Shouldn't liberalism/ progressivism/ modernism/ relativism/ emotionalism be considered a religion?

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Since many liberals (aka progressives and formerly known as modernists) take their relativist activism to a zealous extreme and are very passionate about it as if it is the absolute unquestionable truth shouldn’t liberalism be considered a religion?
 
Since many liberals (aka progressives and formerly known as modernists) take their relativist activism to a zealous extreme and are very passionate about it as if it is the absolute unquestionable truth shouldn’t liberalism be considered a religion?
Many conservatives express their views in a zealous, passionate, extreme manner. Some feel their views are the absolute, unquestionable truth. Should conservatism be considered a religion?

In my opinion, the answer to both our questions is “no.” Although, conservatives often invoke the name of God while expressing their views, so perhaps conservatism is closer to a religion than liberalism.
 
Many conservatives express their views in a zealous, passionate, extreme manner. Some feel their views are the absolute, unquestionable truth. Should conservatism be considered a religion?

In my opinion, the answer to both our questions is “no.” Although, conservatives often invoke the name of God while expressing their views, so perhaps conservatism is closer to a religion than liberalism.
The difference is I can be considered a “conservative”, but my identity as a Catholic comes first. So far, nothing in “conservativism” is considered intrinsically evil by the Catholic Church. By contrast, there are many aspects of liberalism that are diametrically opposed to any form of traditional Christianity. I don’t see the Catholic Church being attacked by conservatives, but the Church is continually attacked by liberals who think the Catholic Church has a “war on women”.
 
The tile of this is doing wonky things to the page.

Hopefully, this will bring more people to your thread, in addition to me bumping it with this off-topic post.

Your welcome. 😉

(It’s late. :whacky:)
 
Since many liberals (aka progressives and formerly known as modernists) take their relativist activism to a zealous extreme and are very passionate about it as if it is the absolute unquestionable truth shouldn’t liberalism be considered a religion?
I would agree that the same could be said for conservatives (of which I happen to be one). There is no political party that I can support 100% as a Catholic, although I believe the conservative positions are certainly more in line. I will always vote for life no matter the candidate. So no, I would not consider it a religion but I do see where you’re coming from; many treat their political positions as if they had been received on stone tablets.
 
Should liberalism/progressivism/modernism/relativism/emotionalism be considered a word?:confused:
 
Some conservatives, including EWTN, salivate at the title “Liberalism is a Sin”, however if you read the book you will see that it is talking about a 19th century definition of liberalism which is not relevant today.

I don’t know what “liberalism” today is, except that whatever a “liberal” is I am one according to conservative Catholics, and all of my beliefs are strictly Catholic. Go figure. It started when I became sympathetic to some “liberal” causes, eg. anti-Iraq War, pro-environmentalism, to name two.

Here is the definition of “Liberalism” used in that book…
By definition, Liberalism is the mistaken notion that “One religion is as good as another.” The absurdity of this proposition is immediately obvious to all, for two beliefs that contradict each other cannot at the same time both be true. Therefore, insofar as one at least is false, it is simply not good at all, and definitely it is not as good as a belief which is true. Nor is it even as good as one that is nearer to the truth. Also, Liberalism takes no cognizance of there being in the world a One, True, Divinely revealed Religion that is true in all its doctrines and moral teachings—which is exactly what the Roman Catholic Church unabashedly maintains that it is.
I have rarely heard those who are defined as “liberal” today saying “One religion is as good as another”. I’ve **never **said it.
 
The difference is I can be considered a “conservative”, but my identity as a Catholic comes first. So far, nothing in “conservativism” is considered intrinsically evil by the Catholic Church. By contrast, there are many aspects of liberalism that are diametrically opposed to any form of traditional Christianity. I don’t see the Catholic Church being attacked by conservatives, but the Church is continually attacked by liberals who think the Catholic Church has a “war on women”.

