are people I know who go to an early Mass when the full musical contingent is not there.

…and I got a 10-minute lecture, full of the most arrogant, condescending, belittling rhetoric, complete with a full dossier on her academic credentials and my (assumed) lack thereof, with a generous dollop of rightous outrage that I would dare to question what choices and decisions that “she and Father” (notice who gets top billing) were making.

All over the simple question, “What happened to the kneelers?”

After that, I became convinced of the truth of the old saw: "A “liturgical expert” is an affliction sent by God…

S&M? Ha ha! No accounting for tastes! But seriously, try to understand that those of us who facilitate liturgy for a living are beat over the head over the smallest things (though I think removing the kneelers is just downright stupid…and prohibited in my Archdiocese, thanks be to God), so we tend to get a bit on the defensive. Can you forgive her and let that incident go…and therefore stop stereotyping everyone who facilitates “Newchurch” liturgies?

Gehen Sie mit Gott.

und Sie auch

 

[Contarini]

Mass is a re-creation of Christ’s sacrifice

How many Catholics here agree with this statement and the surrounding assumptions? I would start a new thread on this, but the last time I did something like that I got a lot of flak for taking the quote “out of context.”

This to me is an example of the kind of one-sided theology that provoked the unfortunate reactions of Protestantism. Catholicism has done a lot to correct that one-sidedness (NOTE: I am not talking about error, just one-sidedness), but many here don’t seem to like those corrections.

As I understand it, the Eucharist does not “re-create” anything. That is what Protestants accused Catholics of believing. Rather, the Eucharist is a manifestation in this time and place of the eternal sacrifice of Christ on the Cross. But as such, it is a manifestation of the whole saving work of Christ, not just His suffering and death. Jesus did not stay dead, and we are not killing Jesus over again or watching Him die. We are sharing in His whole saving work–Incarnation, Cross, Resurrection. We know that He is alive and not dead, and so it is quite appropriate to be joyful.

If the Roman Church disagrees with this (I use that term quite deliberately in this context), then too bad for the Roman Church. What I have just stated is the clear teaching of the early Church, and if Rome later departed from it, then that casts doubt on Rome’s claims. But if, as I believe, the other aspects of the Eucharist were simply under-emphasized for a time, then why are people nostalgic for that more limited understanding?

The Eucharist is many things: a manifestation of Christ’s eternal sacrifice, a remembrance of His death that brings it into the present, a pledge of the eschatological banquet, a communion in Christ’s risen body and blood, the act by which we sustain and renew our full incorporation into the mystical Body of Christ. . . .

It’s not a wake for Jesus!

Edwin

 

[Wolseley]

How many Catholics here agree with this statement and the surrounding assumptions?

As I understand it, the Eucharist does not “re-create” anything.

You’re correct in this; bad phrasing on my part.

To be more accurate, the Eucharistic celebration is a continuation of Christ’s one, only, and all-encompassing sacrifice.

I apologize for any misconceptions I may have engendered.

 

[Roslyn]

My very favorite song is is “Our God is an Awesome God”

youtube Michael W Smith

Yes, I’ve heard this at more than one Catholic Mass. Look at those people praise God. It’s beautiful!!!

 

[VociMike]

Unfortunately, the section in the GIRM about the Communion song is misleading and even contradicts itself.

First of all, let’s look at what Musicam Sacram (still in effect) says about songs at Mass: It is not sufficient, however, that these songs be merely “Eucharistic” – they must be in keeping with the parts of the Mass, with the feast, or with the liturgical season.

So the Communion song should be in keeping with the reception/celebration of Communion, and/or in keeping with the feast, and/or in keeping with the liturgical season.

Now, the model music for Communion, as affirmed by the GIRM and many other Church documents, is the Communion Propers found in the Roman Gradual. To see what kind of texts should be sung at Communion we must look to the Communion Propers for a proper )) example. It turns out that these Communion Propers do not fit in well at all with a literal-minded reading of GIRM 86. This tells us to be wary of a literal-minded reading of GIRM 86 as regards the type of music which is suitable for Communion.

