The Catholic church did not give us the Bible

[benedictus2]

The Spirit of God is as real to me as my right arm.

I have no doubt that it is very real to you. But how do we know that objectively?

I recieved the baptism of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands.

Perhaps so. But does that mean that all your actions are moved by the Holy Spirit? I doubt that very much. In the same manner, not all your conclusions are guided by the Holy Spirit.

Otherwise, all those who have been subject to the laying on of hands would agreee on their interpretation of the Bible.

All Christians who are born again, In Christ are part of the Body of Christ.

Not quite. If you have been baptized in the Trinitarian manner yes.

I and my fellow nonCatholics are part of His Body and are not part of the Catholic Church. Your theology is flat out wrong.

Nope. My theology is bulls eye right. Christ said you have to be born of water and spirit.

“Born again” is a Protestant construct. The early Christians don’t even refer to it as such. It was always about Baptism.

I think that even at the beginning of the protestant revolt Luther, et al, did not even refer to members of the Body of Christ as “born again”.

Also, dumping verses from the Bible is not good argumentation. You have to give an exegesis to show how this verses support your position.

 

[Hisalone]

Hilarious thread title.

Of course the “Catholics” gave the word the Bible.
Jesus founded the Catholic Church.
…and Jesus is God.

This is like first grade stuff…but lotsa folks had missed it, I suppose.

You guys want to take credit for things that belong to God.
You should listen up as you continue to mangle many, many scriptures.

 

[benedictus2]

You guys want to take credit for things that belong to God.
You should listen up as you continue to mangle many, many scriptures.

Actually, you are the one who mangle scripture. First you chop up the Bible then you completely disregard some of Christ’s own words.

When you start taking Jesus Christ at His Own Words then your post will have more credibility.

 

[KathleenGee]

We already know and pray on the same Words of the Bible…but such display of Scripture is not answering the issue of the mission of the church.

 

[jake23]

The Spirit of God is as real to me as my right arm. I recieved the baptism of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands.

All Christians who are born again, In Christ are part of the Body of Christ. I and my fellow nonCatholics are part of His Body and are not part of the Catholic Church. Your theology is flat out wrong.

JOHN 14:16-17, 23
16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever—
17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.

23 Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.

JOHN 15:4
4 Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me.

JOHN 17: 22
22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one:
23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.
24 Father, I desire that they also whom You gave Me may be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory which You have given Me; for You loved Me before the foundation of the world.
25 O righteous Father! The world has not known You, but I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me.
26 And I have declared to them Your name, and will declare it, that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

ROMANS 8:9-11
9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.
10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

1CORINTHIANS 3:16-17
16 Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?
17 If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.

1CORINTHIANS 6:17-20
17 But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.
18 Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body.
19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?
20 For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body F16 and in your spirit, which are God’s.

2CORINTHIANS 6:16-18
16 And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you* are the temple of the living God. As God has said: “I will dwell in them And walk among them. I will be their God, And they shall be My people.”+
17 Therefore “Come out from among them And be separate, says the Lord. Do not touch what is unclean, And I will receive you.”*
18 “I will be a Father to you, And you shall be My sons and daughters, Says the Lord Almighty.”*

2CORINTHIANS 13:5-6
5 Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?–unless indeed you are disqualified.
6 But I trust that you will know that we are not disqualified.

GALATIANS 2:20
20 I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.
GALATIANS 4:19
19 My little children, for whom I labor in birth again until Christ is formed in you,
COLOSSIANS 1:27
26 the mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations, but now has been revealed to His saints.
27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which F4 is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
F4: M-Text reads who.
1JOHN 4:4
4 You, dear children, are from God and have overcome them, because the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world.

This does not help your case! I use to throw out all these scriptures also when I was protestant, however I went to college to become a pastor and felt pretty foolish once I was educated on actual transaltions and hypathetical meanings in biblical times along with many other things! It will do you good in your journey for Christ to learn the languages, history, and actual translations. This is not a he said or she said knowledge, it is simply the history of the Bible and the original (authentic) christians. You will find youre way to the catholic church if you do this with sincerity. Just because you know how to read and cross reference, does not mean you know scripture or you would be catholic if you did!

 

[Hisalone]

I have no doubt that it is very real to you. But how do we know that objectively?

God is real to me, I am real to Him. How can you know that? by looking. Do you not meet complete strangers and within seconds know they are either Gods or not?

Perhaps so. But does that mean that all your actions are moved by the Holy Spirit? I doubt that very much. In the same manner, not all your conclusions are guided by the Holy Spirit.