Liberals don’t think there’s a war on anything. They’re just tired of hearing about this **** happening on your watch, and the enormousness and widespread mode of operation of the crimes begs the question: what are the guidelines that these institutions must adhere to, and why do they end up with the same protocols if they are not being instructed or allowed to by the church? Surely it’s not a religion, to question authority in the face of overwhelming evidence? Every action requires an equal and opposing reaction.​

the guardian.co.uk Wrote:
The high court judge Sean Ryan today unveiled the 2,600-page final report of Ireland’s commission into child abuse, which drew on testimony from thousands of former inmates and officials from more than 250 church-run institutions. Police were called to the news conference amid angry scenes as victims were prevented from attending.
**
The findings prompted the new Archbishop of Westminster, the Most Rev Vincent Nichols, to say that it took “courage” for those clergy involved in child sex abuse to confront their actions.** In an interview to be broadcast tonight on ITV News at Ten, he said: "I think of those in religious orders and some of the clergy in Dublin who have to face these facts from their past which instinctively and quite naturally they’d rather not look at. That takes courage, and also we shouldn’t forget that this account today will also overshadow all of the good that they also did."

The report found that molestation and rape were “endemic” in boys’ facilities, chiefly run by the Christian Brothers order, and supervisors pursued policies that increased the danger. Girls supervised by orders of nuns, chiefly the Sisters of Mercy, suffered much less sexual abuse but instead endured frequent assaults and humiliation designed to make them feel worthless.

The report concluded that when confronted with evidence of sex abuse, religious authorities responded by transferring offenders to another location, where in many instances they were free to abuse again.

**
Ireland Apologizes to Abused Women of Catholic ‘Magdalene’ Laundries**
A government-commissioned report published two weeks ago found that more than 10,000 women were consigned to the laundries after being branded “fallen” women, a euphemism for prostitutes, even though virtually none of them were — and instead were products of poverty, homelessness, and dysfunctional families.

Over the past decade Ireland has published five investigations into the church’s** serial cover-up of crimes by pedophile priests in the Dublin Archdiocese and two rural Catholic dioceses; the sexual, physical, and psychological abuse of tens of thousands of children consigned to state-funded industrial schools since the 1930s; and now, as a final piece of that puzzle, the Magdalene laundries.

In response to the furor aroused by the media reports, the Irish government commissioned a study which took nine years to complete. On May 20, 2009, the commission released its 2600-page report, which drew on testimony from thousands of former inmates and officials from more than 250 church-run institutions. The commission found that Catholic priests and nuns had terrorized thousands of boys and girls for decades and that government inspectors had failed to stop the chronic beatings, rapes and humiliation. The report characterized rape and molestation as “endemic” in Irish Catholic church-run industrial schools and orphanages**. In February 2002, 18 religious institutes agreed to provide more than €128 million in compensation to the victims of child abuse.** Most of the money was raised from church property transfers to the State.

Here’s an actual copy of the report: Ryan [Laffoy] Commission Report
childabusecommission.com/rpt/ExecSummary.php

Chapter Overview:

Witnesses reported being physically, sexually and emotionally abused, and neglected by religious and lay adults who had responsibility for their care, and by others in the absence of adequate care and supervision. Many of the 216 named settings were the subject of repeated reports of abuse. In excess of 800 individuals were identified as physically and/or sexually abusing the witnesses as children in those settings. Neglect and emotional abuse were often described as endemic within institutions where there was a systemic failure to provide for children’s safety and welfare.

The Conclusions on sexual abuse which are outlined at Paragraph 7.549 were that sexual abuse of boys in Artane by Brothers was a chronic problem. Complaints were not handled properly and the steps taken by the Congregation to avoid scandal and publicity protected perpetrators of abuse. The safety of children was not a priority at any time during the relevant period.**
 
Chapter 14 looks at the career of a serial sexual and physical abuser, given the name of Mr John Brander, who taught children in the primary and secondary school sector in Ireland for 40 years. He was eventually convicted of sexual abuse in the 1980s.
He began his career as a Christian Brother and after three separate incidents of sexual abuse of boys, he was granted dispensation from his vows. This chapter goes on to describe **this man’s progress through six different schools where he physically terrorised and sexually abused children in his classroom. **

**Sexual abuse was a chronic problem. For two thirds of the relevant period there was at least one sexual abuser in the school, for almost one third of the period there were two abusers in the school and at times there were three abusers working in Letterfrack at the same time. **Two abusers were present for periods of 14 years each and the Congregation could offer no explanation as to how these Brothers could have remained in the School for so long undetected and unreported. Conclusions on Sexual Abuse in Letterfrack are outlined at Paragraph 8.461 of the Report.

