Should we continue to go to Counseling?

[moosears]

Hello Lil Cat and M0nkey! I would not suggest annulment, divorce or separation either. What God has joined together let no man put asunder.

Celeste and I were married in a Baptist church way before we even thought about the Catholic Church and she was very hesitant about it. Granted, we never fought over it, but we have fought over devotional practices.

I think the key thing to remember here is to respect each others dignity in the eyes of God. Though you may not agree on the way Christianity is believed and practiced, you both believe in God and, I assume, you both want to become more like Christ. You have come to the Cross but it appears that neither of you have fully taken up your cross on this issue. To save your marriage the first thing you will absolutely have to do is embrace each others differences. Neither of you have to compromise your faith to do this but you cannot make demands on each others faith either. This is a point that you will have to agree to disagree on for now.

I think it would be a good idea to see a marriage counselor who is neutral on the issue of religion for now. I do not mean someone who is an atheist, I mean someone who can respect both sides and help you two learn to communicate effectively on this issue. Some Dioceses offer “Retrovaille”, which is a nondenominational Christian marriage workshop that focuses on learning to communicate effectively. Perhaps this would be an option!

Whatever you do, do not go your separate ways without a good fight to stay together. You have a responsibility before God to work this out. Part of living the Gospel is being servants to one another. Part of being married is sacrifice. It is all give and take and you cannot keep score. Love is patient, love is kind… you know the drill!

May Almighty God bless and keep this marriage and cause you to bear much fruit in peace and joy! Be assured of my prayers!

 

[M0nkey]

Nothing wrong with exploring faith before you’re married. However, when you make a commitment and part of that package is a certain understanding concerning faith – if one partner breaks that understanding it’s their fault … period.

Oh I take the fault. But don’t go presumming that I’m shallow and not understanding of the Faith. You do not Judge what fire burns in my heart, only God.

 

[sola_scriptura]

Very presumptive statement. And no I was not, no way, no how, in any way, shape or form a die hard Catholic (if I was, then I wouldn’t have jumped in marriage). My dad was actually an atheist for the longest time (I don’t know what he is now) and that kinda rubbed off on me. I’ve believed in God since I was 19, but never really had any convictions until recently.

And seriosly, if you are using this thread as a decoy to bash the Faith (here it comes, once again) then GET OUT!!

I’m not bashing the faith – go tell it too someone who is too dumb to see through to the real problem here — you’re personal commitment issues. You presented yourself as one thing, now you’re becoming a different thing, and want to fault your wife for simply wanting to remain what she was.

You knowingly married her under certain pretenses, and are now violating those pretenses – so it’s you’re fault. You can bash me all you want for calling you on it; it won’t help you when you meet your maker if you divorce this women over this issue.

 

[sola_scriptura]

Oh I take the fault. But don’t go presumming that I’m shallow and not understanding of the Faith. You do not Judge what fire burns in my heart, only God.

I’m not judging; if you have become Catholic great. However, don’t expect your wife to join you & leave her alone about it.

In fact by all rights your children should be raised in the denomination you agreed on when you married her (this is what’s called keeping your word). What’s to stop you from attending service with your family and then mass by yourself? Sure, it’s two services each Sunday – but hey, as you yourself admit, it’s your fault right?

If slowly she becomes interested in your faith – great. Honestly I’m not a fan of inter-faith marriage; but again – you brought this on yourself.

 

[M0nkey]

You knowingly married her under certain pretenses, and are now violating those pretenses – so it’s you’re fault. You can bash me all you want for calling you on it; it won’t help you when you meet your maker if you divorce this women over this issue.

I agree. But, no need to dwell on the past, just focus on the present and move on. Obviously I feel very grieved for what has transpired over the last two years, but nobody said embracing Truth was an easy path either.

I personally don’t think we’ll get a divorce, as I don’t believe in divorce. Separation posibly, specially now that I’m living in sin.

 

[M0nkey]

In fact by all rights your children should be raised in the denomination you agreed on when you married her (this is what’s called keeping your word). What’s to stop you from attending service with your family and then mass by yourself? Sure, it’s two services each Sunday – but hey, as you yourself admit, it’s your fault right?