As you walk in the Spirit your path grows more straight if you follow Him. At first you may go off track a good deal but then less and less. But why am I telling you this? You know already, right? Am I right?

Otherwise, all those who have been subject to the laying on of hands would agreee on their interpretation of the Bible.

Scripture says that it is by laying on of hands that one reicieves His Spirit. It does not say by laying on of hands one recieves the same interpretation.

Not quite. If you have been baptized in the Trinitarian manner yes.

So if I was baptised in the name of Jesus then not?

Nope. My theology is bulls eye right. Christ said you have to be born of water and spirit.

My reference was to your statement that to be in the Body of Christ is to be in the Catholic Church. I am not in the Catholic (Roman) Church.

“Born again” is a Protestant construct. The early Christians don’t even refer to it as such. It was always about Baptism.

Born again is a Jesus construct. He used it to teach a supposed learned man who lack basic knowledge.

I think that even at the beginning of the protestant revolt Luther, et al, did not even refer to members of the Body of Christ as “born again”.

What is your difinition of who is and who is not part of the Body of Christ?

Also, dumping verses from the Bible is not good argumentation. You have to give an exegesis to show how this verses support your position.

Those verses support the notion that God lives within the believer. It is His indwelling that makes one part of His body.

 

[Hisalone]

We already know and pray on the same Words of the Bible…but such display of Scripture is not answering the issue of the mission of the church.

The mission of the Church is to do the works of Crist here on earth.
Christ came to destroy the works of the devil.
The devil comes to rob,kill and destroy.
The Church is to restore, give life and build.

 

[Hisalone]

Actually, you are the one who mangle scripture. First you chop up the Bible then you completely disregard some of Christ’s own words.

When you start taking Jesus Christ at His Own Words then your post will have more credibility.

We could sit here a spit at each other all day, so Ill pass comment other to say the thought of starting a thread of mangled scripture has passed my mind more than once.

 

[Hisalone]

This does not help your case! I use to throw out all these scriptures also when I was protestant, however I went to college to become a pastor and felt pretty foolish once I was educated on actual transaltions and hypathetical meanings in biblical times along with many other things! It will do you good in your journey for Christ to learn the languages, history, and actual translations. This is not a he said or she said knowledge, it is simply the history of the Bible and the original (authentic) christians. You will find youre way to the catholic church if you do this with sincerity. Just because you know how to read and cross reference, does not mean you know scripture or you would be catholic if you did!

I am sorry to hear your liberal education destoyed your faith.

 

[jake23]

I am sorry to hear your liberal education destoyed your faith.

I gues you could say Liberty University is Liberal when compared to the beliefs of Christ church, however my teachings where not opinionated, but fact and that is what leaded me to the catholic church. It is amazing howlacking of knowledge protestants are and how blind there pastors are! You should not be sorry about my faith, I have found Christ finally instead of embracing the vein opnionated translations of protestant belief. You should rejoice that I have found the truth and let go of the misconstrude and altered beliefs I once had!

It is typical that you ignored the meaning and point of what I wrote and replied with hateful ignorance instead. You really need to open up your heart and also educate yourself! You are from the south right!

 

[Hisalone]

I gues you could say Liberty University is Liberal when compared to the beliefs of Christ church, however my teachings where not opinionated, but fact and that is what leaded me to the catholic church. It is amazing howlacking of knowledge protestants are and how blind there pastors are! You should not be sorry about my faith, I have found Christ finally instead of embracing the vein opnionated translations of protestant belief. You should rejoice that I have found the truth and let go of the misconstrude and altered beliefs I once had!

It is typical that you ignored the meaning and point of what I wrote and replied with hateful ignorance instead. You really need to open up your heart and also educate yourself! You are from the south right!

No I live north of the Potomac River, my allegiances have always been with Mr Lincoln.
Please tell me how you came to Christ.

 

[benedictus2]

God is real to me, I am real to Him. How can you know that? by looking. Do you not meet complete strangers and within seconds know they are either Gods or not?

But I have not met you yet in person have I? Also, our perception of how a certain person is not a guarantee that said person is in fact guided by the Holy Spirit. That is subjective knowledge. What we are after is objective truth.

As you walk in the Spirit your path grows more straight if you follow Him. At first you may go off track a good deal but then less and less. But why am I telling you this? You know already, right? Am I right?

But that is not what we are discussing here. What we are talking about is the interpretation of the Bible.

Scripture says that it is by laying on of hands that one reicieves His Spirit. It does not say by laying on of hands one recieves the same interpretation.

