Some Christians Still Denounce Harry Potter as Dangerous

[DawnInTexas]

I see lots of opinions, I don’t see any facts. This isn’t a personal attack on anyone, it is what it is, there are no facts to support the claim that HP is leading people down diabolical paths. Anyone, especially an expert who wants people to believe his claim, is supposed to base an opinion on facts.

Faith, not Facts.

God only knows what those statistics are.

An increase in Exorcists has been called for. Exorcists have said (and they’ve been quoted) that the movies and books are a doorway (window) to the Occult.

They themselves may have the Facts, but we, as Serious, Practicing Catholics follow those in Authority-by Faith.

If you believed like we do-you would join our Faith.
This is a Catholic Forum.

God Bless you.
+Jesus, I Trust In You!
Love, Dawn

 

[PRmerger]

Well yes PR, If I am to obey the Commandments of God then, as Luther said, “I can do no other” I’ve heard that the Lord of the Rings is excellent from a literary standpoint, but it’s occult theme would preclude me from reading it. However, as for nose twitching Samantha, and bottle dwelling Jeanne, I didn’t know that there were books of those, in any case - Yawn!!!

Christian Regards, ORD.

  *"Fear ye not therefore, ye are of more value than many sparrows"* (Matt. 10:31)

What are you saying? TV shows of witches and wizards and genies are ok but books are not?

 

[DawnInTexas]

Once again, for those who want to include Harry Potter items in their Christmas shopping:

HARRY POTTER SORCERERS STONE - 14 Incantations CARDS

Incantation Cards…Incantations…

Is this a good thing?

I’ve got more Harry Potter Christmas items, for children on your list (for those who didn’t read all the posts in the thread)…I’ll be back.

eBay is a great source-just go there and search for Harry Potter yourself!
The spell and incantation kits are especially intriguing! I mean-all your supplies are right there!!!

God Bless you.
+Jesus, I Trust In You!
Love, Dawn

 

[PRmerger]

Many items in the Table of Contents (in just 1 book I posted) - post # 208 on page 14-should make many Catholics’ spine shiver. Here-I’ll copy it again (Check it out-THIRD EDITION-this is very popular!):

The Sorcerer’s Companion: A Guide to the Magical World of Harry Potter, Third Edition

Table of Contents

Amulet + The Evil Eye + 1,3
Arithmancy + 4
Astrology + Disaster and Disease + 10, 14

• The Zodiac + 15
• The Meaning Of The Planets + 18
  Banshee + 19
  Basilisk + The Basilisk Today + 21, 23
  Bezoar + 24
  Cat + Cat Tails + 31, 33
  Cauldron + 35
  Centaur + 38

Charm + “Charmed, I’m Sure” + 40, 41
Chimera + Meet the Parents + 42, 43
Circe + 45
Crystal Ball + 48
Curse + Licensed to Curse + 51, 53

• The Mummy’s Curse 54
  Dark Arts + 55
  Demon + How To Recognize a Demon + 59, 62
  Divination + The Mantic Arts + 63, 66
• A Brief History of Tarot + 70
  Dragons + Dragons of the East + 72, 73
  Dreams + 75
  Dwarf + 78
  Elf + The Elf’s New Clothes + 80, 82
  Fairy + The Tooth Fairy + 83, 85
• The Cottingley Fairies + 86
  + Fairy Rings + 88
  Fluffy + 89
  Flying Carpet + 91
  Forbidden Forest + 93
  Ghost + 95
  Ghoul + 98
  Giant + A Giant Sampler + 99, 103
• Big Bones + 106
  Gnome + 108

Goblin + 109
Griffin + 111
Grim + 113
Grindylow + 115
**Hag **+ 116
Hand of Glory + 118
Herbology + 121
Hex + 124
Hinkypunk + 126
Hippogriff + Animals on Trial + 128, 129
Horcrux + That Which Must Be Named + 130, 133
Horoscope + 134
Invisibility Cloak + 136
Jinx + A Modern Jinx + 139, 140
Kappa + 142
Legilimency + 144
Leprechan + The Farmer and The Leprechan + 148, 150
**Magic **+ 151
**Magician **+ 163
Magic Mirror + Mirror Superstitions + 176, 179
Magic Wand + The Caduccus + 180, 183

• The Magic Club + 184
  Magic Words + A Little Hocus Pocus + 185, 188
  Mandrake + Mandrake Safety + 190, 192

All the bolded concepts are found in the Chronicles of Narnia. (I started to do this for all, but there were too many that I ended with “M”).

Are you saying that Christian Apologist CS Lewis’ chronicles should also cause Catholics’ spines to shiver?

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

The spell and incantation kits are especially intriguing! I mean-all your supplies are right there!!!

