SPLIT: Speaking in Tongues (Revisited)

[grannymh]

Another thing that puzzles me about praying in tongues is this:

When the disciples asked Jesus how to pray, he gave them the words of the Our Father. These were actual words not incomprehensible speech.

In my humble opinion, one should accept Jesus teaching the Our Father without comparing it to the Gifts of the Holy Spirit which would not be available until Pentecost. One can refer to John, Chapter 14 for the promise of the Advocate*.*

Blessings,
granny

John 14: 18

 

[St_Gabriel]

…

 

[St_Gabriel]

Thanks again granny and all.

A few more questions (I hope I’m not tiring you out):

How does one know for certain if they have the gift of tongues or if others really have it?

In my own experience, many people that I have met (all non-catholic) claimed that they have the gift of tongues, but they don’t prove it by showing me an example. Is it something that one would be embarassed about? Why are they so secretive about it? Perhaps there is no one here that can answer that last question but those people themselves. But then, maybe someone on these forums maybe able to offer a possible explaination. Have you ever felt embarassed to speak in tongues?

It is a gift from the Holy Spirit after all. It sure would make things easier for those of us who have not experienced it, to know what it is.

At the charismatic catholic healing masses is it a common occurence to have people speak with tongues? It seems to happen frequently at protestant pentecostal services.

 

[St_Gabriel]

I can share an experience I had. It was when I was younger at a youth group during a Sunday evening. We were walking through the lobby when I heard someone speaking loudly, almost yelling, in what was certainly not English. There was also another guy who was speaking in English. The guy who was speaking in gibberish (at least what it sounded like to me) never stopped for a pause like he was thinking, and later I found out (all us kids were staring for 2 or 3 minutes until the youth pastor got us because it was really weird for us since the church I was going to was not charismatic at all) that he was speaking in Hebrew, and he was quoting a long passage from Isaiah, one of the prophecies on Christ. The guy speaking in English had been studying Hebrew for seminary, but the first guy had no experience with Hebrew at all. This was in a group of about 10-15 Korean men who were having a Bible study in the sanctuary during a Sunday night. Looking back it was pretty memorable and seems to me to be pretty real, because

1. There was an interpreter
2. He wasn’t just speaking random nonsense (assuming the interpreter was interpreting correctly)
3. All of the kids were afraid to go in because we didn’t feel it was right. This could be attributed to fear of unknown or strangeness perhaps, but also could have been because we felt that place was holy and we subconsciously had the fear of God in us.

I would caution you OP, not to attribute the works of the Holy Spirit to either lies or other spirits. Blaspheming the Holy Spirit is pretty dang serious, so just be careful

This is amazing.

I’m trying to understand the context of what occurred.
Did it occur in a Catholic church or was at a protestant church? I guess it can happen anywhere really. Why were they in the sanctuary?

Were the people just speaking out to everyone in the lobby or were they speaking loudly just to themselves in the prayer group? Who benefited from this (did it help to build up the church)? Was there anyone else present besides the Korean men or your youth group.

 

[grannymh]

One fellow told me that he rebukes the evil spirits using tongues

I believe this is the last section of your post 29 which I need to answer. Some of my answers may help with more recent posts.

In my opinion, the best prayer to rebuke evil spirits is "Saint Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle…
However, praying that we be protected from evil spirits is a worthy intention and people do pray in tongues for that intention.

and then I’ve also encountered another person who said he thought that he was possessed and I noticed that whenever he got angry, he would start to talk in some gibberish language that I could not understand. I figured it was some kind of tongue.

I need to warn you about trying to figure out if people are praying or not in tongues. It is nearly pointless since we do not know what is happening within a person’s heart.
I suppose there could be a very experienced charismatic who might be able to detect an attempt to fool others, but again this is pointless.

And in another case, when my son was just learning to speak, I had one person ask me what language he was speaking when all the time he was just speaking baby talk. This came from someone who would be familiar with hearing others speaking in tongues, since it occurs at their prayer services.