Sexual abuse was reported by approximately half of all the Confidential Committee witnesses. Acute and chronic contact and non-contact sexual abuse was reported, including vaginal and anal rape, molestation and voyeurism in both isolated assaults and on a regular basis over long periods of time. The secret nature of sexual abuse was repeatedly emphasised as facilitating its occurrence. Witnesses reported being sexually abused by religious and lay staff in the schools and institutions and by co-residents and others, including professionals, both within and external to the institutions. They also reported being sexually abused by members of the general public, including volunteer workers, visitors, work placement employers, foster parents, and others who had unsupervised contact with residents in the course of everyday activities. Witnesses reported being sexually abused when they were taken away for excursions, holidays or to work for others.** Some witnesses who disclosed sexual abuse were subjected to severe reproach by those who had responsibility for their care and protection.** Female witnesses in particular described, at times, being told they were responsible for the sexual abuse they experienced, by both their abuser and those to whom they disclosed abuse.

In general, girls’ schools were not as physically harsh as boys’ schools and there was no persistent problem of sexual abuse in girls’ schools although there was at best naiveté and at worst indifference in the way girls were sent out to foster families. A number of girls did experience sexual abuse at the hands of ‘godfathers’ which they were either unable to report or were disbelieved when they did report it.
There was a high level of emotional abuse in girls’ schools, which was a consistent feature of these institutions.

In particular, the Salthill report deals with a relatively recent allegation of sexual abuse against a Brother who had been transferred from Salthill ‘following a grave indiscretion with one of the boys’ in the early 1960s (Paragraph 12.63). The treatment of a boy who alleged sexual abuse against this Brother some twenty years later by Congregational Authorities was shameful and disturbing.

The extent of sexual abuse in this institution was as serious and disturbing as in Upton. Two religious members of the Rosminian Order and one layman were convicted of sexual abuse of boys in Ferryhouse. Another religious who served in Ferryhouse was convicted of a crime committed elsewhere on a boy who had previously been a resident of Ferryhouse and who was then living in another Rosminian institution. These three religious offenders served in senior positions in Ferryhouse and the layman was a volunteer there for different periods of years between 1968 and 1988.

During almost all of the period covered by the inquiry, there was at least one sexual abuser present in Ferryhouse.

The report into Greenmount contains a detailed analysis of an investigation into allegations of sexual abuse against two Brothers who were on the staff at the time. This matter was dealt with inadequately at the time and one of the Brothers went on to abuse in other schools he was assigned to.

Chapter 13 deals with the final Christian Brothers’ School investigated by the Committee, St Joseph’s School for the Deaf, in Cabra. It was the subject of Eastern Health Board Investigations in the 1980s which** revealed disturbing levels of sexual abuse** and peer sexual activity amongst boys who were resident there. These documents reveal a persistent failure on the part of school Authorities to protect children from bullying and abuse.

In addition, the documents revealed that physical punishment of these children continued into the mid-1990s and that staff were protected by management when physical abuse was discovered.***
 
Volume II Chapter I looks at the founding and organisation of the Rosminian Order and its involvement in residential care in Ireland. The Rosminians adopted a different approach to the Commission than other Congregations. They sought to understand abuse, in contrast to other Congregations who sought to explain it. They accepted that abuse had occurred in their Institutions, that the Institutions in themselves were abusive and that the Order itself must bear responsibility for what occurred.

The issue of sexual abuse in this institution emerged most strikingly through material that came to the Investigation Committee’s attention following a search by the Order of material in their archive in Rome, which disclosed a considerable number of documents, 68 in all, dating from 1936 to 1968. They dealt with, among other things, 7 sexual abusers who worked in Upton. These documents provided a valuable contemporary account of how sexual abuse was dealt with.

