Spanish youths attack Catholic school, threaten to burn priests alive

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Pork_Roll said:
Not so sure there were really any good things that came from protestantism with the exception of their devotion to reading the scriptures. As far as I’m concerned, anything good was likely already there in catholic Europe. I’d say that protestantism was what lead to the enlightenment and all the evils that befalls the west today. Middle Ages Europe was the high point of Christendom IMO. It has been downhill since then (except of course the advances in modern medicine).
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Well the whole democracy, education for the masses, science and industry, advance in medical knowledge, etc etc thing happened in protestant Northern Europe and especially Britain and then later the USA.

Southern Catholic Europe was a mess, and so were their colonies. The only European colonies that became viable democracies were colonies of Protestant countries (and especially Britain).
 
Well the whole democracy, education for the masses, science and industry, advance in medical knowledge, etc etc thing happened in protestant Northern Europe and especially Britain and then later the USA.
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Southern Catholic Europe was a mess, and so were their colonies. The only European colonies that became viable democracies were colonies of Protestant countries (and especially Britain).
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I think trying to establish who’s government or system is best is somewhat of a subjective exercise. The top two wealthiest countries in the world are both small catholic countries with a monarchy: Luxembourg and Liechtenstein.
 
Pork_Roll said:
I think trying to establish who’s government or system is best is somewhat of a subjective exercise. The top two wealthiest countries in the world are both small catholic countries with a monarchy: Luxembourg and Liechtenstein.
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Wealthy per capita maybe, but not in overall wealth.

I think there are a number of objective criteria that could be used: How has a system or country changed the world for the better?

What are their major inventions or contributions to science?

How have they contributed to culture and the arts?

Have they changed social systems to make them more just? For example abolishing slavery, bringing in democracy etc.

How do Lichtenstein or Luxembourg fare in comparison to say, England, or even a small part of Britain, Scotland with only 6 million people (who are very protestant, far more so than “Anglican” England)?

Here’s 10 Scottish scientists.
  • John Logie Baird: Used a coffin lid and biscuit tin to create his first television, produced jam.
  • Alexander Graham Bell: Invented the telephone, worked with deaf people and experimented with flight.
  • Joseph Black: Discovered carbon dioxide and investigated the the difference between heat and temperature.
  • Alexander Fleming: Found that nasal mucus could destroy bacteria, and called his discovery ‘penicillin’.
  • James Hutton: Clashed with the Church over his belief that the Earth was millions of years old and founded modern geology.
  • Lord Kelvin: Devised the absolute temperature scale and installed a telegraph cable under the Atlantic Ocean.
  • James Clerk Maxwell: Made discoveries about Saturn and about electricity and magnetism, and took the first colour photograph.
  • John Napier: Invented logarithms to simplify complicated calculations.
  • Robert Watson-Watt: Developed radar in a way that was crucial to Britain and her Allies winning the Second World War.
  • James Watt: Helped spark off the Industrial Revolution with his steam engine inventions.
 
I think there are a number of objective criteria that could be used: How has a system or country changed the world for the better?
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We will never agree on how we should judge which country was best. Economists cant agree, why would we? Even if Scotland produced more scientists, their contributions to the culinary arts are lacking. Not to say I don’t enjoy Scottish beer, scotch or those shortbread cookies. But when is the last time you wen to a Scottish 5 star resteruant?
 
Last I checked, Alexander Fleming is a Catholic, not an Anglican.
 
Crescentinus said:
Last I checked, Alexander Fleming is a Catholic, not an Anglican.
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I can’t find a solid biography as to his religious beliefs. But he is interred in St. Paul’s Cathedral in London, which is Church of England. I suppose it is possible that Catholics are interred there as well, given the national significance of the building.
stpauls.co.uk/Cathedral-History/Explore-the-Cathedral/Discover-the-Crypt

FindAGrave.com says he was cremated first. That would be unusual for a Catholic in 1955, but then his family may have made the decision and not him.
 
Dale_M said:
I can’t find a solid biography as to his religious beliefs. But he is interred in St. Paul’s Cathedral in London, which is Church of England. I suppose it is possible that Catholics are interred there as well, given the national significance of the building.
stpauls.co.uk/Cathedral-History/Explore-the-Cathedral/Discover-the-Crypt

FindAGrave.com says he was cremated first. That would be unusual for a Catholic in 1955, but then his family may have made the decision and not him.
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I recall hearing about his Catholicism on one of Michael Voris’s Catholic Investigative Agency episodes. o:
youtube.com/watch?v=-xpVueJyjwc&feature=plcp
Do you want me to get the info page behind the video?
 
Dale M wrote:
Someone more knowledgeable about Spain than myself will surely have better insight. However, it is possible that these anti-Catholic incidents are a legacy of Spain’s past. The fallout from the Spanish Civil War and from the Franco era, at least according to some Spanish journalists, have never been fully resolved.
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It is entirely possible that Franco’s dictatorship fueled this anti-Catholicism. Oppressive policies and tactics may pacify some moderates, but it also tends to radicalize the opposition. Those grievances have, sadly, become part of Spanish culture.
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Franco’s been dead for over 30 years.

If a mob of 100 people decide to trespass and commit hate crimes in today’s Spain against Catholics, Franco’s past deeds do not justify or excuse the mob’s bad acts.
 
