Sola Scriptura is True

[josie_L]

1 Peter 2:9 ESV But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.

“And in the church of God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues. Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all interpret? But eagerly desire the greater gifts.”

or

"It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers. . . "

Our leaders are chosen by the church (believers in Christ) and hands are layed on them in ordination as has always been.

There is no apostolic succession in your church, the laying of hands therefore signifies nothing.

All leaders are subject to the divine authoity of the word of God and we use it to make sure they teach the truth. That is why we had a reformation. Rome wasn’t teaching the truth.

So which leader of the Reformation was telling/teaching the truth as I remember they argued on many an issue? Do you want to tell me that this is the workings of the Holy Spirit? Confusion and chaos arose on the basis of sola Scriptura as introduced by the reformers, so we now have as a result of this, thousands of denominations bickering amongst each other as to who has the right doctrinal teachings set in the Bible, the “infallible authority”. But according to scripture:

"There is one body and one Spirit- just as you were called to one hope when you were called one Lord, one faith, one baptism: one God and Father of all, who is over and all and through all and in all.

You misrepresent the Catholic Church by telling us she has fallen into error (and so the gates of hell did prevail) so you can justify being separated from her. It is nothing short of sheer blindness that can make you look at the reformation in such a positive light.

 

[Des]

Consider this analogy. Suppose someone was about to begin a career as a auto mechanic. He had all the tools of the trade, except for a socket set. He would not be fully equipped. But if you gave him a socket set, then he would be fully equipped. But that wouldn’t prove that with a socket set alone he would be fully equipped.

That’s actually a perfect analogy and one I was attempting to put in words myself but you said it so much better.

 

[TristanCross]

“Furthermore, the Catholic Church alone is the body of Christ…”

St. Augustine, letter 185:50

newadvent.org/fathers/1102185.htm

LOL!

---

“The way we came to know love was that he laid down his life for us; so we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers.”

1 John 3:16

Sure, the Church was called Catholic. Today, you pervert to mean your denomination and organizations. Universal is the word. It’s talking about the totality of Believers. Not about a group of people called Catholics.

I thought I’d get a better response than that. That was horrible…

 

[Lapey]

Co-mediatrix, and the immaculate conception are not in scripture.

Praying to anything other than God in faith is anti-scriptural.

The biblical term for antichirst in first John is not what people are refering to when they say the office of the pope is “antichrist” when people say that they mean that that office is against what Christ actually is and is opposed to what he taught a Christian should be.

The Church claims he is infallible, blasphemously calls him “holy father” , treats him as if he were christ. The entire thing is in actuallity “anti-christ”. It does not mean he is the anti-christ but holds an anti christian office.

Read this:
amazingdiscoveries.org/AD-Articles-TotalOnslaught-ThePopeIsGodOnThisEarth.html

You are sick with hatred and arrogance.

I’ll keep the questions simple for you;

Please provide scripture against the immaculate conception, I mean besides your personal interpretation.

Without looking up the text book meaning of your term, where is the scripture passage that reads that no one can intercede with the Son on our behalf asking Him to pray for us to His Father?

That term anti-christ was mentioned in the bible 4 times, all in 1 John. Why was it listed and what does it refer to? The author of the Johannine letters was addressing an issue that had arisen within the Johannine community that was contrary to the teachings of the apostles. There was a faction that didn’t believe Jesus came to earth as a human being. Man in all ways but sin. Since He was God, there was no way He could have become a man. How could there be such a big difference in what the, at that time, tradition held? To call the scripture at that time anything but tradition is dishonest.

It was that herasey that the term was used to fight against.

There is no way except through predjudice and ignorance that you can say that the Pope or the Church contains a spirit comparable to that. The biblical term cannot be used any other way.

Back to Mary, “Hail Mary full of GRACE,” what does that mean. This finding by the magisterium and the final decision made by the Pope, was based on that very scripture amongst a few others just after this one.

The Holy Spirit lead Church came to the understanding of that verse of Luke’s Goaspel within the last 100 years. Once that discernment process takes place, only when dealing in faith and morals, is the infalability of the Holy Father, as you site, invoked by the vatican.

If I am correct only twice this last century has the Pope invoked that charism of infalability.

Praying to another besides God is not anti-scriptural. Maybe in your translation, but not scripture. Please elaborate.

Comment please on these verses;
Romans 15:30, Col 4:3, 1 Thes 5:25, Eph 6:18-19 (Holy ones, ie Saints)
2 Th 1:11

If you haven’t figured it out yet, we can go back and forth like you have since starting this thread with issues all based on ones perception of scripture meaning. Fact is this, the only way to acuratly understand is to know what the people who walked with Jesus thought it meant, then the people who succedded them. That my brother is Tradition! No other inteligent way to see it.

 

[TristanCross]

Where and why can the term “anti-christ” be found in the bible???

