SSA shift to Heterosexual Desire and Lifestyle?

[naomily]

You realize that “Pride” is one of the seven deadly sins?

The reason that the Church and her members need distance from so-called “LGBT communities” is because by their nature they affirm and condone and encourage sin. They follow a Satan-inspired agenda of leading people away from the Truth and into perdition. Sure, you can find love and support there, because the best way to administer poison is to coat it with sugar.

The Church has thousands upon thousands of communities in which you will find love, support, and Truth. Why not choose one or more of those communities to join and make a difference while sanctifying your soul, rather than being dragged down into a pit of “affirmation” and “inclusivity”? Six years ago, I asked God what else I could do for His Church and He answered with, “The Knights of Columbus”. I was extremely reluctant because this seemed like the last place I would fit in. I had not approached an all-men’s activity since my high school days. Yet I made my First Degree and I found fellowship with men who are now helping me get to Heaven. I found opportunities for service to my parish and community. I found great support for my pro-life activities, and I find that the Knights support the Church just as the Church supports the Knights.

Perhaps you should consider joining Courage. Or some other community which can be supported by the Church. Because right now, you are asking for trouble with the near occasion of sin. And that is no way to get to Heaven.

Thank you for your concern, but I think I’m doing okay. There are many temptations in my life to sin (the adorable boutique two blocks down from my apartment with Jimmy Choo heels in the window, for example) but Pride parades are not one of them.

I’m not “out” to my family or church and honestly don’t plan on it for a very, very, very long time so LGBTQ* groups are some of my only chances to interact with other queer folk. For me, companionship and intimacy is really essential to my mental health and spiritual wellbeing, so I find this very beneficial. This support has helped me become a better Catholic, in fact.

 

[Elizium23]

lol at Courage “endorsing moral evils”

 

[SMGS127]

lol at Courage “endorsing moral evils”

They don’t endorse moral evil. They endorse naively an organization that commits moral evil.

 

[Elizium23]

They don’t endorse moral evil. They endorse naively an organization that commits moral evil.

In your opinion - do you know better than the Church, when it comes to homosexual topics?

 

[SMGS127]

In your opinion - you know better than the Church of course, when it comes to homosexual topics.

I make/made no such claim.

To give you a parallel example – the Church endorses religious communities. But some of these religious communities have come out in favor of female priests, contraception, SSM, abortion, etc. Does that mean criticizing these religious communities is “knowing better than the Church?” Likewise, COURAGE does great things. But the fact that they do one very, very bad thing makes them untenable to me and many gay/lesbian Catholics.

 

[Elizium23]

The topics you name in your post are condemned by the Church as moral evils and of course it is wrong for these communities to support them. Indeed, the Church has her own criticism for them as well. However, your assertion that NARTH commits moral evil is in a vacuum. You have no magisterial document to support that. I doubt you can even find a bishop who will say so. Therefore perhaps you should be more concerned with real moral evils and not those which you perceive, because you have spilled a lot of ink on these forums in support of real, actual, true, moral evils which are unfailingly condemned by the Church.

 

[SMGS127]

The topics you name in your post are condemned by the Church as moral evils and of course it is wrong for these communities to support them. Indeed, the Church has her own criticism for them as well. However, your assertion that NARTH commits moral evil is in a vacuum. You have no magisterial document to support that. I doubt you can even find a bishop who will say so. Therefore perhaps you should be more concerned with real moral evils and not those which you perceive, because you have spilled a lot of ink on these forums in support of real, actual, true, moral evils which are unfailingly condemned by the Church.

If you’re going to accuse me of supporting moral evil, I would hope you could back that up immediately. Otherwise, I will report your post.

As for NARTH, participating in the abuse and psychological torture of children, as well as taking advantage of scared parents in order to do so, is a clear moral evil.

 

[Elizium23]

Your assertions are once again free of citations or sources of proof.

 

[SMGS127]

Your assertions are once again free of citations or sources of proof.

Forcing kids to go through conversion therapy is psychological torture. Check out the Worlds News thread on the issue for examples.

Also, still waiting on how I support moral evil.

 

[Elizium23]

This thread is not about you, so I will not make it into a referendum on your behavior on all threads of this general topic area.

Your allegations of psychological torture and the images of scared parents are all very serious. Yet you still don’t have a shred of evidence linking Courage to NARTH, NARTH to torture, and therefore connecting to the dots on Courage’s alleged moral evils.

At any rate, the psychological/psychiatric juggernaut in the United States is a known quantity of homosexualist instruments and mouthpieces. The APA and other associations that supposedly serve the interests of doctors do not do it so well when it comes to homosexuality or transgenderism. So any allegations of “torture” coming from those parts is going to be met with a good deal of skepticism anyway.