Sure, and I sense your enthusiasm, but I expect that the reality will be that anyone who goes through those rituals will be disappointed when nothing happens.

 

[ORD_NASILA]

A friend of mine once commented that “Revelation is a book that people should read less of”. I think everyone knows that there have been some pretty crazy ideas that have come out of people picking up Revelation and thinking they understand everything.

.

Now there’s a strange thing. There I am a Fundamentalist talking about the “Apocalypse” and there’s you a Catholic responding to my post and talking about the “Revelation”. I’ve read Revelation through many times, but I’ve never thought to compare it with the Apocalypse. Is there any difference between them apart from the name? If there is no difference that’s fine, it just means that we were both trying to defer to the other person’s preference. On the other hand, if there is a significant difference it could mean that you wrongly assumed that I was criticising the Catholic Scripture by referring to the Apocalypse. That was definitely not the case, because as I said, I had hitherto thought of the two books as vertually identical.

God Bless you!
Regards, ORD
*"Fear ye not therefore, ye are of more value than many sparrows"* (Matt.10:31)

 

[ORD_NASILA]

What are you saying? TV shows of witches and wizards and genies are ok but books are not?

Now that’s naughty PR. You know that’s not what I’m saying. I thought this discussion was all about reading books with occultic content But what I said in regard to the books goes double for the videos on TV shows as they can be seen by much younger, and therefore much more vulnerable children. And don’t think that “Parental Guidance Recommended” warnings are a get out either because, in my country at least, most kids have TV’s and DVD players in their rooms. As I said, I had no idea that Sam & Jeanne had been made into books, but I had on occasion seen the promos of those shows on cable TV. But again I say, Yawn!!! Now how about we agree to drop it?

Christian Regards, ORD

 

[DawnInTexas]

All the bolded concepts are found in the Chronicles of Narnia. (I started to do this for all, but there were too many that I ended with “M”).

Are you saying that Christian Apologist CS Lewis’ chronicles should also cause Catholics’ spines to shiver?

Are you saying both Harry Potter and The Chronicles of Narnia are the same?

Are you saying both Harry Potter and The Chronicles of Narnia are good and wholesome for us Catholics and our children?

(I should say like some-prove it, that those you highlighted are in Narnia, but I won’t).
But, I will ask—Have you seen any warnings from those in Authority in the Catholic Faith-against The Chronicles of Narnia possibly being a door or window to the Occult?
If so, will you give links or proof?

You see, there are some, yes, who would see both and state there is not difference.
Those, I beg to differ with.

No, the Chronicles of Narnia is not the same as Harry Potter.
Shiver me timbers.

God Bless you.
+Jesus, I Trust In You!
Love, Dawn

 

[PRmerger]

Now that’s naughty PR. You know that’s not what I’m saying. I thought this discussion was all about reading books with occultic content But what I said in regard to the books goes double for the videos on TV shows as they can be seen by much younger, and therefore much more vulnerable children. And don’t think that “Parental Guidance Recommended” warnings are a get out either because, in my country at least, most kids have TV’s and DVD players in their rooms. As I said, I had no idea that Sam & Jeanne had been made into books, but I had on occasion seen the promos of those shows on cable TV. But again I say, Yawn!!! Now how about we agree to drop it?

Christian Regards, ORD

Well, ORD, I’m still not sure what your answer is–

Do you object to the TV shows Bewitched and I Dream of Jeannie? They are about wizards, witches, warlocks, genies.

I’m sorry to be so obtuse. But I’m not understanding if you think they’re ok or if they’re forbidden.

If they’re ok, why? Because they make you yawn?

 

[PRmerger]

Are you saying both Harry Potter and The Chronicles of Narnia are the same?

The same? Not sure what you mean. Clearly they are different. But they both are talking about magic.

Are you saying both Harry Potter and The Chronicles of Narnia are good and wholesome for us Catholics and our children?

I am saying that good Catholics can read and enjoy the HP series. And they can discern whether their children can read and enjoy them as well.

(I should say like some-prove it, that those you highlighted are in Narnia, but I won’t).

I would love to! And I will! In a few minutes. I LOVE the Chronicles of Narnia, which, interestingly enough, I was first exposed to in my public school in 4th or 5th grade. It was in my reader.

But, I will ask—Have you seen any warnings from those in Authority in the Catholic Faith-against The Chronicles of Narnia possibly being a door or window to the Occult?

No.

I take their warnings seriously, and consider them when I decide if my children can read the series. I have determined that their general warning is judicious, but I am free, as a good Catholic, to determine for myself whether I and my family can read them.

I have determined that we can.

But that’s, of course, a different argument. You provided a table of contents from the HP book that “should make many Catholics’ spine shiver.”

