Terrorist" Nuns

[cathopologist]

St. Thomas Aquinas had already coupled together these two devotions, to parents and to country (Summa Theologica, 2a, 2ae, Q. 101). Dealing with the virtue of “pietas,” dutifulness, he writes: “The principles (or origins) of our being and governing are our parents and our country, which have given us birth and nourishment. Consequently man is debtor chiefly to his parents and his country, after God. Wherefore, just as it belongs to religion to give worship to God, so does it belong to “pietas,” in the second place, to give worship to one’s parents and one’s country.” Thus, unlike nationalism, patriotism comes within the sphere of virtue, duty, and moral obligation.

St. Thomas Aquinas also said:

’A law, prop- erly speaking, regards first and foremost the order to the common good. Now, to order anything to the common good belongs either to the whole people, or to someone who is the viceregent of the whole people. Hence the making of the law belongs either to the whole people or to a public personage who has care for the people; for in all other matters, the directing of anything to the end concerns him to whom the ends belongs.'

When Bush set out for war to Iraq, the Catholic Church’s position was clear - she was against his decisions. Nevertheless, he went ahead with it.

No WMD’s were found, thousands of innocent lives were lost from both sides of the conflicts. Many Americans felt deceived by the U.S government’s ‘intelligence reports’ and mostly, felt disappointed by their leader. It was the patriotic minds of Americans that led him back to power to run for the next four years. Now, everyone wants him out as fast as possible. The peoples of the U.S.A have spoken.

Letter XXI to the emperor Valentinian Art. 10:
’But this would be the act of one contumacious, not of one who knew his position. See, O Emperor, you are already yourself partially rescinding your law, would that it were not partially but altogether! for I would not that your law should be set above the law of God. The law of God has taught us what to follow; human laws cannot teach us this. They usually extort a change from the fearful, but they cannot inspire faith’.
Saint Ambrose, Bishop of Milan

 

[cathopologist]

I do not believe even for an instant that these to Sisters are in the least “un-patriotic”! I have never for an instance supported the war in Iraq. Its a bad joke foisted on the people of the world. DO NOT make the mistake of misunderstanding me…especially the muslims here. I fully support the war against terror and terrorists. What I and many Americans, and others throughout the world disagree with is the “conduct of the war”. It is being micromanaged and done wrong. What should have been done should have taken 6 months, and no more.

I served my country PROUDLY for 10 years joining the US Army in 1967, further volunteering for duty in Viet Nam in 1968 and remained there for two and a half years. In hindsight that war and its conduct was a disaster. Our country lost 58,000 of its finest men and women…all of whom answered the call to duty.

I had grave doubts as to the veracity of the real purpose of the war from its inception, grave doubts shared by many Americans.
The Sisters are standing for for what they believe…and actually had the nerve to stand up for those beliefs!! You would be literally amazed to know how many actual “combat Veterans” are against this current war…because it is being done wrong. vaiw.org/vet/index.php ivaw.org/ and this is the organization of my “Brothers in Arms” from Vietnam who have taken a stand against this war: vvaw.org/ and do not be confused by these idiots: vvaw.org/about/vvawai.php

Think about it… We spent Less actual time eradicating the Japanese and Nazi threat to the world!! Why? Because it was a just war. There is a just basis to this war, but it is not being used, and not being used to resolve the war.

That these Sisters did not get arrested at a protest at an abortion clinic…is of no matter, and is in an invalid premise to criticize them. Thousands of Catholics daily are involved in protests and work against abortion… But its sad that so few have spoken up on the issue of this war…

DO NOT MAKE THE MISTAKE OF THINKING I DO NOT SUPPORT THE TROOPS!! THEY ARE MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS IN ARMS!! SUPPORT THE TROOPS 110%!!

In fact, in the past year, even though I am 58…I tried to return to Active Duty… I had the support of my US Senator as well, but the Army declined me on the basis of my age…even though they are sending Reservists older than myself into the combat zone!