Some prayer languages do sound like early baby sounds. However, I would doubt that a very young child would understand how to yield to the Holy Spirit. I certainly would not doubt that very young children do pray to God the best way they know how.

In other words, knowing what someone else is doing in personal prayer to God may be interesting but it isn’t practical.

Blessings,
granny,

Praise God always.

 

[grannymh]

Thanks again granny and all.

A few more questions (I hope I’m not tiring you out):

Keep asking.

How does one know for certain if they have the gift of tongues or if others really have it?

My suggestion is to view the sounds coming from one’s mouth as genuine. We all know when we are faking. As for others, it is not important for us to evaluate someone else’s way of praying.

In my own experience, many people that I have met (all non-catholic) claimed that they have the gift of tongues, but they don’t prove it by showing me an example.

That also baffles me.

Is it something that one would be embarrassed about? Why are they so secretive about it? Perhaps there is no one here that can answer that last question but those people themselves. But then, maybe someone on these forums maybe able to offer a possible explaination.

If they have the Gift of speaking God’s message to the community which requires an interpreter, they should be able to speak freely about their experiences. Let me explain what usually happens in a Catholic prayer meeting.

The prayer meeting starts out with songs of praise. In between, the group prays in tongues or in English as individuals. After praising and thanking God, everyone becomes very quiet out of respect for the Holy Spirit Who may be preparing someone to be a messenger of God. In our hearts, we are asking God to send us a message. The message may be a pertinent Scripture passage or it may be words of exhortation to lead better lives, etc.

A person with the gift of speaking God’s message will also be in humble prayer. When the moment is right, this person will speak the message in an unknown language. Again, there will be silence as we pray for an inspired interpretation. This comes from the person with the gift of interpretation. In addition, in some prayer groups there will be individuals who will discern if the interpretation is authentic. A message which is in conflict with the teachings of the Catholic Church would be a fake.

The meeting may conclude with petitions or a special prayer. There may be discussion of how the “message” needs to be applied to our daily lives. Sometimes a speaker gives a teaching. The basic idea is to praise and thank God and then listen to God, individually in our own souls, or publically through hearing God’s message in tongues and then in interpretation.

Have you ever felt embarrassed to speak in tongues?

No. There are times when someone asks to hear tongues. If we are near a church, I suggest we make a visit to pray to God together. Or I find a quiet spot. Then I briefly explain the meaning of prayer tongues, quiet my own soul so I can yield to the Holy Spirit, and then let the Holy Spirit use my voice. I do mix in English prayers such as I love You Jesus and thank You for all You have done for me, etc. Then I am silent so my partner in prayer can pray in her own way.

It is a gift from the Holy Spirit after all. It sure would make things easier for those of us who have not experienced it, to know what it is.

As I said someplace, one does not have to be prayed over to receive the gift of praying in tongues. This will sound odd, but one of the ways to receive the gift of prayer tongues is to be so open to the Holy Spirit, that one is willing to imitate the prayer language of someone else.

This is the theory. A barrier to receiving the gift of tongues is the fear of doing something embarrassing. Having strange sounds come out of one’s mouth is not exactly an ordinary experience. The initial sounds could be grunts, off key notes, bits and pieces of some strange language or even a humming sound. For some people, it is plain difficult to yield control to the Holy Spirit.

What I do is to ask the person to stand close to me and try to imitate what I am saying. This is like a jump start. Usually, the person is concentrating on two things: the desire to pray in a pleasing way to God by yielding to the Holy Spirit and at the same time trying to imitate some of my sounds. Embarrassment fades. The person begins to relax as he or she becomes aware of strange sounds coming from his or her mouth. Sometimes the person feels that the sounds are changing – changing into one’s own personal prayer language.

It is hard to say when the person’s prayer ceases to be an imitation. That is not important. What is important is that the person eventually tries on his or her own to yield to the Holy Spirit and not hold back the sounds which may come. In other words, there is no right way or wrong way to be receptive to the Holy Spirit. Trust Him.

