Tea party wins in northeastern primaries could bode well for Democrats

[Rich_Olszewski]

What goes up, must come down Rich. If Obama can outspend every single president combined in the history of this country in less than 2 years then surely it is possible to put the car in reverse and reduce that spending. I don’t think they need to go to Washington and smash everything in sight, I think they need to go there and burn it all down and like after good ol pasture fire watch it regrow greener and healthier than it was before.

I don’t think the tea partyists have the competency to do so, and will not gain enough power, especially after the nation sees what a destructive bunch they are, to do so. Besides, neither the GOP nor the Democratic Party will let them have their way.

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

Washington DC is a cancer on our country.

Then, shall we cut the cancer out, and maybe revert to an immense country with no national leadership, but innumerable town meetings and the most local of politics? This is 2011 coming up, not 1779.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

Again, I thought we had agreed to move beyond this birther nonsense on this forum. Regardless, the fact that some website says it doesn’t make it true. Do you really think Obama could have faked graduating from an Ivy League School and McCain’s team would just let that slide? Or Hillary’s?

I googled Obama and Columbia and got several hits to articles discussing people that he went to school with, an article he published in a Columbia paper or journal while he was there, etc. It’s a silly and unfounded allegation.

Like I stated in a post before----I did not mean to derail the thread. I was responding to a remark somebody made about Obama’s Harvard grades.

I was not meaning exactly to be engaging in “conspiracy theorizing,” but I was simply pointing out that there was that kind of question floating around in certain circles and the Internet. I should pointed out early that I did not want the thread derailed because of that.

I’m not going to mention it anymore—but before I go, I must mention that I disagree with you that it is not a “settled issue.” But that’s just me.

And like it or not, Obama lends himself to having speculation about his life floated about Internet circles. Same with Clinton. same with Bush. same with Palin. Same with Hillary.

This forum is for a variety of subjects to be discussed. But Ok, it’s done.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Then, shall we cut the cancer out, and maybe revert to an immense country with no national leadership, but innumerable town meetings and the most local of politics? This is 2011 coming up, not 1779.

I’m sorry. When did the principle of local governance being the best governance change? I don’t buy the whole Progressive “big government is best” line of thinking, so educate me.

 

[bbarrick8383]

I don’t think the tea partyists have the competency to do so,

C’mon Rich, stop with the condescending smugness.

and will not gain enough power, especially after the nation sees what a destructive bunch they are, to do so.

You said before that you tend to gravitate toward the underdog. The tea party is the underdog, nobody thought the candidates they have backed along with Palin would be winning the primaries they are. We won’t know for sure till Nov. but I wouldn’t put my money on the table yet.

Besides, neither the GOP nor the Democratic Party will let them have their way.

Just like the GOP hasn’t had much voice in the current administration, the establishment may not have much of a voice in the future administrations. In other words, neither establishment may have a choice in the matter.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

I don’t think the tea partyists have the competency to do so, and will not gain enough power, especially after the nation sees what a destructive bunch they are, to do so. Besides, neither the GOP nor the Democratic Party will let them have their way.

That is why the Tea Party is the cure for the country. Who the hell are the GOP and DNC to mandate who gets to “have their way”? That is exactly establishmentarianism that created the Tea Party. And people snicker at Rush Limbaugh’s exposition of Angelo Codevilla’s “Ruling Class vs. Country Class” phenomenon. We are no longer governed. We are being ruled by a bunch of self-righteous elitists. Time for them to go. Where? I could give a flip. Anywhere. Try China. They like totalitarian elitists over there.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

I don’t think the tea partyists have the competency to do so, and will not gain enough power, especially after the nation sees what a destructive bunch they are, to do so. Besides, neither the GOP nor the Democratic Party will let them have their way.

What makes you think they are “destructive,” Rich???

I guess you agree with the view they are “racist,” is that it?

Is it the fact that some of them are Birthers?

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

That is why the Tea Party is the cure for the country. Who the hell are the GOP and DNC to mandate who gets to “have their way”. That is exactly establishmentarianism that created the Tea Party. And people snicker at Rush Limbaugh exposition of the “ruling class” phenomenon. We are no longer governed. We are being ruled by a bunch of self-righteous elitists. Time for them to go. Where? I could give a flip. Anywhere. Try China. They like totalitarian elitists over there.

