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Promotor_Fidei
Guest
Some bishops in the US ignored that document the instant it came out and have done so ever since. Especially Mahoney, who has shielded many child and youth abusers:
bishop-accountability.org/ca-la/
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bishop-accountability.org/ca-la/
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buffalo
Guest
Promotor Fidei:
So is the laying on of hands valid when a disobedient Bishop performs it? Or is it the “he intended the ordination” so it is valid?
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Promotor_Fidei
Guest
Some argue that when the new Canon law came out in the 83 that it left out the 60s ban, so bishops aren’t violating the rule… though they willfully violated it from 61-83. Still, it gives them enough wiggle room.
They ignore Pope John Paul’s personal warning not to do this. Many US bishops have public said that they’ll obey the Holy Father and no longer ordain homosexually-oriented men, some persist in error.
It is widely expected that an amendment to Canon law will come out either at the end of summer. After that we’ll see if Mahoney’s informal schism becomes a formal schism.
thewandererpress.com/c3-25-2004.htm
Here’s a list of seminaries to avoid:
tldm.org/News5/seminaries.htm
As Karl Keating has said, “If the priesthood in this country were healthy, little or no harm would come from ordaining chaste homosexuals whose homosexuality is kept private. But we do not live in ordinary times.”
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iserve
Guest
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iserve
Guest
LCMS- I’d be glad to answer the question: one of them is closer to the truth than the other- both are still outside the whole truth.
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LCMS_No_More
Guest
What is this www.tldm.org? Are they even approved by the Vatican? I did some exploring and must say that some of the stuff on there is ridiculous!
I know someone who was a student at the Seminary in Camarillo but he left because of his homosexuality.
I know someone who was a student at the Seminary in Camarillo but he left because of his homosexuality.
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iserve
Guest
LCMS- I’d be glad to answer the question: one of them is closer to the truth than the other- neither is in full communion. Someday, if you get past this, you will understand. If you really want to have and honest faith you will need to trust that this is true.
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LCMS_No_More
Guest
So, admit what you are saying. People with SSA cannot be saved that that there is no hope or grace for them. People with SSA, in your opinion, are predestined to stoke the flames of hell and that God hates them.
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Promotor_Fidei
Guest
My bad. That site ventures into Mariolatry and endorses the condemned Bayside sitings. I meant to just cite the article.
I know of several homosexuals at St. John’s Seminary who went on to ordination, one of whom later abused children. And I know of several seminarians who left because of same-sex sexual harrassment.
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iserve
Guest
If *“with SSA” *means that they do not percieve this inclination as evil, then yes. God does not condemn anyone, He states over and over that we are hard-hearted and choose our own destruction. If we trust in His wisdom, not ours, we will live with Him forever. If we cling to something else, we get to spend eternity with our sins. Is “with” SSA like clinging to the SSA lifeboat?
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LCMS_No_More
Guest
Saying that someone “has SSA” is merely acknowledging a condition that exists in a person. If one is struggling to live in chastity, it would stand to reason that they are not “clinging” to anything but God, doesn’t it?
Think about it, is it logical for one who is tempted in a way that is particularly strong to ignore the temptation and pretend that it doesn’t exist or does it make more sense to acknowledge it so as to be able to fight against it and to deal with it properly? One with cancer can’t be treated unless they acknowledge that they have it. The same goes with these “sicknesses of the soul.”
By saying that I am same-sex attracted but chaste, I am not saying that I’m proud of it or that I enjoy having this particular temptation, I am saying that this is my struggle and that I am living according to the teachings of the Church.
Think about it, is it logical for one who is tempted in a way that is particularly strong to ignore the temptation and pretend that it doesn’t exist or does it make more sense to acknowledge it so as to be able to fight against it and to deal with it properly? One with cancer can’t be treated unless they acknowledge that they have it. The same goes with these “sicknesses of the soul.”
By saying that I am same-sex attracted but chaste, I am not saying that I’m proud of it or that I enjoy having this particular temptation, I am saying that this is my struggle and that I am living according to the teachings of the Church.
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felra
Guest
This is what Jesus meant when He talked about daily taking up our cross and following Him in discipleship.
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JOHNYJ
Guest
Do you think they wear a sign!Many people get their ideas about Gays from myths and TV.
Most Gays on TV fit the stereo- type,effeminate,loud, promiscuous,.The exception is on " Will & Grace ". Its Will, if he wasn’t as open about his orientation and toned himself down ever so slightly,no one would know.
The fact is that the majority of Gays are more like Will. Usualy for social reasons sometimes as a matter of actual personal safety.
AS for their being priests,if they can control their urges, why not. WE already know we have priests that drink too much, are too friendly to ladies,etc.and have had them for centuries.
Most Gays on TV fit the stereo- type,effeminate,loud, promiscuous,.The exception is on " Will & Grace ". Its Will, if he wasn’t as open about his orientation and toned himself down ever so slightly,no one would know.
The fact is that the majority of Gays are more like Will. Usualy for social reasons sometimes as a matter of actual personal safety.
AS for their being priests,if they can control their urges, why not. WE already know we have priests that drink too much, are too friendly to ladies,etc.and have had them for centuries.
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TOME
Guest
For me the answer is yes provided the he, as is demanded of any hetrosexual, can and does lead a chaste and celebit life. “Orientation” shouldn’t be the question it’s how any individual actually lives his life.
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felra
Guest
How would a seminarian candidate respond to the role and identity of “Father” to to the flock that he is embracing in an espousal relationship, as Christ espoused the Bride of the Church his flock? It is more than a matter of semantics, would you not agree? What type of role model does a seminarian candidate with a predominately homosexual orientation offer to the systemic Body of Christ as a whole and in actual giving of self in the priesthooh of Jesus christ that he asumes through holy orders? I do not see how this can fulfill a full complementary fit from a practical common sense theology and lived out vocation.
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johnpaullover
Guest
NEVER!!! Chastity rules.
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littleitaly
Guest
If you are an individual that is living a chase life, ( that is not having any sexual activeties, with a woman), then you have no worries of being in sin with the Holy Spirit. If you are one to concider yourself a homosexual, then you are not living a chase life. To be a homosexual is to act out on what your thoughts are. Too many of you wish to believe that homosexuallity is just a person that merely thinks of that type of behavior, wrong. Every person in society has impure thoughts now and then. These impure thoughts do not make them a sinner. It is the actions taken by one that puts them in a sinful position. Example; If you wrer to think of killing somone, does that make you a killer? By no means. The same applies to men who have a tendancy to think of impure thoughts of the same sex. One must continue to pray to overcome the temptations from Satan.
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littleitaly
Guest
I believe you errored in saying God does not condemn anyone. He by all means condemns those who do not wish to abide by the Laws He had set down for those of us who do not know how to live a good life as a human being. Also could you or anyone else clarify what SSA stands for? This is new to me. thanks
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felra
Guest
SSA=Same Sex Attraction.
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kev7
Guest
I think christ would say the same thing he said to the rich man that wanted to follow him. He told him to sell everything he owned and give it to the poor.
In the same way, christ would tell the homosexual that he should give up his ‘gay’ identity and then come and follow him. It would be a choice that he would have to make.
In the same way, christ would tell the homosexual that he should give up his ‘gay’ identity and then come and follow him. It would be a choice that he would have to make.
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