With me, there is a desire to pray in tongues, to let the Holy Spirit take over. It doesn’t make any difference what kind of sound I start with, or if I keep repeating what sounds like a phrase or if the sounds are uneven or if they flow. I am comfortable with whatever.

At the charismatic catholic healing masses is it a common occurence to have people speak with tongues? It seems to happen frequently at protestant pentecostal services.

Charismatic healing Masses do not have a set pattern. One I used to go to began with the Sacrament of Reconciliation given individually by priests, followed by the Sacrament of the Eucharist which often included the longest homily on record, and following the Mass there was the Sacrament of Anointing of the Sick. There would also be time for praying in tongues.

The main thing in a “healing” Mass is the Mass itself. The Eucharist is the source and summit of our faith. Charismatic activity leads to this Great Sacrament.

Blessings,
granny

Individuals bring their individuality to the Holy Spirit.

 

[Isaiah_41]

I still do not see a connection between meditative prayer and charismatic. They are clearly different forms and yet you attempt to say that they are both meditative?
If done in mass it would clearly be a distraction. What if this person is derranged? How would you know? And who are these so called “interpretors”? Where does there bonifides come from? I am going to do some reasearch and see what the Vatican has to say on the matter. I always accept what the Vatican says. By the way granny, do you have any Theoligical credentials? Just wondering, since your profile had no info. Please do not take offense to any critique I have of this subject. I think skepticism is important when dealing with the Church and spiritual issues. Afterall the Church does not give credence to every so called apparition, until there is years of research. If I come to fully accept the Charismatic movememnt it will be like accepting the different ‘Rights’ of the Catholic Church. PAX.

 

[grannymh]

I still do not see a connection between meditative prayer and charismatic. They are clearly different forms and yet you attempt to say that they are both meditative?

Thank you for your questions.
What I said in Post 37 was: “Marvelous meditative prayer and praying in tongues are not mutually exclusive styles.” In other words, they are different styles of praying, but you can use either one or the other as you so choose.

If done in mass it would clearly be a distraction. What if this person is derranged? How would you know?

Catholic charismatics are devoted to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. They often become lectors and extraordinary ministers. Many attend daily Mass as often as possible. They would not deliberately make a distraction during Mass.

Since handicapped people often attend the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, ushers would know who they are and act accordingly if they were making loud noises. If someone is deranged, the ushers would handle it. When something unusual is happening to a person during Mass, a doctor and/or nurse who are also there would check out the person.

And who are these so called “interpretors”? Where does there bonifides come from?

The gift of interpretation comes from the Holy Spirit. This gift is used when there is someone who is speaking God’s message in tongues. Both gifts are not the same as praying in tongues. These are very serious gifts and Catholic charismatics exercise caution when someone is using them. There are ways to discern if these are true gifts or fake.

I am going to do some reasearch and see what the Vatican has to say on the matter. I always accept what the Vatican says. By the way granny, do you have any Theoligical credentials? Just wondering, since your profile had no info.

Please share your research. In post 36, I quoted part of a statement made by American Bishops in 1969, two years after the Catholic Renewal started.
I don’t have any theological credentials, but I have been fortunate to have had excellent teachers regarding Catholicism. Yet, I am still learning.

Please do not take offense to any critique I have of this subject. I think skepticism is important when dealing with the Church and spiritual issues.

Your posts are always respectful. Skepticism is valuable. I often say that I am a direct descendent of Thomas the Apostle. That is why I am still learning.

Afterall the Church does not give credence to every so called apparition, until there is years of research. If I come to fully accept the Charismatic movememnt it will be like accepting the different ‘Rights’ of the Catholic Church. PAX.

Speaking of research. Around 1990-91, Experts examined the writings from the first eight centuries and found evidence that the Catholic baptism of the Holy Spirit along with the Gifts of the Holy Spirit were part of Catholicism since the beginning. Somehow, charismatic practices were slowly pushed to the back burner even though charismatic activity remained in the lives of saints. Eventually, in the 20th century, the Holy Spirit brought about what is often called a new Pentecost or a renewal of Pentecost.

