SPLIT: Paying for Faith Formation

[familyof4]

Hmm. I never thought that having to pay for expenses that are above and beyond normal expenses was a sign that my parish was trying to gouge me.

Here’s my experience:

RCIA and adult confirmation classes are done at no charge. We give each RCIA student a New American study bible and we may give a copy of the CCC (the small paperback) to our students. We also provide the handouts, and our time free of charge.

Continuing faith formation classes for Catholic adults: Usually around 10 dollars for the entire class. This covers the materials given out. These classes run for anywhere from eight to sixteen weeks.

CFF classes for children: I believe the cost is 50/student, with a higher cost at 1st Communion to cover additional materials. This is for a year, so basically about 2 bucks a week to help pay for materials, electricity, etc. I’m only guessing at the number of weeks the kids go, but it seems like about 26. It may be more. It doesn’t seem like a severe imposition to me.

Our budget and the collections cover our regular overhead for running the church. We would love not to have to charge for anything, but the amount given by members simply doesn’t cover every last expense. I wish it did. Ask any faith formation teacher if they pay for items out of their own wallet, and chances are they do. Ask a priest if they pay for things (assuming they’re diocean, not religious), and they do. Small things like the coffee or treats. Pizza night for the kids. All these things add up.

We also never turn away anyone because they can’t afford to pay for a class or to tithe. Look around next time you’re at mass. How many people do you think are registered parishioners? Maybe 1/3rd. Then guess how much most people donate. Maybe 20 bucks for a family, but it’s usually dollar bills… Many parishes make do without a lot, and only ask for assistance because it is necessary, not because it’s a money making opportunity.

If you really think your parish is handling finances poorly, why don’t YOU get involved? Honestly, the most belly-aching comes from those who seem to think that they shouldn’t lift a finger to help.

 

[EasterJoy]

RCIA and adult confirmation classes are done at no charge.

“Hey kid, c’mere…what’s it gonna hurt? Tell ya what? First one’s free…”

I don’t know any lessons for kids that are remotely as cheap as RE typically is. Still, if there were a donation being asked for sacramental prep that seems way out of line, it is right to ask about it, even if you aren’t the parishioner being asked to pay it.

 

[puzzleannie]

I see no suggestion, not one. on how you expect to pay for the cost of books and supplies at your parish.

 

[Jennifer_J]

The fees are used for texts. It’s not for the sacrament. If you can’t afford the fee, then speak with the priest and it’s sure to be waived (all of our forms state this, btw). In our parish, if you volunteer as a teacher or helper, it’s FREE (that’s called incentive). We have a paid faith formation director, but all the teachers are volunteers. She doesn’t receive any of the fee money, except as a budget for books, paper, copier and such. I really don’t understand the outrage at a reasonable fee for texts and supplies.

I will also say, my kids attend Catholic school AND faith formations nights. They enjoy getting to know more kids in the parish and coming along with me when I teach. I think faith formation is so important that I volunteer and I pay for both. What are YOU doing??

 

[yablabo]

I have lived in many states over the past few years and have had my kids in various parish catechism classes that were free. This is really the way it should be because you shouldn’t charge anything to teach the Holy Faith given to us by Jesus Christ free of charge and handed down to us free of charge for over 2000 years. You especially shouldn’t charge for the sacraments or the reception of the sacraments. Could you ever imaging Jesus charging the apostles a silver piece for their first Eucharist at the last supper? He would never do this because it is a sacrilege to put a price tag on the Body and Blood of Christ who is God. Nor can you put a price tag on what was handed down from Christ as our Faith which He freely gave to us.

When you charge a fee, you are not only behaving like a Judas, you are also making it harder for the poor (the ones Our Lord especially loved and embraced) to receive the Faith and the sacraments.