Aw, Scott, don’t be RETICENT! Tell us what you REALLY think! Have the courage of your convictions!!!



I basically agree with you. Good man.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Aw, Scott, don’t be RETICENT! Tell us what you REALLY think! Have the courage of your convictions!!!



I basically agree with you. Good man.

But I’m shy…

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

What makes you think they are “destructive,” Rich???

Their own statements. They are intent on changing everything, sweeping out the entire Congress - and they have no competence, no experience, no national leader, no set platform except to be against everything, as I see it.

I guess you agree with the view they are “racist,” is that it?

They’ve got their extremists, but so do the GOP and the Dems.

Is it the fact that some of them are Birthers?

I think the “Birthers” have, err…reality coping issues, and I wouldn’t come near anyone like that. Besides discussion of that lot is a no, no on this Forum. So, you can infer my position from what I’ve just said.

 

[bbarrick8383]

Their own statements. They are intent on changing everything, sweeping out the entire Congress - and they have no competence, no experience, no national leader, no set platform except to be against everything, as I see it.

I’m sorry, are you talking about the Democrats?

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

That is why the Tea Party is the cure for the country. Who the hell are the GOP and DNC to mandate who gets to “have their way”? That is exactly establishmentarianism that created the Tea Party. And people snicker at Rush Limbaugh’s exposition of Angelo Codevilla’s “Ruling Class vs. Country Class” phenomenon. We are no longer governed. We are being ruled by a bunch of self-righteous elitists. Time for them to go. Where? I could give a flip. Anywhere. Try China. They like totalitarian elitists over there.

Oh, yeah. Don’t agree with me, leave the country. So rightwing. Sorry, I’m as much a citizen as anyone else, I make my views known to my Congressmen, and I vote for those who are in line with what I believe in. I don’t ask the far right to leave MY country.

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

I’m sorry, are you talking about the Democrats?

You aren’t following the thread. The GOP and the Democratic Party have leadership, platforms, experience, competence, and clearly defined purposes. We were discussing the Tea Partyists.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

I’m sorry, are you talking about the Democrats?

:bowdown2:

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

Rush Limbaugh’s exposition of Angelo Codevilla’s “Ruling Class vs. Country Class” phenomenon.

We are being ruled by a bunch of self-righteous elitists.

Limbaught is fully a part of that ruling elite, he with his vast wealth, and unelected influence over the rightwingers. As far as self-righteousness goes, Mr. Limbaugh’s delivery has it in spades. Funny how we only see the hump on other people’s backs.

BTW, this is not to attack Mr. Limbaugh, but to recognize that he’s as much a part of the elite establishment as any country-club Republican or liberal Democrat.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Limbaught is fully a part of that ruling elite, he with his vast wealth, and unelected influence over the rightwingers. As far as self-righteousness goes, Mr. Limbaugh’s delivery has it in spades. Funny how we only see the hump on other people’s backs.

BTW, this is not to attack Mr. Limbaugh, but to recognize that he’s as much a part of the elite establishment as any country-club Republican or liberal Democrat.

Limbaugh is a wealthy opinioneer, no more no less. Wealth does not equate to elitism. He has no interest in governing or ruling anyone. And yes, Limbaugh has a very high opinion of himself. So what? So do I. Does that make me an elitist because I don’t consider myself a schlub? Anyone who experiences success does so FIRST because they are confident in their abilities. People who don’t have this quality tend to cast aspirtions on it. The difference between Limbaugh and someone, say like Al Franken, is that Franken wants to use his celebrity and office to dominate (rule) over other people. Limbaugh wants everyone in the country to be as successful as he is. Point of the matter is that you cannot rule your “equals” and Limbaugh considers all other Americans as his equals, even if not in term of the size of their bank accounts. Progressives don’t see it that way. There is a country class to be ruled over and kept in line, and there is a ruling class that determines how the country class gets to live.

 

[bbarrick8383]

You aren’t following the thread.

No, I’m following the thread alright.

The GOP and the Democratic Party have leadership, platforms, experience, competence, and clearly defined purposes. We were discussing the Tea Partyists.