 

[verdigirl]

Unfortunately, the section in the GIRM about the Communion song is misleading and even contradicts itself.

First of all, let’s look at what Musicam Sacram (still in effect) says about songs at Mass: It is not sufficient, however, that these songs be merely “Eucharistic” – they must be in keeping with the parts of the Mass, with the feast, or with the liturgical season.

So the Communion song should be in keeping with the reception/celebration of Communion, and/or in keeping with the feast, and/or in keeping with the liturgical season.

Now, the model music for Communion, as affirmed by the GIRM and many other Church documents, is the Communion Propers found in the Roman Gradual. To see what kind of texts should be sung at Communion we must look to the Communion Propers for a proper )) example. It turns out that these Communion Propers do not fit in well at all with a literal-minded reading of GIRM 86. This tells us to be wary of a literal-minded reading of GIRM 86 as regards the type of music which is suitable for Communion.

I agree that the texts are the most important thing. I’d like to invite you to post some examples of Communion Propers. I betcha I can give you examples of contemporary Catholic songs that fit.

Would you take me up on this friendly challenge?

 

[Contarini]

that would be it!

Is anything shocking about the words in your view (I can’t imagine what), or is it just the style?

Edwin

 

[Contarini]

You’re correct in this; bad phrasing on my part.

To be more accurate, the Eucharistic celebration is a continuation of Christ’s one, only, and all-encompassing sacrifice.

I apologize for any misconceptions I may have engendered.

Sorry for the overreaction, but I’m still intrigued (and troubled) by the implication that celebration is inappropriate because participants in the Mass are somehow analogous to spectators at Jesus’ crucifixion.

If the Christ who is offered and received in the Eucharist is the risen and glorified Christ, why is celebration not appropriate?

Edwin

 

[verdigirl]

Sorry for the overreaction, but I’m still intrigued (and troubled) by the implication that celebration is inappropriate because participants in the Mass are somehow analogous to spectators at Jesus’ crucifixion.

If the Christ who is offered and received in the Eucharist is the risen and glorified Christ, why is celebration not appropriate?

Edwin

I think that celebration can lend itself to varied expressions, including the loud and raucous, as well as the quiet and contemplative.

We Catholics need to figure that out and give each other a break.

 

[VociMike]

I agree that the texts are the most important thing. I’d like to invite you to post some examples of Communion Propers. I betcha I can give you examples of contemporary Catholic songs that fit.

Would you take me up on this friendly challenge?

FWIW, I wasn’t even suggesting that the example of the Communion Propers disqualified some contemporary songs. If anything, using the example of the Propers expands the allowable types of texts rather than contracting them. Frankly that goes against my own instincts, but that just means I need to better align my instincts with the mind and example of the Church in this matter, and I am happy to do so.

Here are the Communion Proper antiphons for last Sunday and the next few Sundays. They do not include the psalm verses to be sung between repetitions of the antiphons just because I don’t want to type that much and because I think the antiphons alone are sufficiently illustrative.

25th Sunday in Ordinary Time:
You have ordered that your commandments be kept diligently; O that my ways may be guided towards the keeping of your statutes.

26th Sunday
Be mindful of your word to your servant, O Lord, in which you caused me to hope; this has been my comfort in my affliction.

27th Sunday
My soul aspires after your salvation; I hope in your word; when will you judge those who persecute me? The wicked are persecuting me; come to my assistance, O Lord my God.

28th Sunday
Remove from me all scorn and contempt, for I have kept your commandments; for your law is the object of my meditations.

As you can see, none of these texts accords at all well with what GIRM 86 says.

 

[verdigirl]

As you can see, none of these texts accords at all well with what GIRM 86 says.

Thank you for your post! I’m gonna take a few minutes to get back to you on this.