Pork_Roll said:
We will never agree on how we should judge which country was best. Economists cant agree, why would we? Even if Scotland produced more scientists, their contributions to the culinary arts are lacking. Not to say I don’t enjoy Scottish beer, scotch or those shortbread cookies. But when is the last time you wen to a Scottish 5 star resteruant?
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Er… you re a bit behind the time!:eek:

Here’s a list a Scottish Restaurants with Michelin stars! eatscotland.visitscotland.com/news/three_new_scottish_michelin_stars

Gordon Ramsey is Scottish and he’s perhaps the most recognizable chef in the world!

As well as scientists we could also list Scottish economists, engineers, soldiers, writers, explorers, sailors etc etc etc - all equally impressive.

As well as the best football manager of all time - Sir Alex Ferguson.
 
Dwyer said:
Franco’s been dead for over 30 years.

If a mob of 100 people decide to trespass and commit hate crimes in today’s Spain against Catholics, Franco’s past deeds do not justify or excuse the mob’s bad acts.
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The article I linked to cited a Spanish journalist on the left side of the political spectrum, and a Spanish journalist from the right side. Both of them agreed that Spain has not come to terms with the legacy of the Franco years.

As I mentioned before, I am not familiar with Spain. But Franco was dictator of that country for 30 years. It is easy to believe that his policies have shaped contemporary Spanish society and culture. And that includes the political sentiments which are current today.

That does not excuse acts of violence. But it may explain, at least in part, what motivates them.
 
triumphguy said:
Southern Catholic Europe was a mess, and so were their colonies. The only European colonies that became viable democracies were colonies of Protestant countries (and especially Britain).
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I have to point out that you’re missing a key element here: The Protestant colonies that flourished were those in which a tremendous diaspora of English settled and formed the new majority. The Protestant countries in which the Anglo-Saxons did not populate in large numbers did not fare nearly as well as the US, Canada, and Australia.

The difference between the two is that the two Southern Catholic powers at the time (Spain and Portugal, and France to an extent) formed legal colonies in the new world, but the majority of the Spanish and Portuguese population remained at home. The ethnic stock stayed in Europe, and for that reason the European civilization stayed there with them. I would suggest that it’s not really an adequate comparison.
 
I heard about this yesterday or the day before I believe. I find what these youths did to be quite shocking. It is amazing just how much hate and vitriol anti-Catholics can spew.
 
Holly3278 said:
I heard about this yesterday or the day before I believe. I find what these youths did to be quite shocking. It is amazing just how much hate and vitriol anti-Catholics can spew.
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If they can do so online, imagine what they can say in real life.
 
triumphguy said:
Wealthy per capita maybe, but not in overall wealth.

I think there are a number of objective criteria that could be used: How has a system or country changed the world for the better?

What are their major inventions or contributions to science?

How have they contributed to culture and the arts?

Have they changed social systems to make them more just? For example abolishing slavery, bringing in democracy etc.

How do Lichtenstein or Luxembourg fare in comparison to say, England, or even a small part of Britain, Scotland with only 6 million people (who are very protestant, far more so than “Anglican” England)?

Here’s 10 Scottish scientists.
  • John Logie Baird: Used a coffin lid and biscuit tin to create his first television, produced jam.
  • Alexander Graham Bell: Invented the telephone, worked with deaf people and experimented with flight.
  • Joseph Black: Discovered carbon dioxide and investigated the the difference between heat and temperature.
  • Alexander Fleming: Found that nasal mucus could destroy bacteria, and called his discovery ‘penicillin’.
  • James Hutton: Clashed with the Church over his belief that the Earth was millions of years old and founded modern geology.
  • Lord Kelvin: Devised the absolute temperature scale and installed a telegraph cable under the Atlantic Ocean.
  • James Clerk Maxwell: Made discoveries about Saturn and about electricity and magnetism, and took the first colour photograph.
  • John Napier: Invented logarithms to simplify complicated calculations.
  • Robert Watson-Watt: Developed radar in a way that was crucial to Britain and her Allies winning the Second World War.
  • James Watt: Helped spark off the Industrial Revolution with his steam engine inventions.
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While those shifty Southern Europeans were creating apex civilizations those Scots were eating each other whilst painted blue in the nude. :rolleyes:
 
triumphguy said:
Sources please.

Winston Churchill was anti-fascist.
Pope Pius XII was anti fascist.
My parents during WW2 were anti-fascist.
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WWII was very much an “enemy-of-my-enemy-is-my-friend” situation. Conservatives, monarchists, oppressed groups, etc. joined up with Communists and other leftists to fight the Nazi occupation of many countries. And these ad-hoc “alliances” lasted about 5 minutes after the end of the War. Not really comparable to the more vocal groups out there today calling themselves “anti-fascist,” who lean pretty far to the left - which is actually kind of understandable, since, if the Fascists ever did take over, they’d be the first ones targeted…
 
very sad

the 498 martyrs of the Spanish Civil war

Saint Innocencio of Mary Immaculate

Eugenio Sanz-Orozco Mortera

Blessed Bartolomé Blanco Márquez

St Josemaria Escriva

and all others who lost their lives in the name of faith pray for the Church of spain.
 
Please read before commenting.

“While those shifty Southern Europeans were creating apex civilizations those Scots were eating each other whilst painted blue in the nude.”

Seeing Truimphguy extoll the (very valid) contributions of Scots in the Age of Enlightenment and beyond while simultaneously attacking various Meditteranean nations warranted a reminder of what the Romans encountered in Hyperborea; naked blue savages eating each other.
 
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