The Anglican Church Doesn't Really Expect Much of Me

[C.Ray]

It’s a long story.

We have plenty of time.

 

[MarkRome]

I find this a bit of a paradox. Most Catholics who become Anglican want/like that freedom.

 

[SeekHisFace]

Nothing like my experience of are formed protestant church.

May I make a suggestion? The demands of scripture on the conscience are very very high, if the ‘church’ doesn’t seem to be making them of you that doesn’t mean God isn’t.
But take heart, the grace of God to a battle weary saint is sweet, far sweeter than if we took a “wide way”.

 

[OrbisNonSufficit]

willingness to tackle difficult issues (even if they cause fracture)

pronounced involvement of laity in the life, ministry and governance of the church

I am not sure about others, but those are things Catholic Church definitely has. On the other hand as GKMotley often says, Anglicans tend to be split on various issues which I think actually contradicts your 1st point (in-fact being in communion does not necessarily mean sharing exactly same faith about Apostolic Succession or Eucharist or female priesthood…). As for your second point, I think that people are quite involved in life of Church nowadays. There aren’t nearly enough Priests so that becomes a necessity…

strong commitment to social outreach

What do you mean by this? The Catholic Church is #1 charity organization so I’d hope we can at least say She isn’t lacking in this regard

willingness to tackle difficult issues (even if they cause fracture)

pronounced involvement of laity in the life, ministry and governance of the church

I am not sure about others, but those are things Catholic Church definitely has. On the other hand as GKMotley often says, Anglicans tend to be split on various issues which I think actually contradicts your 1st point (in-fact being in communion does not necessarily mean sharing exactly same faith about Apostolic Succession or Eucharist or female priesthood…). As for your second point, I think that people are quite involved in life of Church nowadays. There aren’t nearly enough Priests so that becomes a necessity…

I will also answer your question in my next post

 

[OrbisNonSufficit]

Is this the case in other Protestant churches. Is the bar so low that pretty much anyone can come and go as they please with very little in the way of commitment?

Because of this:

inclusivity

Let me explain. Anglican Church does not require many beliefs beside core ones. You can view Apostolic Succession as necessary or as non-existent and both are okay. You can view female priesthood as invalid or desirable and both are okay. Hence rules are always set for least demanding acceptable view.

the is no Sunday obligation

Because Anglicans can view Eucharist as mere symbol, since Anglicans can view Church in light of branch theory, since Anglicans can view Sola Scriptura as prime belief, there is this interpretation no need for Sunday obligation and actually no logic in it. Again, rules are set for least demanding belief and that is this one.

no holy days of obligation

Same as above. Plus historically it cut free days of peasants which helped nobility but sshhh

no requirement to fast or abstain

Sola Christi and Sola Fide both contradict need to Fast. Both can be held by Anglican hence rules are set for them because they are least demanding.

very little in the way of devotions

Sola Scriptura contradicts devotions. Historically Protestantism has been opposed to Catholicism and Devotions, Anglicanism was no exception. But there are certainly groups of Anglicans who have many Devotions (Cardinal St. Newman actually belonged to such group before he became Catholic).

sin is often discussed of in social terms as opposed to personal terms

This is probably to not offend anyone. Since homosexuality is viewed as sin in Bible but at the same time it is alright to have homosexual relations even if one is part of clergy, this might be some consequence of similar developments in Anglican Church. Maybe there is other reason but I can’t see one. Our Priest started doing this when he became too focused on mercy of God while not paying attention to fact God is also just so that might be just theological thing.

 

[GKMotley]

Anglican Church does not require many beliefs beside core ones. You can view Apostolic Succession as necessary or as non-existent and both are okay. You can view female priesthood as invalid or desirable and both are okay. Hence rules are always set for least demanding acceptable view.

Not in my portion of the Anglican zoo.

 

[esieffe]

The prayer before the Eucharist is the general confession, followed by the general absolution, from the celebrant or the Bishop, if present. Which Anglicans consider as efficacious as the also available individual auricular confession.

I am Catholic, but I use that prayer occasionally. From the 1812 prayer book unless memory fails, “We are not so worthy as to gather crumbs from under thy table…” Very nice prayer.

 

[TepeyacTraveler]

Agreed. I’m not sure what to make of it?

 

[TepeyacTraveler]

So are you finding yourself missing some of the accountability and structure of the Catholic Church? When you say the “bar is low” kinda sounds like your yearning for more? Just wondering…

 

[7_Sorrows]

Being an Anglican I found was more orthodox than being an Episcopalian.

Are you an Anglican in America or England? Most Anglicans here in America converted from the Episcopal church which sounds more like what you are describing.

The Anglican church is a liturgical church like the Catholic church. Most Protestant churches are not liturgical and have been described as having a
“watered down” understanding of Christianity. I don’t mean to be offensive, but
considering the Protestant churches have existed for only 500 years as opposed to the Orthodox and Catholic churches existing for 1,000 - 2,000 years longer.

The Protestant denominations are many and services vary. Some might be more committed than others. They are Christians and follow Jesus and the Gospels, but they have moved in a different direction from the Catholic church over the last 500 years and every pastor has his own ideas on how he interprets the Bible.

