SSPX seems to indicate a definitive break with the Holy See

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I share your prayer. With this development, I can’t help but predict the Holy Father will have to excommunicate them again. If that’s not schism, I don’t know what is.
 
That’s too bad. I can’t imagine placing myself outside the Church. But we can certainly continue to pray for them.
 
The way it looks – the message that is coming out from SSPX “declaration” – is that the Church – with Vatican II – stopped being the True Church-- and the True Church – is found only within the SSPX.
 
I was born in 1961 and I was a kid when all the changes came.
I didn’t really understand it at the time, but I saw what it did to my parents and many of their generation (WW2). Timing is everything, and in hindsight, many of the changes were not implimented in a proper way. In fact, it was a textbook example, IMHO, of how NOT to impliment change.
I was there, and I saw what happened. They were told by fellow Catholics who obviously didn’t know what they were talking about, that the Latin Mass was now “illegal” and if they went to a TLM, they were “no longer Catholic”. If they had objections they were told figuratively, if not literally to ‘sit down and shut up’.
In the early days it was just a group of blue collar Catholics who just wanted a Latin Mass, what they grew up with. They got together, rented an abandoned chapel and got an old retired priest to say the Mass for them. They were not radicals, they just wanted a Latin Mass.
Over time the old priest passed away and that little chapel was eventually taken over by a group who had other ideas about what “traditionalism” was. They were just dissenters who wanted a fight.
And they got one.
I won’t bore you with the details, but it wasn’t pretty.
Me? I was a young man. threw my hands in the air, and left the Church for twenty years.
When I returned, I encountered traditionalists who were far different than the blue-collar Catholics I encountered years before.
Twenty years make quite a difference.
These trads were angry, negative, radical, given over to conspiracy theories, making horrible statements about the Pope and their fellow Catholics. It was no longer just about Latin, now it was about almost every aspect of Catholic Culture they objected to.
They reminded me a lot of fundamentalists.
So, the article doesn’t surprise me.
IMO the chances for reunification would have been better back in the 1990s. The longer a group is independent, and stays cut off from the Church, the harder it is for reconciliation, almost like a divorce.
This is a problem Protestant churches are very familiar with.
When the Anglican communion reconciled with the CC, there were still break-away groups who will never return.
When the first generation of trads started to die off, the reasons for reconcliation became dimmer for the next generation.
 
Sounds to me like they’ve drifted from schism to heresy. I wouldn’t be surprised if they continue to separate into more and more diverse groups with ever differing interpretations of what Tradition teaches as they have opted for the very Protestant “I’ll start my own thing when the Church does something I don’t agree with” approach to Church authority. Ironically, SSPX takes a hard interpretation of Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus and they are themselves extra ecclesiam. I love the Extraordinary Form - nothing does more to hurt the spread of this beautiful form of the Mass than groups like SSPX - it makes us all look like heretics. I’d love to see Papa Francesco excommunicate them and then celebrate a licit EF Mass… probably hoping for too much there though. 🤷

As Father Z would say, Pope Benedict still was the pope of Christian unity! 👍
 
PietroPaolo said:
Sounds to me like they’ve drifted from schism to heresy. I wouldn’t be surprised if they continue to separate into more and more diverse groups with ever differing interpretations of what Tradition teaches as they have opted for the very Protestant “I’ll start my own thing when the Church does something I don’t agree with” approach to Church authority. Ironically, SSPX takes a hard interpretation of Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus and they are themselves extra ecclesiam. I love the Extraordinary Form - nothing does more to hurt the spread of this beautiful form of the Mass than groups like SSPX - it makes us all look like heretics. I’d love to see Papa Francesco excommunicate them and then celebrate a licit EF Mass… probably hoping for too much there though. 🤷

As Father Z would say, Pope Benedict still was the pope of Christian unity! 👍
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They have adopted “sola Tradition” in a similar way Protestants developed “sola Scriptura”.
 
Walking_Home said:
The way it looks – the message that is coming out from SSPX “declaration” – is that the Church – with Vatican II – stopped being the True Church-- and the True Church – is found only within the SSPX.
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The same message, you’ll note, that Luther, Calvin, et al tried to push 500 yrs ago. SSPX is as wrong as they all were. God have mercy on their souls. :gopray:
 
The SSPX are NOT heretics!

There’s no point in me continuing on this thread because I am afraid I will not be able to remain charitable.
 
JustaServant said:
They have adopted “sola Tradition” in a similar way Protestants developed “sola Scriptura”.
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Exactly. Neither the Prots (with the Bible) nor SSPX (with various Church docs) understand that Christ left us with a LIVING TEACHER not a bunch of stuff to read and interpret on our own. Sounds like they are lining up with Satan and going the old “Non serviam!” route.
 
It’s not even Tradition properly understood, but viewed through lenses that I suspect would be condemned by the Fathers of the Council of Trent. They act unfortunately so much like pseudo-Jansenists.

Deborah, at the very least they are schismatic, which leads down a path no Catholic should want to go down.
 
Walking_Home said:
The way it looks – the message that is coming out from SSPX “declaration” – is that the Church – with Vatican II – stopped being the True Church-- and the True Church – is found only within the SSPX.
Click to expand...
Do they say how exactly it happened with Vatican II?
 
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