Chapter 5 deals with **Lota which was a residential school for boys with special needs **run by the Brothers of Charity in Glanmire, Co Cork.

The significant element in the account of Lota was the deeply disturbing accounts of sexual abuse of vulnerable children by religious staff. In addition, the indifference of the Congregational Authorities in addressing the issue facilitated the abuse in Lota for many years. In one case, a** Brother who was known by the Congregation to have abused in England and was known to the police there, was brought back to Ireland and assigned a teaching position in Lota, where he worked for over 30 years. **This Brother admitted to multiple sexual assaults of boys in the school. The circumstances of his return to Ireland and the handling of allegations against him whilst in Lota are a serious indictment of the Brothers of Charity. The Brothers have admitted that abuse took place but, as in the case of other Orders, they have not accepted Congregational responsibility for it.

Unlike the Christian Brothers and to a lesser extent the Rosminians, the Sisters of Mercy retained almost no records of complaints or allegations against the School, or even any reports of internal inspections or reviews. The Goldenbridge report relies heavily on the oral testimony of witnesses both complainants and ex-staff members.
**
A high level of physical abuse was perpetrated by Religious and lay staff in Goldenbridge. The method of inflicting punishments and the implements used were cruel and excessive and physical punishment was an immediate response to even minor infractions. Children were in constant fear of beatings and in many cases were beaten for no apparent reason. A feature of this school was a rosary bead industry that was operated from the school. This industry was conducted in a way that imposed impossible standards on children and caused great suffering to many of them.** It was a school that was characterised by a regime of extreme drudgery, both in terms of the rosary bead making and the daily workload of the children.

Chapter 8 considers Cappoquin Industrial School, County Waterford which was owned and managed by the Sisters of Mercy. It was certified for 75 boys up to the age of ten. From 1970, it was allowed take girls as well as boys. This institution was identified by the Department of Education Inspector as being particularly neglectful of the children in its care in the 1940s. Children were described as malnourished and underweight. This chapter also deals with Passage West Industrial School Co Cork, in the context of an allegation of sexual abuse against a lay care worker who worked in both Institutions and who was subsequently convicted of abuse of children in Cappoquin.

Chapter 13 deals with** St Patrick’s Industrial School which was founded in 1879 and accommodated 186 boys up to the age of 10. A significant feature of this school was the very young ages of the children and the large group of them all being cared for by a small number of nuns. Because they were so young when they were there, witnesses tended to remember specific episodes rather than have overall memories of St Patrick’s. Some of these incidents pointed to a regime that was harsh and unpredictable with corporal punishment the usual response to misbehaviour. Three male complainants described incidents of sexual abuse and the significant factor in each account was the child’s inability to confide to the Sister who was caring for him. **Men who were employed in the school appeared to have ready access to these small boys and there was no awareness of the risks posed by this.

In 1954, a handyman who** had been employed in the school for the previous 30 years was discovered to have been grossly sexually abusing girls from as young as eight years old. An investigation which was conducted by the Department of Education, confirmed the abuse but the children concerned were offered no comfort and the perpetrator, although dismissed from the school, was not reported to the Gardai.
**
The second period in which sexual abuse arose in St Joseph’s was during the 1970s after the school admitted boys, when two care workers who were sexually abusing boys were dismissed. Both men went on to abuse again after leaving St Joseph’s and the failure of the Congregation to deal decisively with these men was a factor in this.


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef017ee7bf68ae970d-640wi

In the past several days, I have experienced many examples of being humiliated. In recent days, I have been confronted in various places by very unhappy people. I could understand the depth of their anger and outrage — at me, at the Church, at about injustices that swirl around us.
Thanks to God’s special grace, I simply stood there, asking God to bless and forgive them.
 
Since many liberals (aka progressives and formerly known as modernists) take their relativist activism to a zealous extreme and are very passionate about it as if it is the absolute unquestionable truth shouldn’t liberalism be considered a religion?
What about all the liberals who already have some type of religion? Would this be a second religion for them?
 