 

[AngelusDomini]

The 1662 BCP lists Days of Fasting & Abstinence. Whilst there aren’t Holy Days of Obligation there are Prinicpal Feast Days with the expectation that members will attend church. In Elizabethan England the Sunday Obligation was to some extent in place as people were fined if they didn’t attend the established church.
Coming from a High Church background I was (and still am) disappointed with the woeful numbers of Catholics who take Holy Days of Obligation seriously; I’d go as far as to say the Anglicans has much better numbers for Prinicpal Days.

 

[OrbisNonSufficit]

Not in my portion of the Anglican zoo.

That’s my point. In another portion different things are allowed or the norm.

 

[GKMotley]

That quote is from the Prayer of Humble Access, which occurs immediately prior to the congregation coming forward to receive Communion, and just after the Agnus Dei. What I was referring to above was the General Confession, followed by Absolution, which occurs earlier in the Mass.

 

[GKMotley]

Yes. Which is also the point, of my board name. By portion of the zoo, I was saying that there are Anglicans who do not allow that latitude of interpretation as acceptable. It will depend on which Anglicans one is speaking of. You can find that variance within Anglicanism considered in the broadest sense (motley be the brood)… But an Anglican who does not (inter alia) accept females as valid recipients for Orders will not blithely accept others who do. That is the sort of thing that divides the general breed and produced the Anglican Continuum, over the past 45 years…

 

[commenter]

Yes. Which is also the point, of my board name. By portion of the zoo, I was saying that there are Anglicans who do not allow that latitude of interpretation as acceptable. It will depend on which Anglicans one is speaking of. You can find that variance within Anglicanism considered in the broadest sense (motley be the brood)… But an Anglican who does not (inter alia) accept females as valid recipients for Orders will not blithely accept others who do. That is the sort of thing that divides the general breed and produced the Anglican Continuum, over the past 45 years…

What confuses me is the existence of the Anglican Communion, and the Archbishop. While I personally think the parishes of the Continuum are likely more authentic to what I know of Anglican heritage than many other Anglican groups, they aren’t recognized as part of the Anglican Zoo by the Communion.

In fact the Continuum itself is based only on mutual recognition as “Anglican Continuum”, (though they also recognize Anglicanism outside themselves). But any other group can call itself Anglican Continuum if they want to? Even if they be really really outliers?

Perhaps because of my own bias I’m looking for closure where it’s not needed or meant to be. (Hard core RCs have an anti-motley gene).

 

[GKMotley]

I’m not all that fond of Motley myself. But the world is what it is.

The Communion, oddly enough, is not necessarily in total communion with itself, various constituent Churches being, from time to time, in forms of impaired communion - in the Communion.

The Continuum is only a name of convenience, though it does convey a sense of what one is likely to find as normative under its umbrella. Which is basically what would have been considered the doctrinal range of Anglicanism, 75 years ago, on the reformed/Anglo-Catholic spectrum. And several of the major (a relative term) jurisdictions are and have been working to unite into a formal one-ness. Progress as been good. And sure, any group can claim anything about itself. And yes, The Continuum sorts readily recognize that all types of folks can and do call themselves Anglican, including those the Continuum mindset would not necessarily also call Christian.

 

[PickyPicky]

While I personally think the parishes of the Continuum are likely more authentic to what I know of Anglican heritage than many other Anglican groups, they aren’t recognized as part of the Anglican Zoo by the Communion

I think it would be more accurate to say individual Churches are not recognised by the Communion as part of the Communion unless they are … part of the Communion. Being part of the Communion means being in communion with Cantuar, being invited to the Lambeth Conference, and being accepted into the Anglican Consultative Council. That doesn’t mean Churches within the Communion necessarily discount Churches without as being “non-Anglican”. (Indeed, as @GKMotley has pointed out, ACNA is sort of unofficially half in).

There are of course Churches outside the Communion (both of the Continuum type and otherwise) who derive from the Anglican tradition and heritage, just as there are Catholic Churches unaffiliated with Rome.

 

[TULIPed]

Is this the case in other Protestant churches.

There is no “obligation” in the Catholic sense of the word in the Reformed tradition. We see the “obligation” perhaps a bit differently (although I’m sure many Catholics see it exactly the same way).

The best way to illustrate it is in an example. Imagine you have a best friend - one who, among other things, has saved your life. You and he have agreed to a weekly meeting time. If you blow off seeing your friend - how good a friend to him are youreally? How thankful are you that he saved your life? How serious are you about honoring commitments?

Showing up at church is - like loving the “least of these - evidence of a true and lively faith. Honoring commitments and covenants is part and parcel of who we are as Christians. If we’re not doing these things, we have to ask ourselves if the Holy Spirit is active in our lives at all.

 

[TULIPed]

The Continuum is only a name of convenience,

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

It seems you’re not alone in the Continuum!

 

[Maximian]

Our local Anglican vicar, who is a nice chap, describes himself as “the most orthodox Anglican vicar he knows”. He is a divorcee, married to a female Anglican vicar who is herself a divorcee.

His favourite saint is the Apostle Thomas because he identifies with people who have Doubts, which is hilarious if you have read Waugh’s Decline and Fall.