1 John 2:18
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1 John 2:22
Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4:3
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

For clarification to DD2007; The Catholic church canonized the bible period. The Catholic church has never rejected the canonized bible or any book therein. The Protestant bible rejected books from the original canonized Christian bible. The Catholic church not only reads and hears the Word of God each day in a Liturgical setting as set according to the Word of God, The Word of God becomes flesh, truly Present, to all believers, body, blood, soul and divinity. What Jesus has set in stone in the “do this in rememberance of me” conflicts with the man made theology of Sola Scriptura. Because Jesus the Word of God is not the Sola Scriptura that makes himself present, but heard and then seen, touched, smelled, and tasted that the Lord is good leaving Sola Scriptura in the dust.

My main point to you DD2007 is that the Catholic Church has an impecable reference for the Word of God (bible). The entire bible is not only heard and taught in a 3year cycle in the Catholic Mass, but the Word of God is lived out in the Mass, especially when the Word of God becomes present to us in Eucharistic (thanksgiving) body, blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ, this is when Catholic believers consume the Word of God.

So you see DD2007, I as a Catholic can appreciate and respect your reference of the canonized (Catholic) Bible although your KJV does not contain (all the canonized books) the full Truth. The reference I hope to display to you here is that Catholics Hear, read, taste, smell, and consume the Word of God in our lives, not just read the word of God or hold reference to the books of the bible.

 

[Convert66]

Has any pope ever denied that Jesus is the Christ? That He is come in the flesh? Denied the Father and the Son?

So, using scripture alone we can surmise that anyone who claims the Papacy is antichrist doesn’t have a lick of sense or ability to read black letters on white pages.

 

[josie_L]

John 17:17 ESV
17 Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.

The truth is in God’s word.

Yes, but who’s interpreting that Word, not the Bible itself, so then how can you say it is the infallible authority?

p.s. I follow the living Word, Jesus Christ, who died not to give us a Bible per se, but the Church which is the pillar and foundation of truth.

 

[Lapey]

Sure, the Church was called Catholic. Today, you pervert to mean your denomination and organizations. Universal is the word. It’s talking about the totality of Believers. Not about a group of people called Catholics.

I thought I’d get a better response than that. That was horrible…

You have it partly right my freind. The Catholic (Capital C) was first called, in a wrtting still in existance, the Catholic Church in 107 ish AD by ST Ignatious of Antioch. It was by most schollars guess already in wide use amongst Christians by the way he used it is his writtings (yes multiple). It was used in a way that would lead you to believe it was already common knowledge in the first part of the second century. Oh that nasty TRADITION, its so full of information!

The Church became the Roman Catholic Church when the emporor Constantine made it legal to be Christian, they had to make it legal…wow! It became the Catholic Church of Rome as the Galatian Church was the Catholic Church of Galatia. But hey, its not in scripture so it cannot be true, right? There are no writtings earlier than Ignatious that back that up, just the way he sited the name Catholic.

Universal meaning can be and is applied to mean all christian churches, even the ones that believe Roman Catholics are going to hell for following an anti-christ Pope and Church.

Sola Gratia is taught by the Church and said Grace flows through the Church, His Church.

 

[Lapey]

1 John 2:18
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1 John 2:22
Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4:3
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

You forgot the WHY!!!

 

[Des]

This passage applies to St. Timothy, a Catholic bishop, who was instructed by an apostle. It hardly applies to Protestants.

He’s done that alot with the letters to Timothy like the one starting off this thread. But hey, he trusts in the Holy Spirit so he must be right.

 

[DD2007]

Comment please on these verses;
Romans 15:30, Col 4:3, 1 Thes 5:25, Eph 6:18-19 (Holy ones, ie Saints)
2 Th 1:11.

People who are in the body on earth together should pray for one another in faith and ask each other to do the same.

However, when you pray to one who has left the body you are imparting faith to them by the act of prayer directed at them in the confidence that they can hear you and will act on your behalf. That is worship.

Prayer is a form of worship:

Luke 2:37 ESV
37 and then as a widow until she was eighty-four. She did not depart from the temple, worshiping with fasting and prayer night and day.

God is the one who hears our prayers:

Psalm 65:2 ESV
2 O you who hear prayer,
to you shall all flesh come.

The one to whom all flesh will bow down is the one who hears prayers. Prayer as Christ taught us should be directed at God.

 

[DD2007]

Yes, but who’s interpreting that Word, not the Bible itself, so then how can you say it is the infallible authority?

Because it is the word of God. It is true it is menat to be read and the Holy Spirit is the one who guides us to all truth. All misunderstanding or misrepresentation of the bible is rooted in sin. When one bends their will to the will of God then the scriputes come alive.

John 16:12-15 ESV
12 “I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. 14 He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you. 15 All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you.

the Church which is the pillar and foundation of truth.

The truth it upholds is the gospel that is now recorded in scripture since the apostles have passed. The scriptures are the only reason we have apostolic teaching inthe church and are what preserves the gospel that the church (believers in Christ) hold up.