May I point out that the intention of my posts is not necessarily to get people to fully accept the Catholic Charismatic Renewal. Rather, I would like people to understand it in relationship to its place in Catholic life. One does not have to be charismatic to receive gifts and graces from the Holy Spirit. Being able to talk about and write about our Faith is an important gift of the Holy Spirit. Having the determination to attend Sunday Holy Sacrifice of the Mass is a gift of the Holy Spirit – a gift of wisdom and a gift of perseverance. Five minutes will yield many Holy Spirit gifts in our lives.

Blessings,
granny

The human person is worthy of profound respect from the moment of conception.

 

[nickybr38]

I have not read all the responses so I apologize. I thought I would share my perspective.

1st. I do not believe God bestows us with His graces (powers, if you will - speaking in tongues, walking on water, moving mountains, etc, etc.) unless there is a purpose for it. When you read the Bible you will always find purpose behind every gift He bestowed upon the people. He never (that I’ve seen and I’m not biblical scholar) does something just to make someone feel good about themselves.

2nd. Often when someone is ‘babbling’ in ‘tongues’ there is no interpretor and the only benefit is that the person who speaks makes a spectacle of himself. That seems very contrary to anything Jesus ever taught.

3rd. I don’t believe speaking in tongues means speaking some ancient or heavenly language that no one can understand. Instead I believe speaking in tongues means to speak in such a way that even those not speaking your language understand you. Much as the disciples did in the beginning of Acts when the Holy Spirit came upon them and all who heard them heard their own language being spoken. They needed NO interpretation, no translation, they just undrstood.

4th. I have witnessed people speaking in tongues and prophesying in tongues. The last incident was in a Pentecostal church. A man stood and babbled away. His interpretor said his words meant; This church will be multiply and be very successful. Etc. Etc. Within a year that particular church closed down, the pastor retired from the ministry and the parishioners split off to other churches.

Clearly this was an example of a spirit that was NOT of God.

Finally when confronted with someone who is speaking in tongues test the spirit. How do you test the spirit? Pray. Quietly let the Lord speak to your heart. When you feel that tug; ‘I need to get out of here’, listen.

 

[grannymh]

I have not read all the responses so I apologize. I thought I would share my perspective.

I’m glad to meet you.

I am going to give you very brief answers to your points. If you require more, please let me know.

1st. I do not believe God bestows us with His graces (powers, if you will - speaking in tongues, walking on water, moving mountains, etc, etc.) unless there is a purpose for it. When you read the Bible you will always find purpose behind every gift He bestowed upon the people. He never (that I’ve seen and I’m not biblical scholar) does something just to make someone feel good about themselves.

The common gift of praying in tongues and the very rare gift of speaking God’s message in tongues do not belong in the same category as walking on water or moving mountains.

2nd. Often when someone is ‘babbling’ in ‘tongues’ there is no interpretor and the only benefit is that the person who speaks makes a spectacle of himself. That seems very contrary to anything Jesus ever taught.

When a Catholic charismatic humbly yields to the Holy Spirit’s gift of praying in tongues, this is considered a response to the exhortation to pray always. As you know, when we pray to God, we do benefit.

Please do not confuse praying to God in tongues with the other very rare gift of speaking God’s message in tongues which does require a second person who has the very rare gift of interpretation.

3rd. I don’t believe speaking in tongues means speaking some ancient or heavenly language that no one can understand. Instead I believe speaking in tongues means to speak in such a way that even those not speaking your language understand you. Much as the disciples did in the beginning of Acts when the Holy Spirit came upon them and all who heard them heard their own language being spoken. They needed NO interpretation, no translation, they just undrstood.

What is being described here is the miracle of hearing.

4th. I have witnessed people speaking in tongues and prophesying in tongues. The last incident was in a Pentecostal church. A man stood and babbled away. His interpretor said his words meant; This church will be multiply and be very successful. Etc. Etc. Within a year that particular church closed down, the pastor retired from the ministry and the parishioners split off to other churches.