This has become an issue for me because I just joined a parish in Round Rock, Texas and they are going to charge me $75 for 1st Communion classes for my daughter. They told me that I have to take the class in order for my daughter to receive 1st Communion and that I have to pay. When I ask them if they are going to refuse 1st Communion to my daughter if we don’t pay they simply state that I need to pay for the class for the “materials.” What I say is throw out the materials if that is the barrier to my daughter receiving the sacrament. She doesn’t need materials. She only needs Our Blessed Lord. I teach her every Sunday from the Baltimore Catechism (which is timeless as our Faith is) so she knows everything about the meaning of the Eucharist and has been ready for two years now to receive Our Lord.

I refuse to pay for Faith formation or to pay to receive a sacrament because it’s immoral to do so. Have we forgotten the abuse of Johann Tetzel selling spiritual goods? What penalty the Church paid for his selling spiritual things! What penalty will we pay for charging to learn about Christ and to receive the sacraments?

We all know where the money is going. Judas knew where the money he collected was going. I taught catechism at several Texas parishes in the past and I wasn’t given any money for any of the materials which I paid for out of my own pocket. Nor was I offered anything for these materials. The only thing I was given was a watered down text that could be used in any Protestant church because it didn’t teach the Roman Catholic Faith. In fact the DRE criticized me for teaching about things like confession and original sin which she said the “church” no longer teaches. This was a DRE that was getting paid fulltime.

I’m sure there are many parents who decide to not take their kids to Faith formation because of the charges. I understand how much the materials may cost but there are other ways to remove these costs. You could find a solid catechism and just re-use it every year. Just ask the kids to bring their own pencil and paper and the cost would be 99cents per student per year.

I’m not poor and could pay these charges but refuse to do so because the charges are immoral!

It’s a serious matter to accuse another person of simony, which is a grave sin. One should be certain that what these people are doing is actually simony before one makes an accusation.

There is a manifest behavior amongst specific groups of people which lead them to jump to conclusions that one cannot jump to rationally, nor morally. If the parish priest’s delegates in charge of catechism for the children are guilty of simony, the parish priest should be informed, since he is the one the Bishop put into place to regulate the sacraments in that parish.

Also, often, in such cases, when one goes to see the parish priest, he is quoted to say that there is no impediment to the reception of the sacraments for these individual children. Priests in general are very permissive with the sacraments and often bend over backwards to get the sacraments to those whom the priests perceive as in need.

If that is not the case in your parish, take up your issues with the Bishop…but be darned certain that any accusation you make against another person truly fits, for your sake.

Best wishes for you and your family.

– Nicole

 

[agnes_therese]

The Universal Church has always condemned this practice regardless of how much the DRE’s want this extra pocket money. It’s just blood money as Judas found with his pieces of silver when he returned it to the high priests who wouldn’t even take it.

• Tim

Accusing the DREs of taking “pocket money” from the fees is an extremely serious accusation. If you have proof, you need to take it to the pastor. If you don’t, you should refrain from detraction.

 

[MissRose73]

Most churches have mentioned in their bulletins that those parents who truly cannot afford religious education for their kids that they can waive the fees. I would presume its done on a case by case basis privately. Most parents can afford a nominal fee for their kids to attend religious education classes through their parish. Many parishes I’ve read about online sometimes give discounts to those who may have 2 or 3 kids+ attending.

Most of those who teach the classes are not getting even paid for the time they spend in preparation then teaching. The teachers must have a book to teach from in addition to student editions for the students. I even remember some basic school supplies are either provided by the catechist, the parish, or parents are asked to have their kids bring some items like paper and pencils. The parish must also pay the utility bills for the rooms being used.

I remember the fees for classes were small when I was growing up for classes regardless if we went through a sacrament preparation too during that school year too. I don’t recall my parents telling me and my sister that they did not pay more than $20 per student for the year but its too far back to recall the cost.

Some parishes may allow for home instruction with materials that they may charge for especially for students who may be shuffled among homes due to single or divorced parents etc. I know my sister’s kids get home instruction by my mother with permission of the parish religious education director. I am sure my mother paid the nominal fee for the textbooks so her grandchildren can get their religious education as the parents don’t have time to do it themselves.