 

[DD2007]

Here is a great video about Jesus death that the apostles recorded for us in scripture.

This is the truth that the Church is the pillar and foundation of.

youtube.com/watch?v=a11ASw5NRUw&feature=related

It’s only 11 minutes, give it a try…

 

[Lapey]

People who are in the body on earth together should pray for one another in faith and ask each other to do the same.

However, when you pray to one who has left the body you are imparting faith to them by the act of prayer directed at them in the confidence that they can hear you and will act on your behalf. That is worship.

Prayer is a form of worship:

Luke 2:37 ESV
37 and then as a widow until she was eighty-four. She did not depart from the temple, worshiping with fasting and prayer night and day.

God is the one who hears our prayers:

Psalm 65:2 ESV
2 O you who hear prayer,
to you shall all flesh come.

The one to whom all flesh will bow down is the one who hears prayers. Prayer as Christ taught us should be directed at God.

I know you will never understand what the church teaches, but there is no way that you can actually believe thats what that passage means.

What about the Holy Ones, saints? Paul sure thought it was okay to ask them for intersesion. If you disagree with that you are interpriting as you go.

You also talked about statues, what does the book of Exodus teach about this? Not just the the commandment talk, but the tabernacle talk. Which teaching is correct?

 

[DD2007]

What about the Holy Ones, saints? Paul sure thought it was okay to ask them for intersesion. If you disagree with that you are interpriting as you go.

Paul means by holy ones the saints who are regenerated in Christ. All who are believers have been washed in the blood of Christ and are justified by his work before God.

You also talked about statues,

Leviticus 26:1 ESV
26:1 “You shall not make idols for yourselves or erect an image or pillar, and you shall not set up a figured stone in your land to bow down to it, for I am the Lord your God. 2 You shall keep my Sabbaths and reverence my sanctuary: I am the Lord.

 

[DD2007]

Has any pope ever denied that Jesus is the Christ? That He is come in the flesh? Denied the Father and the Son?

So, using scripture alone we can surmise that anyone who claims the Papacy is antichrist doesn’t have a lick of sense or ability to read black letters on white pages.

As said already we do not say the pope is the antichrist or a anti christ who denies Jesus came in flesh.

We said his office is Anti Christ which means anti christian, wrong, and offensive to God. Contrary to what Christ is.

Such as when someone votes for abortion and we say that is anti american to allow the murder of infants.

(note: I supported Obama but realized later how wrong it was and repented of it because it was a sin. I will only vote for the candidate that better illustrates the teachings of Christ in the future.)

 

[Lapey]

As said already we do not say the pope is the antichrist or a anti christ who denies Jesus came in flesh.

We said his office is Anti Christ which means anti christian, wrong, and offensive to God. Contrary to what Christ is.

Such as when someone votes for abortion and we say that is anti american to allow the murder of infants.

This is plain not true and offensive. You are filled with hatred and elitism, arrogance and ignorance.

Is it possible that anything that others believe may possibly be closer to the truth than your opinion?

This is the danger of your tradition. This way is anti-christ!!! Your condesending demeanor is an abomination. You will not have an honest discussion i guess because you cannot!

You just move on to whatever verse you can use as a weapon. I asked you about Exodus, not Leviticus. It doesn’t matter what Lev reads, it is a seperate writting and teaching. You use it out of context, go figure.

Exodus mandates not to carve graven imiges then goes on to order the holy men of this time to make statues, can you possibly see the difference? If God can then surely you can.

You are not smarter than the Church that has been protected by the Holy Spirit for 2000 years, can you find that in scripture? I can.

 

[Lapey]

As said already we do not say the pope is the antichrist or a anti christ who denies Jesus came in flesh.

This is how it was used by the author of John’s letters. Using this term in any other way is misleading and disingenuous.

 

[Bill_Pick]

Hyperdulia is latria in practice. Statues are bowed to. Deceased creatures are prayed repetitively to in faith that they can hear your prayers in an attempt to coax them into attempting to move God to act in a blasphemous display of a lack of faith in the Son of God who told us to pray to the Father and said that anything we ask in his name we would receive, because the will of God is always done and to ask in Christ is to ask on the will because Christ is in the will. Christians are adopted children of God and have direct access to the father through our Lord Jesus Christ.

1 Timothy 2:5 ESV
5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

If the Holy Spirit meant there is one mediator and a mediatrix and a bunch of spirits to pray for you he would have said so.

To whom shall all flesh come? To him who hears prayers. Will all flesh come to Mary? No.

Psalm 65:2 ESV
2 O you who hear prayer,
to you shall all flesh come.

Here is what John was told when he tried to worship a creature.

Revelation 19:10 ESV
10 Then I fell down at his feet to worship him, but he said to me, “You must not do that! I am a fellow servant with you and your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God.” For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

DD20097= What is name of the church that John Macarthur preaching frolm does it have a name.Will you please tell us what it is,the church