It is not in the nature of psychology to play nice with the Church. The Freudian and Jungian roots of psychotherapy have always worked at crossed purposes with the intent being the replacement of pastors and confessors with psychotherapists, replacing the confessional box with a couch and a box of tissues. So it is no surprise that any therapy that might work along with the Church is met with suspicion by the establishment. When medical professionals are thinking of remote-control contraception for eugenics, and chemical castrations for sex offenders, and sterilizations and abortions for people with undesirable genes, what irony that therapy to correct a disorder is considered “torture”?

 

[JamalChristophr]

It is still my hope that we all will maintain charity here and that careful listening will greatly outweigh argumentation. The issue of conversion therapy is a critical topic needing to be discussed, but it may be too big for this thread. I haven’t said much in this thread, but I find it has been well worth my time to “listen” to what has been expressed up to this point.

God Bless You All!

 

[SMGS127]

This thread is not about you, so I will not make it into a referendum on your behavior on all threads of this general topic area.

Your allegations of psychological torture and the images of scared parents are all very serious. Yet you still don’t have a shred of evidence linking Courage to NARTH, NARTH to torture, and therefore connecting to the dots on Courage’s alleged moral evils.

At any rate, the psychological/psychiatric juggernaut in the United States is a known quantity of homosexualist instruments and mouthpieces. The APA and other associations that supposedly serve the interests of doctors do not do it so well when it comes to homosexuality or transgenderism. So any allegations of “torture” coming from those parts is going to be met with a good deal of skepticism anyway.

It is not in the nature of psychology to play nice with the Church. The Freudian and Jungian roots of psychotherapy have always worked at crossed purposes with the intent being the replacement of pastors and confessors with psychotherapists, replacing the confessional box with a couch and a box of tissues. So it is no surprise that any therapy that might work along with the Church is met with suspicion by the establishment. When medical professionals are thinking of remote-control contraception for eugenics, and chemical castrations for sex offenders, and sterilizations and abortions for people with undesirable genes, what irony that therapy to correct a disorder is considered “torture”?

Oh wow, Courage has completely removed all links to NARTH and Exodus International and now emphatically states that they do not endorse conversion therapy. Way to go Courage I take back my statements. They used to support an organization that commits grave evil, but they no longer do, so I will give them credit where credit is due. It is still highly disconcerting that NARTH is supported by anyone though, let alone CAFers (including an apologist ). I’m glad Courage dropped them though; that’s a fantastic start.

Either way, it is not a negative thing to be part of the LGBT community. If anything, it provides a great way to evangelize merely by being their friend .

 

[Prodigal_Son]

Oh wow, Courage has completely removed all links to NARTH and Exodus International and now emphatically states that they do not endorse conversion therapy. Way to go Courage

I’m glad to hear this. I don’t think the people at NARTH deserve half the vitriol they’ve received, but I also don’t think their approach is the right one.

 

[Boundless]

Oh wow, Courage has completely removed all links to NARTH and Exodus International and now emphatically states that they do not endorse conversion therapy. Way to go Courage I take back my statements. They used to support an organization that commits grave evil, but they no longer do, so I will give them credit where credit is due. It is still highly disconcerting that NARTH is supported by anyone though, let alone CAFers (including an apologist ). I’m glad Courage dropped them though; that’s a fantastic start.

Either way, it is not a negative thing to be part of the LGBT community. If anything, it provides a great way to evangelize merely by being their friend .

I’m all for not having youths forced into any sort of therapy against their will, but I for one have greatly benefited from therapy, and my counselor is associated with NARTH. It’s been an evolving organization, but many of the therapists in that organization do not focus on “conversion” as such, but focus rather on building up–at least in the case of men–a sense of masculine identity and belonging. For many men I have talked to, that helps them to develop some measure of OSA, as it has helped me to do. For others I know, their OSA doesn’t necessarily increase and their SSA doesn’t decrease, but they still seem to benefit from getting in touch with themselves in a deep way.

Even the NARTH papers I signed before starting therapy emphasized that the focus was NOT on conversion, but on integrating the SSA into my life in a holistic way, finding healthy ways to get those needs met, etc. It may have been mentioned that some increase in OSA may result, but by no means was it advertised as a “cure”.

I’m not saying it’s for everyone, but I don’t like to see people be so hard on it when I’ve witnessed miracles in my life as a result of it. As long as it’s made clear that this process doesn’t have the same effect for everyone (and in many, many cases, I’ve seen that this has definitely been made clear to most of the men I know who take part in it), then I think it’s a good thing that the option exists.

If it didn’t, my own life would be the poorer for it.