Many conservatives express their views in a zealous, passionate, extreme manner. Some feel their views are the absolute, unquestionable truth. Should conservatism be considered a religion?

In my opinion, the answer to both our questions is “no.” Although, conservatives often invoke the name of God while expressing their views, so perhaps conservatism is closer to a religion than liberalism.
And liberalism is closer to atheism.
 
Since many liberals (aka progressives and formerly known as modernists) take their relativist activism to a zealous extreme and are very passionate about it as if it is the absolute unquestionable truth shouldn’t liberalism be considered a religion?
Many liberals or progressives like myself already have a religion. Specifically, I am a Roman Catholic who is a liberal on social issues. And my Church often backs me on many of my progressive liberal extremist ideas, such as speaking out against war, capital punishment, supporting social programs for the poor and protecting the environment. I am passionate on these issues as you have correctly said. But so is my Church.
 
And liberalism is closer to atheism.
How so? To me, a lot of conservatives jabbe-rjaw all day about God, but support Godless policies like war, capital punishment, corporate greed, and promote an “every man for himself” society where the poor and less fortunate are on their own. Conservatives have created a society in the past thirty years where 1 percent of the population has 60 percent of the wealth and the other 99 percent has to scramble for what’s left. Conservatives worry more about being able to carry killing machines like guns than they do about common sense practical issues that affect the collective advancement of humankind and preservation of the world that God has created for us to share.
 
This country was the freest richest country in the history of the world. People who were dirt poor could become wealthy. You all would do well to read the US constitution and understand it is only for a religious and moral people. We have lost this now. This country is falling because of unconstitutional liberal ideals. I’ll keep ALL my God given constitutional rights. Thank you very much!

The CC over the years raised armies and fought wars.
The church never complained about heretics being burned at the stake.
The church has immense wealth and priceless art.
The Pope has bodyguards with real machine guns and rides around in an armored vehicle.
 
Some conservatives, including EWTN, salivate at the title “Liberalism is a Sin”,*** however if you read the book you will see that it is talking about a 19th century definition of liberalism which is not relevant today.***

I don’t know what “liberalism” today is, except that whatever a “liberal” is I am one according to conservative Catholics, and all of my beliefs are strictly Catholic. Go figure. It started when I became sympathetic to some “liberal” causes, eg. anti-Iraq War, pro-environmentalism, to name two.
.
I don’t know, but if you read the following, for something that was written in the nineteenth century, it certainly looks and sounds a heck of a lot like the modern form of liberalism that permeates today’s culture don’t you think?
Liberalism is the root of heresy, the tree of evil in whose branches all the harpies of infidelity find ample shelter; it is today the evil of all evils. (Ch. 4).
***“The theater, literature, public and private morals are all saturated with obscenity and impurity. ***The result is inevitable; a corrupt generation necessarily begets a revolutionary generation. Liberalism is the program of naturalism. Free-thought begets free morals, or immorality. Restraint is thrown off and a free rein given to the passions. Whoever thinks what he pleases will do what he pleases. Liberalism in the intellectual order is license in the moral order. Disorder in the intellect begets disorder in the heart, and vice-versa. Thus does Liberalism propagate immorality, and immorality Liberalism.” (Ch. 26).
Liberalism "is, therefore, the radical and universal denial of all divine truth and Christian dogma, the primal type of all heresy, and the supreme rebellion against the authority of God and His Church. As with Lucifer, its maxim is, ‘I will not serve.’" (Ch. 3).
“Liberalism, whether in the doctrinal or practical order, is a sin. In the doctrinal order, it is heresy, and consequently a mortal sin against faith. ****In the practical order, it is a sin against the commandments of God and of the Church, for it virtually transgresses all commandments. To be more precise: in the doctrinal order, Liberalism strikes at the very foundations of faith; it is heresy radical and universal, because within it are comprehended all heresies. In the practical order it is a radical and universal infraction of the divine law, since it sanctions and authorizes all infractions of that law.” ****(Ch. 3).
 
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