So, you consider Obama and Steele to be competent leaders? You consider the democratic platform worthy of consideration as a Catholic? Yes, I guess Obama is experienced now, not all experience is good though. Competence is arguable for either party and yes they both have a clearly defined purpose, the Dems are pushing theirs to the limit and the GOP establishments too confused to figure out whethere or not they should reach across the aisle even when its goes against the main theme of their platform.

Tea Party, is a term with an obvious background. It’s not an official political party, but a group of people seeking to put politicians in office who are going to do what they say they are going to do. Hopefully get away from the dirty tricks of putting bills in bills and accusing the other party of being cold and heartless.

You seem to be confused by this. They are looking to implement that leadership within the GOP, which like the democrats, has a shortage of good honest Americans.

I don’t understand how you can condemn them for simply wanting to change things and support the party that has been basing their agenda on change.

 

[Suudy]

I don’t think anyone knows what so-called Tea Party supporters want, because they aren’t a party.

Really? Tell that to those demanding that the Tea Party movement expel the racist elements. Those people certainly seem to think there is some central leadership.

The candidates themselves back away from the “enumerated powers” sham fairly quickly (Sharron Angle backed away from her comments on social security, as Rand Paul did on the Civil Rights Act).

Indeed they do, for political expediency. But I’m not talking about the candidates, but the supporters. And that is the context in which CMatt25 posted.

Although many Tea Party supporters are anti-abortion, the so-called Contract From America has no mention of abortion, and abortion seems seldom to be a central focus of protests.

Then why bring it up? Why should Maddow mention it at all. (I don’t know if Maddow actually said anything about it, but it is what CMatt25 seems to say.)

There isn’t any “Tea Party.” Every so-called “Tea Party” candidate runs as a Republican. At best, the Tea Party is just an outward expression of the most right wing members of the party expressing a distaste for moderation.

Eh? What are you saying here? That the federal government is an example of moderation?

To claim that the Tea Party is hypocritical, as Maddow seems to do, is to credit it with enough coherence to engage in contradiction.

Well, to that I do mostly agree. One cannot nail down a particular Tea Party position other than to say that some candidate endorses some position. Yet when it comes to a fringe element being racist, the entire movement is labeled racist.

But even if it were coherent, it wouldn’t be a case of contradiction. Maddow, like many on the left, misstate the conservative position with regard to government. The left seems to think that the conservative position is that any government is too big. But that isn’t the position at all. It isn’t** BIG BIG** government when it acts to protect lives and property. It is** BIG BIG** government when it attempts to take on roles properly understood to be the role of society and individuals.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

Oh, yeah. Don’t agree with me, leave the country. So rightwing. Sorry, I’m as much a citizen as anyone else, I make my views known to my Congressmen, and I vote for those who are in line with what I believe in. I don’t ask the far right to leave MY country.

I wouldn’t either, to be honest, Rich. I can understand Scott’s frustration, though.

To sort of make your point, Todd Palin was photographed wearing a “If you don’t like our country, why don’t you get the h—l out?” T-shirt during the campaign.

On the other hand, if I had a dollar for every time Alec Baldwin and other Hollywood elites said they would “leave the country” if Bush or another Republican was elected president or re-elected president, I would be “comfortable.”
In other words—“If the American People don’t agree with my political views, I will not honor them with my presence anymore.” Gimme a break. It goes both ways.
Personally, people who have views like that (Right-wing or Left-wing) I would personally help pack their bags. And drive them to the Airport. And write them “How are things going in Europe?” from America.

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

Limbaugh is a wealthy opinioneer, no more no less. Wealth does not equate to elitism. He has no interest in governing or ruling anyone. And yes, Limbaugh has a very high opinion of himself. So what? So do I. Does that make me an elitist because I don’t consider myself a schlub? Anyone who experiences success does so FIRST because they are confident in their abilities. People who don’t have this quality tend to cast aspirtions on it. The difference between Limbaugh and someone, say like Al Franken, is that Franken wants to use his celebrity and office to dominate (rule) over other people. Limbaugh wants everyone in the country to be as successful as he is. Point of the matter is that you cannot rule your “equals” and Limbaugh considers all other Americans as his equals, even if not in term of the size of their bank accounts. Progressives don’t see it that way. There is a country class to be ruled over and kept in line, and there is a ruling class that determines how the country class gets to live.

Thank you for your opinion.