Ted Cruz Dropping Out of Republican Presidential Race

[Ridgerunner]

I really believe you are not allowing your imagination to lead you down the obvious path. It does not have to be only a doctor who lies…and some lies become an easy “reason” to pass on to others. Think it through because I am really not going to post the reasons on a public forum, but there are many really unshakeable “reasons.”

Do not forget that the vast majority of women seeking abortions are quite emotional about their need to get rid of the pregnancy–now let your mind connect the dots.

I don’t care how good a liar a woman or her doctor or both are, you can’t fake AIDS or cancer, for example. They’re either there or they aren’t, and both require testing to verify the diagnosis.

 

[irishpatrick]

I think you should re-read the thread its a point well covered already. Why would repeating a defeated point again be a valid point? Its a good point but a defeated point and in this thread.

If abortions are illegal and fabricate a rape/incest or the mothers life is in question, your then liable for murder. First who with any integrity as a Dr would do so along with another individual conspire to commit murder. Thats quite a yarn spun but not reality. Whats likely to happen is not different than the past-illegal abortion. But that escalated now to mass murder at the 1-million a year mark and promoted by Hillary. In which case you can answer that dilemma for youyrself since that would exist anyway as it has. Be ot Cruz or Trump no difference.

I am lost. What pointed has been defeated, and how?

I am saying that if a bill was passed that had the three exceptions (incest, rape, life of the mother) that would equate to abortion on demand. That is obvious and not really debatable in any real sense.

I have no clue what you are talking about regarding murder (did I miss a bunch of posts?).

Abortionists have very little morals regarding abortion–most are quite strongly behind its legal status, and there is no way a bill would ever be passed that would include actions taken against abortionists or the pregnant women.

 

[mary_bobo]

Yes, and that was because Clinton was smart enough to go along with the Republican lead Congress – the contract with America days. He saw a good plan and chose to sign it. He reaped the credit, while it was actually the Republicans who created the change.

Indeed, but you will never get those who disapprove of the GOP to admit that. Bill has dragged kicking and screaming to a balanced budget, and then took credit for it.

 

[Expatreprocedit]

Yes, and that was because Clinton was smart enough to go along with the Republican lead Congress – the contract with America days. He saw a good plan and chose to sign it. He reaped the credit, while it was actually the Republicans who created the change.

Actually- it was because at that time both the President and the Congress were able to work with each other to a great extent. Bill Clinton was hardly a rubberstamp of the Republican Congress.

Contrast this with 2008 when right after Obama’s election Mickey Cantor and other Republican leaders announced that their objective would be to obstruct Obama at every turn.

 

[irishpatrick]

I don’t care how good a liar a woman or her doctor or both are, you can’t fake AIDS or cancer, for example. They’re either there or they aren’t, and both require testing to verify the diagnosis.

Please–stretch beyond the obvious clinical diagnoses route. Think of things that no doctor can verify in an abortion consult.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

Fair enough.

For my money, I’d much rather see Trump as POTUS than Cruz as POTUS. Trump is actually willing to make deals. Cruz is not.

That said, I don’t believe Trump will be our next President.

I could never decide rather I’d rather have Trump or Cruz, but I guess Trump, and now, barring anything unforeseen, he’s going to be the nominee.

I don’t believe Trump will be elected president, either. The electoral map favors Hillary so much.

 

[Little_Sheep]

I don’t believe in non-negotiable issues in voting and I don’t think the Pope does either. I am under no delusion that either major party represents my views (both Church driven and my own) well enough to deserve my vote. I certainly don’t think either party represents Catholic values unless you believe that the Church reduces voting to a single issue and, in that case, anything that one party says about it is good enough even if their Presidential candidate changes his position on that issue three times in a day.

Maybe I’ll go third party like Peter J suggests (though I do not think the Constitution Party is on the ballot in Illinois).

I think there will be plenty of 3rd party voting in November!

And I hear what you say about not having a Party that completely upholds and represents my personal spiritual views. Viva la Democracy, I guess!

 

[Little_Sheep]

We almost had Bloomberg run as a third party as well. that would of made it 3 from NY

I thought the same thing when Bloomberg was jawing about a run, chero23. As a Southerner, I found that to be more than a little nuts!

 

[irishpatrick]

Actually- it was because at that time both the President and the Congress were able to work with each other to a great extent. Bill Clinton was hardly a rubberstamp of the Republican Congress.

Contrast this with 2008 when right after Obama’s election Mickey Cantor and other Republican leaders announced that their objective would be to obstruct Obama at every turn.

Clinton was not a rubber stamp in general, but he was with the contract and that lead to some very good years.

Obama announced that he planned to transform the USA, and then he laid out his plans. The Republicans had every right to try to stop something they thought was wrong. The Democrats do the same thing.

 

[Little_Sheep]

Oh, I do, too, LS. Life was great under Bill Clinton.