If they ought to make my spine shiver (and, BTW, the Tooth Fairy is on that list–did you see that, Dawn? The Tooth Fairy!) then the Chronicles of Narnia ought to make *your *spine shiver too.

 

[DawnInTexas]

Now that’s naughty PR. You know that’s not what I’m saying. I thought this discussion was all about reading books with occultic content But what I said in regard to the books goes double for the videos on TV shows as they can be seen by much younger, and therefore much more vulnerable children. And don’t think that “Parental Guidance Recommended” warnings are a get out either because, in my country at least, most kids have TV’s and DVD players in their rooms. As I said, I had no idea that Sam & Jeanne had been made into books, but I had on occasion seen the promos of those shows on cable TV. But again I say, Yawn!!! Now how about we agree to drop it?

Christian Regards, ORD

I will say this, ORD-There have been some in the Catholic Faith who have realized the beginning of all this on TV—Bewitched, Buffy the Vapire Slayer, Tabitha, The Wizards of Waverly Place, Charmed, That’s So Raven, Sabrina-The Teenage Witch…

Slowly…we’re being worn down, and it becomes a way of life.

Like Boiling Frogs.

God Bless you.
+Jesus, I Trust In You!
Love, Dawn

 

[PRmerger]

(I should say like some-prove it, that those you highlighted are in Narnia, but I won’t).

Just 'cause I want to, (and I like to show I’m right…)

Regarding reference to Planets, from Prince Caspian: “At dead of night two noble planets, Tarva and Alambil, will pass within one degree of each other. Such a conjunction has not occurred for two hundred years, and your Highness will not live to see it again.”

And cats, from The Last Battle: “On the other side of the Ape, walking very soft and stately, with his tail straight up in the air, came Ginger the Cat.”

And centaurs, dwarves, giansts, gods,naiaids, fauns, satyrs… from Prince Caspian: “Listen. All you have heard about Old Narnia is true. It is not the land of Men. It is the country of Aslan, the country of the Waking Trees and Visible Naiads, of Fauns and Satyrs, of Dwarfs and Giants, of the gods and the Centaurs, of Talking Beasts.”

And crystal balls: "I had a pretty good guess from my crystal as to where I should find you "

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

But, I will ask—Have you seen any warnings from those in Authority in the Catholic Faith-against The Chronicles of Narnia possibly being a door or window to the Occult?

Their warnings and opinions ought to be considered but are not mandatory on anyone. “Those in Authority” were the same ones who once placed Gustav Flaubert’s novel Madame Bovary on the Index. Go figure.

 

[Reservoir_Dog]

I will say this, ORD-There have been some in the Catholic Faith who have realized the beginning of all this on TV—Bewitched, …

Right down the slippery slope … to Hell!

 

[Reservoir_Dog]

Once again, for those who want to include Harry Potter items in their Christmas shopping:

HARRY POTTER SORCERERS STONE - 14 Incantations CARDS

Incantation Cards…Incantations…

Thanks, Dawn, I was looking for those for my niece for Yule I mean Christmas.

 

[DawnInTexas]

The same? Not sure what you mean. Clearly they are different. But they both are talking about magic.

Do you believe they both encourage children to practice Magic?
Is Magic both good and evil in Narnia?
Is there an Incantation and Spell book and kits linked to Narnia for children?

I am saying that good Catholics can read and enjoy the HP series. And they can discern whether their children can read and enjoy them as well.

Do you believe either or both The Chronicles of Narnia or Harry Potter is or could be a doorway or window to the Occult?

I would love to! And I will! In a few minutes. I LOVE the Chronicles of Narnia, which, interestingly enough, I was first exposed to in my public school in 4th or 5th grade. It was in my reader…

Maybe since you are familiar with both The Chronicles of Narnia and Harry Potter you could show how what you’ve highlighted-those Chapters-are the same or different in Narnia and Potter.

But, I will ask—Have you seen any warnings from those in Authority in the Catholic Faith-against The Chronicles of Narnia possibly being a door or window to the Occult?

No…

I take their warnings seriously, and consider them when I decide if my children can read the series. I have determined that their general warning is judicious, but I am free, as a good Catholic, to determine for myself whether I and my family can read them.

Read the books and watching the movies-could, said the Exorcists.

Any Catholic Authorities warning of-The Chronicles of Narnia being a doorway or window to the Occult for some?

Maybe your children could join a Quidditch team while at College.
After all, it would be great exercise:

quidditch.tamu.edu/

All in good fun!

But that’s, of course, a different argument. You provided a table of contents from the HP book that "should make many Catholics’ spine.

And I asked if there were any red flags there to anyone-and apparently, not to you.
Right?
You quoted those that are also in The Chronicles of Narnia.

Apparently, none of the Chapters “made your spine shiver?”
Should have.