We never agreed in raising children Protestant. In fact, I told her we would deal with this issue later.

 

[onmyknees]

Monkey,
A few years ago I was in this situation. We were not married in the Catholic Church I was a baptized, non practicing Catholic so our marriage was invalid. My husband is not Catholic or Christian. We were married at 18 years old and our marriage was always a struggle. We fought a lot and had to grow up together. I chose to have our marriage convalidated in the Catholic Church because I had come back to the faith and like you, was in love with my faith and the Churches teaching. Our faith teaches that separation is wrong except for when there is danger (physical or extreme emotional abuse) to yourself or children or if one spouse had committed adultery. In the case of adultery they even say that if the spouse can forgive then they encourage staying married but if they can’t or the unfaithful spouse refuses to change they may remain separated. Choosing to divorce is wrong An annulment is only an option if the married was invalid at the beginning. Marriage is a vocation and our job is to get our spouse to heaven. It is a sacrament before God, a commitment for life, and a sacrificial love of selfless giving. If you were married invalidly than you may start over because in the eyes of God you are not married or you may decide that you would like to stay married and have your marriage convalidated. My prayers are with you both.

 

[M0nkey]

Believe with the way this guy bounces around, give me ten minutes with him, I’ll make him swear that John Calvin was the best thing since sliced bread. Look, if the wife became Catholic, great, no problem here. However, from the looks of this character she’ll become Catholic and the following week he’ll change his mind again (once he reads another compelling verse that makes him question a Catholic doctrine).

You know, you seem to be repeately saying statements such as this, what is your purpose? Are you really here in charity? Or under the presumptive doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved?

I have no intentions to quarrel with the likes of you…I get plenty of that right here at home.

 

[moosears]

Please excuse me while I but in again but what possible good can come from playing the blame and taking sides? If we are are all indeed Christians on this thread then the only side we should be taking is God’s.

A lot of the advice given so far will serve only to aggravate an already explosive situation. Perhaps the poster should not have brought the problem to these forums but he seems to be diligently seeking a solution that does not compromise his faith in God. It is only natural that he be impatient in finding the proper cure so he and his wife can carry on in peace and grow together gracefully.

People change. People have a right to change. If this man is following the directives of his conscience then who are we to judge his sincerity. It is an unfortunate situation for them both but there is a way to work it out with minimal damage from this point on. Why don’t we support the both of them since they are now one flesh, one body in the eyes of God?

You have my prayers.

 

[sola_scriptura]

I agree. But, no need to dwell on the past, just focus on the present and move on. Obviously I feel very grieved for what has transpired over the last two years, but nobody said embracing Truth was an easy path either.

I personally don’t think we’ll get a divorce, as I don’t believe in divorce. Separation posibly, specially now that I’m living in sin.

I will not comment further because this isn’t the non-Catholic forum (and I cannot offer the advice I’d like to offer regarding the validity of your marriage).

 

[moosears]

M0nkey, if you fell away from the Church and were married in a Protestant church, YOUR MARRIAGE IS STILL VALID. Just ask an apologist.

 

[M0nkey]

Marriage is a vocation and our job is to get our spouse to heaven. It is a sacrament before God, a commitment for life, and a sacrificial love of selfless giving.

True, and this is why I want us to have this marriage convalidated. When I took that vow, regardless of whether I knew it or not, I made a promisse to the Lord that I will guide this woman with me to heaven, and this is a promise I’m trying really hard to fulfill.

For now, it all rests upon the Lord.

Our Father, Who art in heaven,
Hallowed be Thy Name.
Thy Kingdom come.
Thy Will be done, on earth as it is in Heaven. Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil. Amen.

 

[Claire_from_DE]

Claire from DE:

I know you guys are going to rally behind this guy & I for one won’t offer religious advice because I’m protestant & this isn’t an appropriate forum.

However, surely you can see the wifes point? You all cannot be blinded to the husbands culpability in this mess – I hope?