Please do not confuse Pentecostal churches with the Catholic Church.

Clearly this was an example of a spirit that was NOT of God.

I cannot speak for Pentecostals, but in the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, speaking God’s message in tongues must be discerned to see if it is in accord with Catholic doctrines.

Finally when confronted with someone who is speaking in tongues test the spirit. How do you test the spirit? Pray. Quietly let the Lord speak to your heart. When you feel that tug; ‘I need to get out of here’, listen.

When a Catholic charismatic is praying to God in tongues, he or she would not at the same time be confronting anyone. In the Catholic Charismatic Renewal testing the spirit means that whatever is said cannot contradict Catholic teaching.

Blessings,
granny

Human life is meant for eternal life.

 

[nickybr38]

I’m glad to meet you.

Clearly I have no experience with Catholic Charismatics. When I read ‘speaking in tongues’, I think of those I’ve met who babble on endlessly… those who have made my very spirit recoil in horror. It’s hard to divorce that introduction from this new understanding.

I would hesitate to make any judgment on the Catholic Charismatic version of speaking in tongues as I have no experience with it.

I will say that you mention testing the spirit means to measure and see if the words being spoken contradict the Church, but how can you do that if the words being spoken are not being interpreted?

If you say the episode in Acts was a miracle of hearing (I would argue the disciples were the ones filled with the Spirit, not those listening, so how is it the ones hearing where the ones receiving a gift and not those who were filled?) then where is your version of speaking in tongues in the bible?

 

[kamaan]

Clearly I have no experience with Catholic Charismatics. When I read ‘speaking in tongues’, I think of those I’ve met who babble on endlessly… those who have made my very spirit recoil in horror. It’s hard to divorce that introduction from this new understanding.

I would hesitate to make any judgment on the Catholic Charismatic version of speaking in tongues as I have no experience with it.

I will say that you mention testing the spirit means to measure and see if the words being spoken contradict the Church, but how can you do that if the words being spoken are not being interpreted?

If you say the episode in Acts was a miracle of hearing (I would argue the disciples were the ones filled with the Spirit, not those listening, so how is it the ones hearing where the ones receiving a gift and not those who were filled?) then where is your version of speaking in tongues in the bible?

I have had experience with this Charismatic movement… it was unsettling, to say the least. Here is a link that I found very helpful and informative: sspx.org/miscellaneous/catholic_charismatic_renewal.htm … It’s a looooooong read, but it accurately described some of my feelings on the matter and helped me to understand what was going on. It deals with the whole issue of “praying in tongues”. I heartily recommend this link to you, nickybr38!

 

[Isaiah_41]

First of all did anyone notice that this thread is called “Sparking” in Tongues? -lol- Instead of “Speaking” in Tongues. I sure hope their tongues don’t ‘spark’! ouchy…I hope they correct that typo.
I agree with the point #4 of Post #48 by Nicky. I know this happened in a “pentecostal” church, but who is to say is could not happen in the Cathloic Church? We have to protect the Integrity of the Church.
The last quote I found from the Vatican was a “Cautious Acceptance” of the Charismatic movement. Because it ‘intentions’ seem good. This is far from an enthusiatic endorsement. However I tend to agree that the people are sincere and they love God, and maybe this expression is their way. I think I will leave it there. PAX.

 

[nickybr38]

I have had experience with this Charismatic movement… it was unsettling, to say the least. Here is a link that I found very helpful and informative: sspx.org/miscellaneous/catholic_charismatic_renewal.htm … It’s a looooooong read, but it accurately described some of my feelings on the matter and helped me to understand what was going on. It deals with the whole issue of “praying in tongues”. I heartily recommend this link to you, nickybr38!

Thank you. I don’t mind a long read now and then.

 

[grannymh]

Thank you. I don’t mind a long read now and then.

My apology to you. I need to respond to you and others but have not done so because the link provided by Kamaan requires quite a bit of study and research in order to be read properly.

