Ted Cruz Dropping Out of Republican Presidential Race

[Tomdstone]

Trump and Kasich are as pro-abortion as one can get.

Trump is pro-life with exceptions for rape and incest and the life of the mother. Hillary is solidly pro-abortion on demant. In fact she demands that religious beliefs be changed. Trump does not demand that religious beliefs be changed.
So it is false and slanderous to say that Trump is as pro-abortion as you can get.

 

[irishpatrick]

By limiting this to incest rape and life of the mother its quite reasonable. And that is a long way from Hillary pro-choice period.

Your point is they don’t go as far as Cruz, I get that but that doesn’t make either an equal comparison to Hillary and there is a for sure distinction, so why would we view them alike? Does that make sense? Its not a reasonable point compared to the ideal of real progress opposed to Hillary. Its semantics of a word game and frankly Hillary deserves no quarter. Its not a practical point and is conceptual semantics.

I think you still do not get my point.

The exceptions for incest, rape and life of the mother is the same as abortion on demand. Anyone holding those exceptions is really for abortion on demand.

Hillary is for abortion on demand.

The difference between the two camps is, Hillary proudly states she is for abortion on demand, while Trump, Kasich, and many others, hide their abortion on demand views under a false cloak of being pro-life.

There is no practical difference regarding abortion between Clinton, Trump and Kasich–they all hold views that would lead to abortion on demand.

Now, here is one important difference. Trump could promise to nominate Cruz to the Supreme Court–that would be a huge difference between him and Hillary.

 

[irishpatrick]

Trump is pro-life with exceptions for rape and incest and the life of the mother. Hillary is solidly pro-abortion on demant. In fact she demands that religious beliefs be changed. Trump does not demand that religious beliefs be changed.
So it is false and slanderous to say that Trump is as pro-abortion as you can get.

The exceptions for incest, rape and life of the mother is the same as abortion on demand. Anyone holding those exceptions is really for abortion on demand.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

The exceptions for incest, rape and life of the mother is the same as abortion on demand. Anyone holding those exceptions is really for abortion on demand.

 

[irishpatrick]

Kasich is out.

Despite his personal peccadilloes, Bill Clinton presided over 8 good years for the USA. Most people remember his governance positively. I think this will help Hillary.

Yes, and that was because Clinton was smart enough to go along with the Republican lead Congress – the contract with America days. He saw a good plan and chose to sign it. He reaped the credit, while it was actually the Republicans who created the change.

 

[Ridgerunner]

True, in most cases. But not with abortion–no one will question a woman or doctors view about the need for an abortion.

Maybe no one “will”, but one certainly “could”. The doctor could be required to chart his findings justifying abortion and would have to falsify his dictation if he was just doing an abortion if the woman wanted one. That kind of thing can most definitely be challenged because he would have to falsify signs and symptoms. I pretend to no expertise in that narrow field, but challenging falsifications is done all the time in other things.

 

[irishpatrick]

I cannot understand why I have to post that so many times. It seems like an obvious point to me. A pregnant woman and her doctor can concoct a reason why the woman’s life would be in danger if she remained pregnant and there would be no “abortion police” to check on those reasons because everyone wants the doctor and patient relationship to remain private. That means it would equal abortion on demand. Obvious.

 

[Jeanne_S]

Yes, and that was because Clinton was smart enough to go along with the Republican lead Congress – the contract with America days. He saw a good plan and chose to sign it. He reaped the credit, while it was actually the Republicans who created the change.

This is exactly it.Lest we forget,thevRepublicsns had to stand strong BC went screaming and kicking before he capitulated.Those were days when the Republicans actually fought back:thumbsup:

 

[Ridgerunner]

The exceptions for incest, rape and life of the mother is the same as abortion on demand. Anyone holding those exceptions is really for abortion on demand.

Just wrong.

Abortion on demand requires the addition of “…health…” of the mother.

 

[irishpatrick]

Maybe no one “will”, but one certainly “could”. The doctor could be required to chart his findings justifying abortion and would have to falsify his dictation if he was just doing an abortion if the woman wanted one. That kind of thing can most definitely be challenged because he would have to falsify signs and symptoms. I pretend to no expertise in that narrow field, but challenging falsifications is done all the time in other things.

I really do not want to post some of the valid reasons because I truly have no desire to give anyone ideas. Suffice it say that there would be no way to prevent someone from getting an abortion if there is a life of the mother exception. No way at all.

 

[irishpatrick]

Just wrong.

Abortion on demand requires the addition of “…health…” of the mother.

I really do not want to post some of the valid reasons because I truly have no desire to give anyone ideas. Suffice it say that there would be no way to prevent someone from getting an abortion if there is a life of the mother exception. No way at all.

 

[irishpatrick]

This is exactly it.Lest we forget,thevRepublicsns had to stand strong BC went screaming and kicking before he capitulated.Those were days when the Republicans actually fought back:thumbsup:

Exactly. Democrats control the media, so it is an easy thing for them to write out the facts.

