The Dilemma: the Christian Conception of Jesus vs. the Muslim Conception of Jesus

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But they are simple human being like you!
But they are guaranteed to know and teach the Truth. Christ promised it and God does not lie. They are ordained by Christ, through the unbroken chain of the Apostles.

Why not? Would you be able to accept a God who hate instead of love.

Nope.

Linus2nd
 
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Counterpoint:
I am providing a real life example to illustrate a point
No, you aren’t. Because it wasn’t a real-life example, as became clear very quickly. In real-life examples, there are specific circumstances that lead people into a “dilemma”–there isn’t just an abstract “dilemma.”
I could have been raised in a Christian/Muslim household because my mother was Christian and my father was Muslim (each devoted to their respected religion). In such a situation, I might have been culturally-conditioned and exposed equally to both viewpoints. (This is not very difficult to imagine. The problem is that you don’t apparently have much of an imagination.)
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Counterpoint:
There is no more reason to believe in the authority of the Bible than there is to believe in the authority of the Qur’an.
You haven’t substantiated this. You have just asserted it.
I have already substantiated this claim.

Criticisms of the Bible” vs. “Criticisms of the Quran
And yes, of course culture and upbringing play an important role–and they should. It is the norm for people to remain faithful to the tradition in which they were raised. They should only abandon that tradition if they encounter overwhelming evidence indicating that they should do so.
I was raised a Catholic. So, I was culturally-conditioned to believe in the Catholic worldview. But when I came of age, I abandoned that view because I found it to be intellectually untenable.
 
If you truly want to be objective, then you must be willing to subject the Bible to the same critical evaluation that you are subjecting the Quran. (A truly objective individual like myself would find both texts leaving something very much to be desired.)

Criticisms of the Bible” vs. “Criticisms of the Quran
It has been undergoing critical evaluation since it was first written, almost 2,000 years of criticism now. We don’t need to view link. We have our own Theologians.

Linus2nd
 
I could have been raised in a Christian/Muslim household because my mother was Christian and my father was Muslim (each devoted to their respected religion). In such a situation, I might have been culturally-conditioned and exposed equally to both viewpoints. (This is not very difficult to imagine. The problem is that you don’t apparently have much of an imagination.)
It has nothing to do with having an imagination or not. It has to do with the abstract, arid nature of your supposed “dilemma.” If you had been raised in a mixed Christian-Muslim environment, you would have had specific experiences of different kinds with both traditions.

You’re a human being. Don’t be ashamed of it. Don’t try to be a robot, and don’t play silly mind games with matters of ultimate concern.

I have already substantiated this claim.
Two Wikipedia articles? Come on. Be serious. Wikipedia is fine for basic facts, but as a basis for saying that the Bible and the Qur’an have exactly equal evidence in their favor?

Also, as I keep saying, they are two completely different kinds of books and the claims made by them (at least if we’re comparing Catholicism with Islam) are not the same.
I was raised a Catholic. So, I was culturally-conditioned to believe in the Catholic worldview. But when I came of age, I abandoned that view because I found it to be intellectually untenable.
Now we finally get some honesty. Islam has nothing to do with it at all.

If you want to go on with the discussion, give the reasons why you found Catholicism intellectually untenable. Or just drop the discussion.

Edwin
 
If you had been raised in a mixed Christian-Muslim environment, you would have had specific experiences of different kinds with both traditions.
If I had been raised Christian/Muslim, I would have experienced the very dilemma I posed in the OP of this thread. You either get that or you don’t.
 
It has been undergoing critical evaluation since it was first written, almost 2,000 years of criticism now. We don’t need to view link. We have our own Theologians.
As I have argued in another thread, religious believers are not willing to subject their scriptures to the same scrutiny they subject the scriptures of other religions.
 
If I had been raised Christian/Muslim, I would have experienced the very dilemma I posed in the OP of this thread. You either get that or you don’t.
But you would have specifics to flesh it out. You either get that or you don’t.

Still no actual account of the reasons why you abandoned Christianity?

You don’t have to share, of course. But you started this thread with a fake “dilemma,” so now that’s been cleared up I invite you to continue the dialogue in honesty. Keep talking and keep it real, or walk away.

Edwin
 
An irrelevant observation? 🙂 Occasionally it becomes a strong suspicion regarding some members who join, that they have no real questions but have made up their minds, and only pose questions to cause mischief where they can. They may even include emotive elements as bait. They reject anything that does not agree with their hypothesis, even logical explanations, and just pull out something, a sentence or a phrase that side-skirts all that has been explained, ignoring all else that does not supports their hypothesis. :eek: Those who do so, know that this is their purpose. If I suspect it is the case I generally prefer not to engage. Is this appropriate, I wonder!
 
I am facing this dilemma, namely, the choice between accepting the Christian conception of Jesus or the Muslim conception of Jesus. The Christian argues that Jesus is the incarnation of God and unless I believe this I will go to hell. The Christian also argues that we know these things are true because the Holy Bible tells us so. The Muslim argues that Jesus is not the incarnation of God and if I believe in such a notion I will go to hell. The Muslim also argues that we know these things are true because the Holy Qur’an tells us so.

What should I believe? I don’t want to go to hell. I’m scared. Help me!
There’s only a dilemma because it’s set up to be a dilemma.

Of course, being a Jew, I would say that. 😉
 
I have already explained why. It’s intellectually untenable. Most, if not all, religions are.
Materialism, scepticism, cynicism, hedonism, egoism, relativism, scientism, Darwinism and nihilism are all intellectually, morally, socially and spiritually untenable…
 
An irrelevant observation? 🙂 Occasionally it becomes a strong suspicion regarding some members who join, that they have no real questions but have made up their minds, and only pose questions to cause mischief where they can. They may even include emotive elements as bait. They reject anything that does not agree with their hypothesis, even logical explanations, and just pull out something, a sentence or a phrase that side-skirts all that has been explained, ignoring all else that does not supports their hypothesis. :eek: Those who do so, know that this is their purpose. If I suspect it is the case I generally prefer not to engage. Is this appropriate, I wonder!
It is better to beat them at their own game by exposing their inconsistency and absurdity!
 
As I have argued in another thread, religious believers are not willing to subject their scriptures to the same scrutiny they subject the scriptures of other religions.
Are you willing to subject your philosophy to any form of scrutiny? 😉
 
I was raised a Catholic. So, I was culturally-conditioned to believe in the Catholic worldview. But when I came of age, I abandoned that view because I found it to be intellectually untenable.
Can you explain why your present view is intellectually tenable?
 
There’s only a dilemma because it’s set up to be a dilemma.

Of course, being a Jew, I would say that. 😉
I would think as a Jew you would reject both the Christian view and Muslim view of Jesus.
 
Materialism, scepticism, cynicism, hedonism, egoism, relativism, scientism, Darwinism and nihilism are all intellectually, morally, socially and spiritually untenable…
I don’t subscribe to any of those “isms.”
 
Not to toot my own horn, but I like how you’re ignoring me completely. It gives me confidence in my answers.

Care to break it?
 
If I had been raised Christian/Muslim, I would have experienced the very dilemma I posed in the OP of this thread. You either get that or you don’t.
We get it but it is not a dilemma for Catholics. We are trying to explain to you that God did not leave us orphans, we do have an infallible source of truth. Pray for faith.

Linusnd
 
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