I am ready to post a general reply. However, I would prefer to deal with specifics which you find interesting. Obviously, the author has genuine comments which can be discussed. What I find valuable may not be the same as what you find valuable.
Therefore, due to length of the piece, I would like to respond to those who are reading it first –
that is, I am interested in your reactions.

Blessings,
granny

The quest for spiritual truth needs Catholicism.

 

[grannymh]

I have had experience with this Charismatic movement… it was unsettling, to say the least. Here is a link that I found very helpful and informative: sspx.org/miscellaneous/catholic_charismatic_renewal.htm … It’s a looooooong read, but it accurately described some of my feelings on the matter and helped me to understand what was going on. It deals with the whole issue of “praying in tongues”. I heartily recommend this link to you, nickybr38!

Thank you for this link. Because of its length, I have only skimmed it three times and only read a couple of sections in depth.

I am aware of the uneven beginnings of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal. In some areas, Catholic pride took a direct hit because others recognized the modern importance of Pentecost long before Catholics did.

It is obvious that the roots of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal are in Acts, especially the Pentecostal experience in the Upper Room. However, due to inexperience, many found it difficult to understand the basic teachings surrounding Pentecostal gifts, e.g., Paul teaching the correct use of certain prominent gifts.

Furthermore, various Christian denominations were adapting the Pentecostal experiences of the early Church to fit their own particular beliefs. In order words, basic Catholic doctrines and traditional practices were avoided by Protestant Pentecostal groups.

One of the surprises of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, at least to cradle Catholics of my generation, was the return to reading actual Scripture. Since I had learned Catholicism with little reference to Scripture, I was very happy to see in Scripture black and white the basis for Catholic teaching. Even so, I probably knew more Scripture than I realized because as a child, I listened intently to the Gospel and Epistle readings during the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. I also eavesdropped during the pre-Vatican II era when the state of Catholicism was discussed in our living room.

One of the link sections which I did read referred to sola scriptura which totally confused me. I cannot figure out how sola scriptura applies to a Catholic who meditates on the Crucifixion by reading the Agony in the Garden in order to prepare for Good Friday services. Certainly the quoted passage from the Council of Trent does not prohibit Catholics from praying or meditating on "Come to Me all you who labor….Matthew 11: 28-30. ???

What may be happening is that some people are so concerned about dangers to Catholicism which are very real, that they fail to see that the Catholic Charismatic Renewal is countering these very dangers. This is understandable given the state of our society and the current state of Catholicism.

I am looking forward to discussions on this link.

Blessings,
granny

The quest for spiritual truth needs Catholicism.

 

[St_Gabriel]

I have had experience with this Charismatic movement… it was unsettling, to say the least. Here is a link that I found very helpful and informative: sspx.org/miscellaneous/catholic_charismatic_renewal.htm … It’s a looooooong read, but it accurately described some of my feelings on the matter and helped me to understand what was going on. It deals with the whole issue of “praying in tongues”. I heartily recommend this link to you, nickybr38!

I read that article too. It is a good read, although I have some reservations because it is from an SSPX website. The quote below is from the website.

The SSPX on the other hand defends the traditional catechisms and therefore the traditional Latin Mass, and so attacks the Novus Ordo Missae, Vatican II and the “new” Catechism, all of which more or less undermine our unchangeable Catholic faith.

 

[grannymh]

I read that article too. It is a good read, although I have some reservations because it is from an SSPX website. The quote below is from the website.

It is a good read because it is well written. Being well written does not mean it is accurate.

 

[grannymh]

First of all did anyone notice that this thread is called “Sparking” in Tongues? -lol- Instead of “Speaking” in Tongues. I sure hope their tongues don’t ‘spark’! ouchy…I hope they correct that typo.
I agree with the point #4 of Post #48 by Nicky. I know this happened in a “pentecostal” church, but who is to say is could not happen in the Cathloic Church? We have to protect the Integrity of the Church.
The last quote I found from the Vatican was a “Cautious Acceptance” of the Charismatic movement. Because it ‘intentions’ seem good. This is far from an enthusiatic endorsement. However I tend to agree that the people are sincere and they love God, and maybe this expression is their way. I think I will leave it there. PAX.