 

[Peter_J]

I don’t believe in non-negotiable issues in voting

Not to over analyze of course, but do you mean that in the sense of “Everything’s negotiable”? Or mpdo you mean that you don’t categorize issues a la “Everything is negotiable except for these ______________________”?

 

[Ridgerunner]

I cannot understand why I have to post that so many times. It seems like an obvious point to me. A pregnant woman and her doctor can concoct a reason why the woman’s life would be in danger if she remained pregnant and there would be no “abortion police” to check on those reasons because everyone wants the doctor and patient relationship to remain private. That means it would equal abortion on demand. Obvious.

Not obvious at all. I have seen a lot of challenges to medical “determinations”. Other than subjective complaints of pain (and sometimes even then), it’s actually difficult to falsify a medical condition, and exceedingly dangerous for a doctor to do it.

Since abortionists wouldn’t be doing what they’re doing if they had any moral sense, lying wouldn’t be a moral issue with them. But getting caught and sent to the penitentiary would be compelling to a lot of them.

Actual medical conditions indicating therapeutic use of abortion are pretty uncommon, and they’re pretty drastic, like cancer or a heart valve so incompetent that labor would destroy it. If the doctors were required to document the presence of cancer, it would be hard to fake it. The heart valve could be checked if some doctor was suspected of falsification. For goodness sake, insurers and the government sometimes look at charts for falsification of conditions and sometimes find it.

 

[Little_Sheep]

But you start on the false premise Trump isn’t conservative, thats not a fact but an opinion which conceals accusation and agenda.

Untrue and they just did what they desired by dropping the DC insiders for one outside.

Whos an authority on what a WSR is in fact IF they actually exist?

I don’t see any point?

According to the link I published earlier regarding the Republican Party’s own autopsy after their 2012 national presidential defeat, plenty of the base believe that the social issues are dragging down the party. It’s really not just the leadership who believes that, but also actual men and women on the streets.

I believe both parties could come together to lower the incidences of abortion. In fact, even though the parties are not yet fully together on the issue, the abortion rate is as low as it has ever been. Teen pregnancies too. We should continue to focus on educating our people and lowering those numbers instead of arguing about it.

 

[Peter_J]

The exceptions for incest, rape and life of the mother is the same as abortion on demand. Anyone holding those exceptions is really for abortion on demand.

Did you mean to include the “health exception” in that statement?

 

[GaryTaylor]

I cannot understand why I have to post that so many times. It seems like an obvious point to me. A pregnant woman and her doctor can concoct a reason why the woman’s life would be in danger if she remained pregnant and there would be no “abortion police” to check on those reasons because everyone wants the doctor and patient relationship to remain private. That means it would equal abortion on demand. Obvious.

I think you should re-read the thread its a point well covered already. Why would repeating a defeated point again be a valid point? Its a good point but a defeated point and in this thread.

If abortions are illegal and you fabricate a rape/incest or the mothers life is in question, your then liable for murder. First who with any integrity as a Dr would do so and go along with another individual to conspire to commit murder. Thats quite a yarn spun but not reality. Whats likely to happen is not different than the past-illegal abortion. But that escalated now to mass murder at the 1-million a year mark and promoted by Hillary. In which case you can answer that dilemma for yourself since that would exist anyway as it has. Be it Cruz or Trump no difference.

 

[irishpatrick]

Not obvious at all. I have seen a lot of challenges to medical “determinations”. Other than subjective complaints of pain (and sometimes even then), it’s actually difficult to falsify a medical condition, and exceedingly dangerous for a doctor to do it.

Since abortionists wouldn’t be doing what they’re doing if they had any moral sense, lying wouldn’t be a moral issue with them. But getting caught and sent to the penitentiary would be compelling to a lot of them.

I really believe you are not allowing your imagination to lead you down the obvious path. It does not have to be only a doctor who lies…and some lies become an easy “reason” to pass on to others. Think it through because I am really not going to post the reasons on a public forum, but there are many really unshakeable “reasons.”

Do not forget that the vast majority of women seeking abortions are quite emotional about their need to get rid of the pregnancy–now let your mind connect the dots.

 

[Little_Sheep]

Yes, and that was because Clinton was smart enough to go along with the Republican lead Congress – the contract with America days. He saw a good plan and chose to sign it. He reaped the credit, while it was actually the Republicans who created the change.

Do you really think Republicans didn’t get credit for their involvement in those 8 good years? I don’t. I hated the Contract with America, but I like Gingrich a lot. He is a brilliant thinker and strategist with much to offer all of our citizens.

Like her husband, Hillary is also known and respected for working well across the aisle. Working across the aisle is good for ALL Americans. Digging our heels in at the extremities is not.

The truth is that most people in this country hang out in the middle. I understand that it’s very popular these days to feel like we are tremendously polarized, but I don’t buy that.

 

[Little_Sheep]

Which is what scares the living daylights out of me.

Fair enough.

For my money, I’d much rather see Trump as POTUS than Cruz as POTUS. Trump is actually willing to make deals. Cruz is not.

That said, I don’t believe Trump will be our next President.