 

[Corki]

Obviously the trend is to charge for religious education and require it for First Communion. (We didn’t pay for it on the West Coast.)

Just because it’s becoming more common doesn’t mean it’s right.

(It’s becoming trendy to teach children that there is not such thing as sin or hell, too.)

Since everyone has suspiciously ignored the response that the Catholic priest gave on the subject, I’ll re-paste it.

Dear friend,

I’m shocked at such simony as well. I have never heard of children paying for religious instruction-let alone paying for sacraments.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church (#2121) states: “Simony is defined as the buying or selling of spiritual things.” Jesus said. “You received without pay, give without pay (Mt 10:8). “It is impossible to appropriate to oneself spiritual goods and behave toward them as their owner or master, for they have their source in God. One can receive them only from him, without payment.”

This is information that your bishop needs to know since the sacramental ministry in the diocese is his responsibility.

Fr. Vincent Serpa, O.P.

You left out the question to which Fr. Serpa was replying:

A Catholic Church, at which I am teaching CCD, has an overwelming population of Latinos and Filipinos who are in attendence. They are poor. The priests at this Church are charging a sum of $300 per child to attend. I think this is evil. The children have only once a week class, for only one hour. In return, they get a book, and me as a teacher. I am free. Why is this cost so outrageous? Now I have learned that these priests at this Church charge set fees: $200 per Baptism, $1000 per matrimony, and, as one teacher who teaches at the Catholic Church said to me, “They charge for all the Sacraments”…

Isn’t this like the old days pre reformation of ‘selling indulgences’??? Why is this happening? Is this common practice? What has happened to the Catholic Church now?

The parish in question reportedly admitted to “charging for the Sacraments”.

Charging hundreds of dollars to people who can’t afford it is very different than a parish charging $25 and waiving tuition whenever asked. The latter is the topic in this thread.

I don’t know any lessons for kids that are remotely as cheap as RE typically is. Still, if there were a donation being asked for sacramental prep that seems way out of line, it is right to ask about it, even if you aren’t the parishioner being asked to pay it.

Accusing the DREs of taking “pocket money” from the fees is an extremely serious accusation. If you have proof, you need to take it to the pastor. If you don’t, you should refrain from detraction.

Agreed. No one is profiting from CCE, for heaven’s sake.

Let me show you how it works in my parish:

What we ask parents to pay:

Registration is $25 per child no matter what grade. Sacrament years are not any more. We do 30 weeks of class a year. That’s 83 cents per class (1.25 hours each week). If your child is preparing for FHC and has not been regularly attending, they go to “catch up class” - no extra charge. If your child is preparing for FHC or Confirmation, there are 5 parent classes - no extra charge. If your child is preparing for FHC or Confirmation, there is a one-day retreat with lunch included - no extra charge.

Costs:

Text books - $20/each - they are soft cover and are replaced about every 3-4 years.
Workbooks - $10 - $12/each - depending on the grade
Parent text - $5 (they get to keep it) for first class, $15 for second class
Bibles - each HS student gets one to keep - $5/each
Catechism - each teacher gets one to keep - $10/each
Classroom supplied - program provides basic supplies: markers, sticky notes, pads of paper. Kids are asked to bring writing utensils. Teacher can be reimbursed for up to $25/year for other supplies.
Teachers supply craft supplies, pencils for kids who forget, copies of supplemental material.
Teachers are all volunteers, so is the DRE. In most parishes, the DRE is a paid position and this cost is charged to the CCE program.
Teachers go to one diocisan conference a year -$10/teacher
Teacher certification is paid by the teacher $225 for theology program (over 18 months), we have two in-serviced Catechists who teach the Catechetics modules “in house”. Those in-serviced teachers paid $15 (out of their pocket) for each course they are certified to teach.
The classroom building has electricity, paint, maintenance, heat, etc. expensese. This is a cheap metal pre-fab building that runs the A/C only on Sundays and once-a-month Wed. evenings. No extravagence here but it’s not free.