Believe with the way this guy bounces around, give me ten minutes with him, I’ll make him swear that John Calvin was the best thing since sliced bread. Look, if the wife became Catholic, great, no problem here. However, from the looks of this character she’ll become Catholic and the following week he’ll change his mind again (once he reads another compelling verse that makes him question a Catholic doctrine).

Talk about a shipwreck!

Nothing wrong with exploring faith before you’re married. However, when you make a commitment and part of that package is a certain understanding concerning faith – if one partner breaks that understanding it’s their fault … period.

My diocese calls for a year of marriage prep and everybody complains. But the time before marriage should be a time of examining our assumptions and beliefs.

I can surely understand the wife’s point of view and assumptions. When one person changes in a marriage it affects both of them and the husband is the one who has changed so, from her point of view, he has caused the problem (which is true). From his point of view the problem is that she doesn’t accept what he has done. They started out being of one mind and now they are not.

If the husband believes that he has to be Catholic to follow Jesus then he has to do that. But he also needs to love his wife as he vowed to do.

I do feel that they should try to make the marriage work and they should continue with some kind of counseling. One solution would be for the wife to understand Catholicism and realize her husband is Christian and trying to follow Christ. He shouldn’t pressure her to become Catholic.

They need to work this out now, before they have children. They also need to think about how the children will be brought up which could also be a divisive issue.

I agree this is a shipwreck but I believe God can rescue them.

 

[sola_scriptura]

You know, you seem to be repeately saying statements such as this, what is your purpose? Are you really here in charity? Or under the presumptive doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved?

I have no intentions to quarrel with the likes of you…I get plenty of that right here at home.

I don’t believe in once saved always saved (I’m presbyterian)

Again – I won’t comment further because this isn’t the non-Catholic forum.

 

[onmyknees]

I agree with mooseears. Non-Catholics who marry non-Catholics are in a valid marriage.

 

[M0nkey]

M0nkey, if you fell away from the Church and were married in a Protestant church, YOUR MARRIAGE IS STILL VALID. Just ask an apologist.

Unfortunately, we did not even do that. We got married at the justice of the peace.

(Oh and I just got told that was my idea.)

 

[M0nkey]

I don’t believe in once saved always saved (I’m presbyterian)

Good.

I just didn’t wanna start another argument about our religious differences. God Bless.

 

[onmyknees]

True, and this is why I want us to have this marriage convalidated. When I took that vow, regardless of whether I knew it or not, I made a promisse to the Lord that I will guide this woman with me to heaven, and this is a promise I’m trying really hard to fulfill.

For now, it all rests upon the Lord.

Our Father, Who art in heaven,
Hallowed be Thy Name.
Thy Kingdom come.
Thy Will be done, on earth as it is in Heaven. Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil. Amen.

Monkey, My priest told me to ask my husband to marry me again, in the Catholic Church, because he loves me. I prayed real hard and asked him this way and I also brought up the fact that I would not be able to receive Jesus in the Eucharist which was the most important thing for me as a Catholic. So he did it but was not very happy about it. The priest made it easy for my husband too and convalidated the marriage in the office with my parents as witnesses.

 

[emeraldcoast]

Unfortunately, we did not even do that. We got married at the justice of the peace.

(Oh and I just got told that was my idea.)

Monkey,

Step away from the computer and go love your wife like a man should.

FYI–For those that are not aware, this post was posted in the Non-Catholic Forum and moved.

God Bless!

 

[Claire_from_DE]

Unfortunately, we did not even do that. We got married at the justice of the peace.

(Oh and I just got told that was my idea.)

Actually, getting married by the justice of the peace doesn’t make a marriage invalid for two baptized persons.

A Catholic is obliged to follow church law for a valid marriage which is that it must be witnessed by a priest (or deacon).

Yet the church might still recognize your marriage as valid if you weren’t raised Catholic and were not aware of this law. This would be something to discuss with a priest.

In any case, you both married in good faith intending to stay together for better or worse. You weren’t intending to evade the church’s law.