If they ought to make my spine shiver (and, BTW, the Tooth Fairy is on that list–did you see that, Dawn? The Tooth Fairy!) then the Chronicles of Narnia ought to make *your *spine shiver too.

Yes, there is good mixed with practices that are not allowed in Catholicism-which causes confusion.

Checked your Horoscope lately?

God Bless you.
+Jesus, I Trust In You!
Love, Dawn

 

[PRmerger]

Just more magic from the Chronicles.…

“You can be kind to the poor remnants of the Dwarf people, like myself. You can gather learned magicians and try to find a way of awaking the trees once more. You can search through all the nooks and wild places of the land to see if any Fauns or Talking Beasts or Dwarfs are perhaps still alive in hiding.”

Of Magic he learned only the theory, for Doctor Cornelius said the practical part was not proper study for princes. “And I myself,” he added, “am only a very imperfect magician and can do only the smallest experiments.”

“They are fast asleep and will not wake,” said the Doctor. “I am a very minor magician but I can at least contrive a charmed sleep.”

“But the bottle was made of diamond instead of glass, and it was still more than half full of the magical cordial which would heal almost every wound and every illness.”

“But whether by some magic in the air of the treasure chamber or not, the bow was still in working order.”

 

[bbarrick8383]

The toys and books of spells and incantations-are practicing the occult.

This part got me to thinking Dawn. Using the word practice, you infer an attempt to learn. Whereas most children use them to pretend. My 2 year old, will take golf clubs and pretend they are swords. He’s also seen bits and pieces of iron man, and will run around pretending he is shooting something from his hands.

He also watched the last airbender, picked up a towel and started swinging it around like he was bending air.

Now, Ironman draws his power from technology. The Last Airbender, I’m assuming draws his power from the elements. Harry Potters is supernatural I guess.

So, buying those toys or not children are going to pretend. We adults sometimes forget how amazing the imagination of a child is. So, I don’t see any practice of the occult if my child were to pick up a wand and pretend to cast a spell that he knows is not going to have any effect. Neither is it going to bother me if he picks up a stick and tries to do the same thing.

Much like I use to play Hank the cowdog, I knew taht I’d never be a dog or have dog like abilities. But, I was allowed to have my fun.

 

[PRmerger]

Do you believe they both encourage children to practice Magic?

I believe neither encourages children to practice magic.

Is Magic both good and evil in Narnia?

Yes. There is good magic (like that practiced by Dr. Cornelius) and bad magic (like that practiced by the White Witch).

Is there an Incantation and Spell book and kits linked to Narnia for children?

Indeed there is.

Do you believe either or both The Chronicles of Narnia or Harry Potter is or could be a doorway or window to the Occult?

Yes–both could, I suppose. That’s my point. If you’re opposed to HP, then you’re opposed to CS Lewis’ CofN.

Maybe since you are familiar with both The Chronicles of Narnia and Harry Potter you could show how what you’ve highlighted-those Chapters-are the same or different in Narnia and Potter.

Why? You’re saying that a book that talks about potions and magic is occultish. I’ve shown you that the Chronicles of Narnia are all about magic. If you’re opposed to one, then you’re opposed to the other.

Read the books and watching the movies-could, said the Exorcists.

Ok.

Maybe your children could join a Quidditch team while at College.
After all, it would be great exercise:

quidditch.tamu.edu/

All in good fun!

Ok.

And I asked if there were any red flags there to anyone-and apparently, not to you.
Right?
You quoted those that are also in The Chronicles of Narnia.

Apparently, none of the Chapters “made your spine shiver?”

Absolutely my spine never shivered when I read the Chronicles of Narnia. I fell in love!

Checked your Horoscope lately?

Meaning?

 

[PRmerger]

This part got me to thinking Dawn. Using the word practice, you infer an attempt to learn. Whereas most children use them to pretend. My 2 year old, will take golf clubs and pretend they are swords. He’s also seen bits and pieces of iron man, and will run around pretending he is shooting something from his hands.

He also watched the last airbender, picked up a towel and started swinging it around like he was bending air.

Now, Ironman draws his power from technology. The Last Airbender, I’m assuming draws his power from the elements. Harry Potters is supernatural I guess.

So, buying those toys or not children are going to pretend. We adults sometimes forget how amazing the imagination of a child is. So, I don’t see any practice of the occult if my child were to pick up a wand and pretend to cast a spell that he knows is not going to have any effect. Neither is it going to bother me if he picks up a stick and tries to do the same thing.

Much like I use to play Hank the cowdog, I knew taht I’d never be a dog or have dog like abilities. But, I was allowed to have my fun.

Indeed.

Going by Dawn’s paradigm we ought never read our children Mother Goose, 'cause Geese can’t talk. If they do, it’s only by power of the Dark Side!