For Sacrament classes there is also the expense of the organist, flowers and certificates.

As you can see, at this point, the program is already “in the red” based on the $25/student fee. About 1/3 of our students have their tution waived.

Each Catechist probably spends $50 or more out of her/his own pocket each year on extra supplies, snacks and motivation (ie stickers for the littles, Holy Cards, attendance rewards).

The DRE spends a couple of hundred dollars each year out of her own pocket.

The Catholic Daughters and the KofC donate food for end of semester celebrations, videos, and gifts for the FHC and Confirmation recipients.

Everything else comes out of the parish general funds.

If you want to underwrite the costs at your parish - great. I am sure they would appreciate it. Charging a nominal fee for CCE is a way to cost-share that works for many parishes. If that doesn’t work for your parish, get involved and try to change the system.

 

[MelbaTozt]

Someone tell me why it would be wrong to attach a predetermined fee to Last Rites.

I’ll even add that the fee could be waived if the dying qualifies for financial aid. Heck, you could even implement a sliding scale according to means. (i.e. The Dying: “How much is it?” The Parish: “How much you got?”)

A child should receive First Holy Communion without meeting a required financial obligation and making RE mandatory (unless you’re poor) is an indirect way of asking money for a sacrament. (Suggesting a donation is fine.)

When I pay my tithe each week at Mass, this is what I’m paying for. If our parishes do not find it a priority to teach our children in the Faith and offer them the sacraments, what in the world is their priority?

Oh, and all this hooey about “we don’t want to be babysitters for families who otherwise wouldn’t bring their children” and using a fee to “weed out” the serious-minded from the frivolous is shocking. If that’s how you truly feel, then…well, wow. It’s sad that I need to point out how all children are precious to God and He wants them all to learn the Faith and receive His Sacraments no matter the spiritual condition of the parents. What a profound opportunity to reach out to a child who needs the instruction all the more!

 

[puzzleannie]

Accusing the DREs of taking “pocket money” from the fees is an extremely serious accusation. If you have proof, you need to take it to the pastor. If you don’t, you should refrain from detraction.

if anyone has such information it is a criminal matter and must be reported immediately to law enforcement as well as to the diocese as in, today. Since obviously no one has such information that is not going to happen and I must say I do not appreciate the slander and libel against my profession.

 

[puzzleannie]

Someone tell me why it would be wrong to attach a predetermined fee to Last Rites.

e!

it would be against canon law and the sin of simony, but it is also NOT the topic of this thread.
the topic of this thread is that parents expect other parishioners to pick up the cost of textbooks, staff salaries, overhead, materials and supplies to educated their own children in the faith, and to prepare them for sacraments. While it would be admirable if parents took the entire responsibility for the child’s religious education upon themselves, parishes are here to help. While it would also be admirable if every parish tithed so all services including this were free, that is not going to happen until bishops mandate it. So barring that, you can either be the group of parents who live in but do not support their parish financially, yet expect all services free, or you can join the group of parents who are unable to contribute financially but do so through their (essential) volunteer service to the parish, or you can just rant on general principles.

I don’t know why this discussion is allowed to continue on this forum as There are no charges for sacraments. never. ever. There are often charges for the costs associated with sacramental preparation offered by the parish. They are two distinct things.

CCD-RE-PSR is NOT sacramental preparation, it is religious education.
Sacramental preparion is a service offered by the parish as a separate service.
If parents do not want to pay you must be prepared to offer an alternative plan for funding these programs in your parish.

 

[MelbaTozt]

it would be against canon law and the sin of simony, but it is also NOT the topic of this thread.
the topic of this thread is that parents expect other parishioners to pick up the cost of textbooks, staff salaries, overhead, materials and supplies to educated their own children in the faith, and to prepare them for sacraments. While it would be admirable if parents took the entire responsibility for the child’s religious education upon themselves, parishes are here to help. While it would also be admirable if every parish tithed so all services including this were free, that is not going to happen until bishops mandate it. So barring that, you can either be the group of parents who live in but do not support their parish financially, yet expect all services free, or you can join the group of parents who are unable to contribute financially but do so through their (essential) volunteer service to the parish, or you can just rant on general principles.