Dear RobHom, after reading your position twice over, i can comprehend your stance on the entire situation. War is never a good thing and there will always be times when you have to make difficult decisions. I am also for the ‘war against terrorism’, but only if there was substantial proof that WMD’s were indeed found in Iraq for example. None was found, as far as i know (I have not been following the war in Iraq for a while now). I am for great, brave, intelligent and honest leaders. Not for someone who builds lies upon lies.

 

[CalCatholic]

Salaam/peace

what do you think of this news ?

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/...goBlobs&blobwhere=1221556801989&ssbinary=true

Joining protests against US President George W. Bush’s wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, two American nuns finally found themselves on the country’s terrorist watch list.

“This term terrorist is a really serious accusation,” Sister Ardeth Platte told The Washington Times on Friday, October 10.

Ardeth and Sister Carol Gilbert received letters from the Maryland State Police that they are placed on the terrorist watch list.

islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?c=Article_C&cid=1221720669165&pagename=Zone-English-News/NWELayout

Maybe the Nuns had tried to board the plane with rulers in their possession… Okay, its a bad joke, just trying to lighten up this thread a little.

 

[meedo]

I couldn’t agree more. This is a common problem with some Americans who make patriotism into a religion, with a “If you are against (the) U.S, you are against God” mentality. Thereby conveniently labeling anyone who is against the U.S government’s foreign policies (as the World’s policemen) as “terrorist.”

one of the best posts i read from you so far.

 

[meedo]

If you know what a charism is, then certainly they, and their community in Grand Rapids, are responding to the charism of their founder.

Catholicism has nothing to do with patriotism. Catholicism is about you and God and your journey to Beatific Vision via the redemption offered to you in Christ. Patriotism has nothing to do with it. If the sisters don’t do what they do and remove threat, then maybe won’t be a world left to have an abortion in.

very true

 

[po18guy]

Well, to get to the source of an objection, one has to come prepared. Dominican or not.

When was the last time you were on the news, fighting for something you strongly believed in?

Did you?

Did you expect the Air Force to fly them to their destination?
Why didn’t you volunteer for the next beheading? It’s easy to judge from the comfort of your chair, isn’t it?

Their entire “protest” is nothing more than left-wing grandstanding. It accomplished nothing substantive. It brought even more scandal upon the Church. It did NOTHING to change government policy and is simple criminality. You may be proud of them. I can only pray for them.

 

[cathopologist]

Their entire “protest” is nothing more than left-wing grandstanding. It accomplished nothing substantive. It brought even more scandal upon the Church. It did NOTHING to change government policy and is simple criminality. You may be proud of them. I can only pray for them.

You call it left-wing, i call it guts. Sometimes even the smallest of things can make big changes in our society. Our Church has always been scandalized by the media. What’s new?

You’re right to pray for them; notice i didn’t object to that. I pray that they will open the eyes of some, who cannot see through the hypocrisy of governments who manipulate the minds of its own people.
**
“Do not spread false reports. Do not help a wicked man by being a malicious witness”.**
Exodus 23:1

"There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers.****"
Proverbs 6:16-19

 

[Tsuwano]

Their entire “protest” is nothing more than left-wing grandstanding. It accomplished nothing substantive. It brought even more scandal upon the Church. It did NOTHING to change government policy and is simple criminality. You may be proud of them. I can only pray for them.

Well, they made you notice them (and probably many more as well) and if that results in you seeking to understand what their protest is about, maybe that’s a good start.

 

[LRThunder]

I can understand why they would protest the war in Iraq, but Afghanistan?

Besides, even if one disagrees with both (can’t see how one can seriously disagree with Afghanistan), you don’t commit crimes to protest the war, especially breaking into a military base.

 

[MakeUpArtist]

Why would anyone be against the action in Afghanistan? That seems just plain idiotic or pro-terrorist.

 

[ralphinal]

Why would anyone be against the action in Afghanistan? That seems just plain idiotic or pro-terrorist.

There are those who hold that the US may have had a right to demand al Quida be brought to trial but had NO AUTHORITY to do it themselves or to cause a regime change in Afganistan. Had the Taliban refused to do anything, we should have protested in the UN and international courts and let it go.