May I have the citation for the quote and the website which you are using. Thank you.

Regarding protection of the Integrity of the Church. These days, most dioceses have some form of liaison with authentic Catholic Charismatic Renewal so the integrity of Catholicism is protected. Another protection is the National Service Committee of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal of the United States.

However, there can always be some odd ball group. Hopefully, I will be able to answer questions so that thread readers will know what is authentic and what is not. I like to think about the difference between St. Francis and St. Ignatius. Both were sincere in their love for God, yet they took very different paths in following the will of God.

Blessings,
granny

O Sacrament Most Holy,
O Sacrament Divine,
All praise and all thanksgiving,
be every moment Thine.

 

[grannymh]

I will say that you mention testing the spirit means to measure and see if the words being spoken contradict the Church, but how can you do that if the words being spoken are not being interpreted?

Praying directly to God with the gift of prayer tongues does not need a human interpreter. Practically speaking, the person who wishes to pray to God has a general idea what he or she wants to say to God. I have learned to add that God’s will be done. Furthermore, I would like my prayer to be pleasing to God. I do get tongue-tied at times. (Pun is not intended.) When I yield to the Holy Spirit, in effect I am saying please form my words in the best way possible. The Holy Spirit does this with my personal prayer language or prayer tongues.

Speaking God’s message in tongues is from the list of nine gifts taught by Paul. This is the gift which needs interpretation. Practically speaking, the two people with these gifts are already known to the prayer group or prayer community so their integrity is verified. They work as a pair. Even so, the leadership of the group still tests the message to make sure it conforms to Catholic teaching.

If you say the episode in Acts was a miracle of hearing (I would argue the disciples were the ones filled with the Spirit, not those listening, so how is it the ones hearing where the ones receiving a gift and not those who were filled?) then where is your version of speaking in tongues in the bible?

Please grab your Bible and follow this line of reasoning. Mine has the heading “The Coming of the Spirit” for *Acts, Chapter 2. *The Verses 1-12 seem to flow seamlessly, but that is not what actually is happening. There is a definite shift in location and purpose. There are two different episodes to consider.

Verse 1, “When the time for Pentecost was fulfilled, they were all in one place together.” This sets the location for the coming of the Holy Spirit.

Remember that everyone in the Upper Room could speak the same language so there was no need for them to speak in a “foreign” language. Verse 3. Everyone was in direct contact with the Holy Spirit via “tongues as of fire.” so there was no need for one person to teach the rest. The question is – what was the purpose of speaking in different tongues? They were still in the Upper Room when in verse 4, “And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in tongues, as the Spirit enabled them to proclaim.” These people were proclaiming the arrival of the Holy Spirit and were lifting their voices in joy and praise. They were not rejoicing from the same song sheet. Each had a different tongue (Verse 4) according to the individual.
These prayer and praise tongues came from the Holy Spirit as He enabled them.

Verse 5 shifts to the crowd outside of the Upper Room. This is a totally different scene from the Upper Room. Being empowered by the Holy Spirit, the Apostles joined the crowd to share the good news in the vernacular. Verse 6 begins the description of the miracle which the visiting Jews experienced. Visitors were hearing the joyful preaching in their native language.
Verse 11 explains the miracle which is that the visitors did not need an interpreter but heard about the mighty acts of God directly. This is unique when compared with the setting used in Paul’s instructions to the Church of Corinth.

I am continuing to study a couple of links which include some errors. The historical errors regarding “Catholic” Pentecostalism occur because of confusion between the New Testament as accepted by the Catholic Church and Methodism founded by John Wesley. While I cannot speak for Protestants themselves, I am finding that there are Catholics who confuse the New Testament Pentecostal experiences with Protestant religions including Pentecostal Churches. Apparently, some people fail to make the distinction between the basic teachings of the New Testament and the additional teachings from a given Protestant tradition.

Blessings,
granny

John 3:16-17