I don’t know why this discussion is allowed to continue on this forum as There are no charges for sacraments. never. ever. There are often charges for the costs associated with sacramental preparation offered by the parish. They are two distinct things.

CCD-RE-PSR is NOT sacramental preparation, it is religious education.
Sacramental preparion is a service offered by the parish as a separate service.
If parents do not want to pay you must be prepared to offer an alternative plan for funding these programs in your parish.

Whether you educate your child at home or not isn’t the issue. I’m referring to a MANDATORY fee-based class for all children wishing to receive First Holy Communion whether the parents take on the responsibility or not.

Logic tells us that if you require money for a class, and you then make that class mandatory to receive a Sacrament, then you are indirectly attaching a fee to the Sacrament.

The question is: Is it right or wrong?

 

[Corki]

When I pay my tithe each week at Mass, this is what I’m paying for. If our parishes do not find it a priority to teach our children in the Faith and offer them the sacraments, what in the world is their priority?

See, if everyone was like you we wouldn’t even be having this discussion.

But the sad reality is that the vast majority of students in the CCE program come from families who are not tithing each week; they are not giving time, talent, or treasure to the parish; they are probably not even going to Mass.

It is a priortiy to teach the children the Faith but the CCE teachers can’t do it alone. If the parents aren’t teaching at home, then they can put up $25 to help the program do more than its share.

It is much more time consuming and expensive to teach kids who are not going to Mass, not learning their prayers at home and not seeing the teaching reinforced at home.

 

[jmcrae]

Whether you educate your child at home or not isn’t the issue. I’m referring to a MANDATORY fee-based class for all children wishing to receive First Holy Communion whether the parents take on the responsibility or not.

If the parents are home-schooling their child in religious education, and the child can pass the (very easy) exam given by the priest, he would not be required to take any classes or pay any fees. This sort of thing happens all the time.

However, the majority of parents have not educated themselves in the faith well enough to be able to teach their own kids, so preparation classes are necessary for those kids. The small fee (which can be waived in the case of those who can’t or won’t pay) helps to cover the cost of materials and administration of the program.

 

[yablabo]

Whether you educate your child at home or not isn’t the issue. I’m referring to a MANDATORY fee-based class for all children wishing to receive First Holy Communion whether the parents take on the responsibility or not.

Logic tells us that if you require money for a class, and you then make that class mandatory to receive a Sacrament, then you are indirectly attaching a fee to the Sacrament.

The question is: Is it right or wrong?

I personally believe that the whole issue with these children being mandated to take these classes in preparation to receive the sacraments…is that nary a person discusses this with the parish priest. Most people that have a problem with it, for some reason, do not see fit to go to the parish authority…I don’t have any notion why. Priests in my experience are very permissive with the sacraments whether you take the prep classes or not. The fact is, he is the go-to guy in the parish as regards baptism, penance, holy communion, matrimony and extreme unction…and the bishop is the go-to guy as regards confirmation. If you think your child is being sleighted in some way, bust open a copy of Canon Law…or better yet, open it on the Vatican homepage (www.vatican.va) and find out what you can and can’t demand. Then go from there…Canon Law in hand…and request the sacraments for your children. I have never seen it go that far personally…a private conversation with the priest is all that it’s ever required in my experience. No bashing, no name-calling, no rash accusation of sin…

I mean…come on…let’s be adults!

– Nicole

 

[MelbaTozt]

If the parents are home-schooling their child in religious education, and the child can pass the (very easy) exam given by the priest, he would not be required to take any classes or pay any fees. This sort of thing happens all the time.

However, the majority of parents have not educated themselves in the faith well enough to be able to teach their own kids, so preparation classes are necessary for those kids. The small fee (which can be waived in the case of those who can’t or won’t pay) helps to cover the cost of materials and administration of the program.