But if there is only ONE Holy Spirit guiding you, the interpretation would be the same. If your interpretation go against each other then obviously the spirit guiding don’t know what the truth is and therefore is not the Holy Spirit because the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth.

So if I was baptised in the name of Jesus then not?

What did Jesus say before he ascended to heaven? “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit”. Since you are a Bible believing Christian why would you do otherwise?

My reference was to your statement that to be in the Body of Christ is to be in the Catholic Church. I am not in the Catholic (Roman) Church.

Yes, the Body of Christ is the Catholic Church. Those who have been baptized in the the Trinitarian manner though they may be separated from the Catholic Church is still a member of the Church.

That is why those who have been baptized accordingly are never re-baptized when they return or convert to the Catholic Church.

Born again is a Jesus construct. He used it to teach a supposed learned man who lack basic knowledge.

Not according to the Bible. Jesus did not say we should be born again. If you really are a Bible believer then believe the Bible and not some man made doctrine.

What is your difinition of who is and who is not part of the Body of Christ?

I have answered this above.

Those verses support the notion that God lives within the believer. It is His indwelling that makes one part of His body.

I am not quite sure that that is entirely true. God dwells even in the non-Christians. Does that make them then a member of the Body of Christ?

 

[benedictus2]

The mission of the Church is to do the works of Crist here on earth.
Christ came to destroy the works of the devil.
The devil comes to rob,kill and destroy.
The Church is to restore, give life and build.

The mission of the Church is to preach the Gospel.

The mission of the Church is to make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son of the Holy Spriit.

 

[Bill_Pick]

This does not help your case! I use to throw out all these scriptures also when I was protestant, however I went to college to become a pastor and felt pretty foolish once I was educated on actual transaltions and hypathetical meanings in biblical times along with many other things! It will do you good in your journey for Christ to learn the languages, history, and actual translations. This is not a he said or she said knowledge, it is simply the history of the Bible and the original (authentic) christians. You will find youre way to the catholic church if you do this with sincerity. Just because you know how to read and cross reference, does not mean you know scripture or you would be catholic if you did!

This is what a cult does just pick up a Bible and just start trowing out Bible verse and hope one or two hits or see if you can get one that will stick

 

[robsully]

Hello All,

I don’t have a dog in this fight, for I visit the forum in search of truth and a better understanding of Christian beliefs.

Having read this thread, and the responses to NTS and Catholic to Protestant, Protestant to Catholic, why would I become a Christian?

 

[jmcrae]

Hello All,

I don’t have a dog in this fight, for I visit the forum in search of truth and a better understanding of Christian beliefs.

Having read this thread, and the responses to NTS and Catholic to Protestant, Protestant to Catholic, why would I become a Christian?

Uh - so that you can go to Heaven?

I fail to understand the logic of throwing yourself deliberately into Hell, merely because you don’t like the tone of a debate among total strangers on the Internet.

 

[robsully]

I didn’t realize that one would go to heaven by being intolortate, judgemental, slanderous, insulting, and petty.

 

[jake23]

I didn’t realize that one would go to heaven by being intolortate, judgemental, slanderous, insulting, and petty.

Ahh, you got most of the ingredients of a prodestant except one! clueless. Now instead of silly posts, how about you log on to learn somthing!

 

[nsper7]

…unless you also want to say that the Catholic church gave us the inquisition and the priest sex abuse scandals.

The point being that you can not take credit for the positive while at the same time pass the buck on the negative. A little consistency on this please.

Who said the Papal Inquisition was necessarily a bad thing? Remember that the infamous Spanish Inquisition, which is what gives the Inquisition a bad name, was not run by the Church, by the Spanish monarch who had wrested control from the Pope. The original intention of the Papal Inquisition was to root out heresy and prevent its spreading among the faithful.

In terms of the Priest sex abuse scandals, one can no more blame the Church for those than one could blame the education system for the teacher-student sex scandals that have occurred. The individual Priest who committed these disgusting and atrocious acts are responsible, not the Church.

 

[Bill_Pick]

Who said the Papal Inquisition was necessarily a bad thing? Remember that the infamous Spanish Inquisition, which is what gives the Inquisition a bad name, was not run by the Church, by the Spanish monarch who had wrested control from the Pope. The original intention of the Papal Inquisition was to root out heresy and prevent its spreading among the faithful.

In terms of the Priest sex abuse scandals, one can no more blame the Church for those than one could blame the education system for the teacher-student sex scandals that have occurred. The individual Priest who committed these disgusting and atrocious acts are responsible, not the Church.

Dont be hard on him he is just lieving up to his name NOT TO SMART