It was. He and the Republicans worked very well together. I believe that can happen again. All this polarized talk is very fearful, imho.

 

[irishpatrick]

Indeed, but you will never get those who disapprove of the GOP to admit that. Bill has dragged kicking and screaming to a balanced budget, and then took credit for it.

Yes, but the right has no control over the media.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Please–stretch beyond the obvious clinical diagnoses route. Think of things that no doctor can verify in an abortion consult.

You really have lost me. I hate to be obtuse, but when it comes to actual medical conditions (not some psych hocus-pocus) falsification could be made very difficult and extremely dangerous to the doctor.

 

[irishpatrick]

I could never decide rather I’d rather have Trump or Cruz, but I guess Trump, and now, barring anything unforeseen, he’s going to be the nominee.

I don’t believe Trump will be elected president, either. The electoral map favors Hillary so much.

I agree–that is why so many fought against Trump’s nomination, but few people wanted to listen.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

I don’t care how good a liar a woman or her doctor or both are, you can’t fake AIDS or cancer, for example. They’re either there or they aren’t, and both require testing to verify the diagnosis.

No one is talking about AIDS or cancer.

You’re right, women who want an abortion just want to get rid of the baby. They will say, “I was raped. I was scared to go to the police.” Or “My uncle raped me. I can’t tell anyone, he’ll kill me. I have to get rid of this baby!” No one’s going to give them a lie detector test.

It’s abortion on demand, plain and simple.

 

[irishpatrick]

You really have lost me. I hate to be obtuse, but when it comes to actual medical conditions (not some psych hocus-pocus) falsification could be made very difficult and extremely dangerous to the doctor.

Not with all things. Look, you either trust me, or you do not. I refuse to post the reasons on a public forum. It might create scandal and it might help enemies of life. I just won’t go there. There are many ways around the life of the mother exception, and none of them would place the doctor in any scrutiny.

 

[Ridgerunner]

It was. He and the Republicans worked very well together. I believe that can happen again. All this polarized talk is very fearful, imho.

Actually they didn’t work well together at all. Clinton tried the “government shutdown” with them, but unlike today’s Repubs, they called him on it. It cost the Repubs dearly, but Monica Lewinsky “came to the rescue” and Clinton became suddenly cooperative.

theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2013/oct/01/us-government-shutdown-clinton-presidency

 

[GaryTaylor]

According to the link I published earlier regarding the Republican Party’s own autopsy after their 2012 national presidential defeat, plenty of the base believe that the social issues are dragging down the party. It’s really not just the leadership who believes that, but also actual men and women on the streets.

I believe both parties could come together to lower the incidences of abortion. In fact, even though the parties are not yet fully together on the issue, the abortion rate is as low as it has ever been. Teen pregnancies too. We should continue to focus on educating our people and lowering those numbers instead of arguing about it.

But this is both parties which I agree, Warren didn’t run exactly for this reason, abortion, womens rights and secondary issues.

And by debating how to do this is how those numbers became lowered and thats by the pro-life movement and those educated by it, But that is a drop in the bucket compared to 1-million a year. In fact the left protests everything they do so how is not debating the point realisti? That be the case we would be setting record numbers with abortion. Why don’t democrats and democrat Catholics support the pro-life movement and help cut their own numbers. No its page six news and highly contested as a right to kill and selfishly imho.

 

[irishpatrick]

No one is talking about AIDS or cancer.

You’re right, women who want an abortion just want to get rid of the baby. They will say, “I was raped. I was scared to go to the police.” Or “My uncle raped me. I can’t tell anyone, he’ll kill me. I have to get rid of this baby!” No one’s going to give them a lie detector test.

It’s abortion on demand, plain and simple.

Many have found comfort in the three exceptions, thinking that they are reasonable exceptions. But they are holding a false comfort because those three exceptions equal abortion on demand. The things you listed are the obvious ones, yet there are many more.

 

[Little_Sheep]

How so? Are you forgetting or ignoring the 2010 midterm victories for the Republicans?

I’m not ignoring the popularity of the insurgence, but I still believe it wounded the Party deeply. It helped create a Party with two factions who loathed and obstructed each other. While the Tea Party’s stated beliefs are worth consideration, imho, I don’t believe the power players or the movement itself helped Republicans or the country.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Not with all things. Look, you either trust me, or you do not. I refuse to post the reasons on a public forum. It might create scandal and it might help enemies of life. I just won’t go there. There are many ways around the life of the mother exception, and none of them would place the doctor in any scrutiny.

You could send me a private message, of course, but I wouldn’t be able to respond to it in any other way and this portion of the debate would get nowhere.

I’m willing to stipulate that you believe there are really effective ways to falsify a life-threatening condition requiring therapeutic abortion. I say medical falsification is not so easy and is hazardous to the falsifier.

Now, I’m talking about “life of the mother” here.