 

[MakeUpArtist]

There are those who hold that the US may have had a right to demand al Quida be brought to trial but had NO AUTHORITY to do it themselves or to cause a regime change in Afganistan. Had the Taliban refused to do anything, we should have protested in the UN and international courts and let it go.

We were attacked. We had every right to go in there. The UN could not have done what we did. Only those on the very fringe opposed military action in Afghanistan. Even liberal Democrats and many European countries offered support. Iraq is another story.

 

[ralphinal]

We were attacked. We had every right to go in there. The UN could not have done what we did. Only those on the very fringe opposed military action in Afghanistan. Even liberal Democrats and many European countries offered support. Iraq is another story.

I do not disagree. I was stating what the opposing side is.

There were groups that prior to 9/11 called the Talaban one of the worst, most oppressive governments in existance. Once we started talking regime change, we replaced them on the list.

The United States can do nothing right in the eyes of many. If we are attacked, we should not respond in kind. If we help others, we cause enemies to be formed. If we try to lead others to democracy, we are interfering with their self-determination.

 

[R_not]

I don’t agree with these nuns, but one thing we won’t do to them is behead them, or do some other despicable thing to them. They haven’t figured out that the country is indeed safer and our guys have rebuilt roads, schools, etc. The iraqi economy is gaining and basically the standard of living is much higher. In Iraq, more muslims have killed muslims than any other group and I don’t really know why people are complaining that it is being stopped.

 

[R_not]

I do not disagree. I was stating what the opposing side is.

There were groups that prior to 9/11 called the Talaban one of the worst, most oppressive governments in existance. Once we started talking regime change, we replaced them on the list.

The United States can do nothing right in the eyes of many. If we are attacked, we should not respond in kind. If we help others, we cause enemies to be formed. If we try to lead others to democracy, we are interfering with their self-determination.

 

[peary]

Salaam/peace

what do you think of this news ?

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/...goBlobs&blobwhere=1221556801989&ssbinary=true

Joining protests against US President George W. Bush’s wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, two American nuns finally found themselves on the country’s terrorist watch list.

“This term terrorist is a really serious accusation,” Sister Ardeth Platte told The Washington Times on Friday, October 10.

Ardeth and Sister Carol Gilbert received letters from the Maryland State Police that they are placed on the terrorist watch list.

Pretty stupid, but, then again, the present administration hasn’t been known to be high on the intelligence factor, either.

 

[coleraine]

Salaam/peace

what do you think of this news ?

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/...goBlobs&blobwhere=1221556801989&ssbinary=true

Joining protests against US President George W. Bush’s wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, two American nuns finally found themselves on the country’s terrorist watch list.

“This term terrorist is a really serious accusation,” Sister Ardeth Platte told The Washington Times on Friday, October 10.

Ardeth and Sister Carol Gilbert received letters from the Maryland State Police that they are placed on the terrorist watch list.

islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?c=Article_C&cid=1221720669165&pagename=Zone-English-News/NWELayout

Muslim woman…you fool no one. I have told you before that no matter what bad things are done by catholics, it is not condoned nor taught by the church. but jihad is in the Koran, is it not? and does it not tell you to smite the necks of non believers? what is your goal here? to convert the mindless? because they are the only ones who are going to take your nonsense seriously.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

Salaam/peace

Muslim woman…you fool no one. I have told you before that no matter what bad things are done by catholics, it is not condoned nor taught by the church…

hehehe , why u think I am always after Christians ?

Here I did not try to say at all that Nuns did something bad. I do think they did a great job. I pray that God will give them best rewards …not only in this life , but hereafter , too.

PS. btw , to get rewards in hereafter , they need to become … eeek http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/sofa.gif

 

[Muslim_Woman]

Salaam/peace

Pretty stupid, but, then again, the present administration hasn’t been known to be high on the intelligence factor, either.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

Salaam/peace

We were attacked. We had every right to go in there. …

So , to capture one culprit , it’s ok to kill thousands & thousands innocent civilians including kids ?

There was no threat from Iraq but still US / UK went there. Now Iraqi people have right to go to these countries & can kill children , rape , destroy the cities etc etc?