An exam in lieu of a fee-based class sounds logical and fair… and something I have yet to hear about. You write this with certainty as if every parish offers this. Do they? How does one ask for it? Is there a secret code I should know about? And what if there is no such exam?

I ask this not for myself but for all the parents and children wishing to receive the Sacrament without paying for a class.

 

[Corki]

If the parents are home-schooling their child in religious education, and the child can pass the (very easy) exam given by the priest, he would not be required to take any classes or pay any fees. This sort of thing happens all the time.

Exactly. In our parish, if the student is home-schooled or goes to Catholic school, we only ask them to attend CCE for two of the eleven years. Second grade is really more for the parents, who tend to want their children to receive FHC with the prettily dressed group. With Confirmation, the pastor and DRE are asked to confirm to the Bishop that the students have been properly prepared. The year they spend in class is a good way to assess that preparation. Theoretically, that year could be by-passed too and the assessment could be done in an interview but no one has asked for that in a very long time. I know one homeschooling family that did a “by-pass” for their oldest child but then sent the rest of the kids to the single year of class for Confirmation.

Frankly, in the 12 years I have been involved in our parish CCE program, no one has ever complained about the fee. We have several payment options and grant lots of waivers (no questions asked) as well as discounts for multiple chidren and for teachers’ kids. We used to have complaints about the materials before we went to a more traditional text. And we have had complaints about teachers. No one bats 1000 all the time but bad teachers are usually not around long. Our DRE is very picky and only the most orthodox teachers are assiged to the Sacrament years. But no one complains about the fee.

Admittedly, charging for CCE on a per-student basis is only one way to do it. But if you are going to gripe about it, be prepared to step up with another workable solution to fund the program. If you say “take it out of the Sunday collection,” how are you going to get the collection amounts up to cover it? If you say “it should be free” how are **you **going to solicit donations to cover materials and facilities?

 

[MelbaTozt]

No bashing, no name-calling, no rash accusation of sin…

I mean…come on…let’s be adults!

– Nicole

Would have been a nice suggestion if you hadn’t ended it by throwing in a jab by implying we are acting like children.

 

[jmcrae]

An exam in lieu of a fee-based class sounds logical and fair… and something I have yet to hear about. You write this with certainty as if every parish offers this. Do they? How does one ask for it?

One walks up to the priest when he is not distracted by something else, and says, “Excuse me, Father, my name is [name]. You might remember me from the work I’ve been doing with [your parish involvement]. My wife and I have been using the [name of program] Program of Catechetical Instruction with our child at home. We recently completed the chapter on Mass and Holy Communion, and my wife and I believe that she is fully prepared to receive Holy Communion at the next available opportunity. I wonder if we could schedule an appointment for me and my child in your office some time this week, after 3:00 pm when she gets out of school, so that you can meet her and we can discuss this.”

He will say something like, “Make an appointment through my secretary this Monday, and bring a copy of your child’s Baptismal certificate with you to the meeting.”

Is there a secret code I should know about?

Not really, no. Being known to your priest is helpful, though. One becomes known to one’s priest through being actively involved in the parish.

And what if there is no such exam?

I can’t think of any reason there wouldn’t be.

 

[Corki]

An exam in lieu of a fee-based class sounds logical and fair… and something I have yet to hear about. You write this with certainty as if every parish offers this. Do they? How does one ask for it? Is there a secret code I should know about? And what if there is no such exam?

It’s usually not a written exam. You speak to the pastor. It is his responsibility to ensure that each child is prepared.

I ask this not for myself but for all the parents and children wishing to receive the Sacrament without paying for a class

If that’s their reason, I can almost guarantee that the pastor will say “no”. There are valid reasons to do this such as a child with a disability that makes classroom learning difficult or a custody arrangement that makes it impossible for the child to regularly attend class. There are some children who have been so well prepared at home that the class would not add anything to their preparation. However, wanting something for nothing is not a valid reason.