The Door to Real Jewish Life

[Psalms62]

Sefer: means, scribe, or those who are able to translate and write the Torah on a parchment. Written entirely in Hebrew, a sefer Torah contains 304,805 letters, all of which must be duplicated precisely by a trained sofer (“scribe”), an effort which may take as long as approximately one and a half years.

Question? When the word “Sefer” or “Sofer” is used as a title before the name are they listing themselves as a scribe? When listed as Sefer or Sofer:

Moses Sofer (Schreiber), Sofer or Séfér Yah’acov. I understand that the word “Sefer” is a “Book” (Sefer Torah) but when a scribe or scholar has written a book and the title is listed “sefer”, how is it referred? With authority?

 

[Gab123]

I bet you may rabbi knows more about Talmud than professor Peter Schäfer, who was obviously writing with an agenda in mind.

I think his agenda was simply to point out the obvious, and the references in the Talmud are pretty obvious. I don’t know why people go out of heir way to try to deny the obvious. everybody knows that the rabbis didn’t and don’t believe that Jesus of Nazareth is the messiah, so what do you expect they are going to say about Him? There are plenty of videos of rabbis in Israel today saying terrible things about Jesus today, so that in itself proves the case.

It is the rabbis’ job is to tell others what to believe, so obviously they besmirched Jesus. You yourself would say he was a false teacher and a liar, being that you don’t believe that Jesus is who he says He is… So you’re in a conundrum. The best thing is to just acknowledge the passages in the Talmud are referring to Jesus and move on.

Peter Schäfer’s knowledge of Talmud is about as dull as

An attack. Not a refutation.

As the video by the Israeli Jews explained, even if a rabbi would tell people to believe their left hand was their right hand, they would believe it. So there was and is much room for corruption among those in authority over the masses…

To claim that my statement on Yeshu living a hundred years before Jesus is “nonsense” is the epitome of ignorance.

The claim that the Jesus spoken of in the Talmud was somebody that lived 100 years before Jesus of Nazareth does not make any sense… The Talmud was written after the foundation of Christianity and during a time when Christianity was spreading like wildfire. So to claim that they were writing about a Jesus that lived before Jesus of Nazareth is a very weak stance…

You know who uses Peter’s book? That filthy, rotten Holocaust denier

I think even Jewish people are tired of hearing people use the Holocaust as a means to try to besmirch people… Prof. Norman Finkelstein explains this in this short video:

 

[po18guy]

I wrote for others for 31 years. Now I can write for pleasure, and it is very gratifying to know that at least some of it is useful. I am straining my intellect to keep pace in this thread. As well, words fail to impress. The heart and mind must both be convicted of the truth of a matter before achieving a level of comfort with it, if not embracing it.

Now, as to the matter at hand…

We must arrive at our beliefs based on reason. It is a truism, most recently expressed by Prof. Peter Kreeft of Boston College, that in this life we cannot avoid reasoning - we can only avoid reasoning poorly. I assure you that I am most guilty in this regard.

A perhaps not entirely comfortable question which must occasionally arise in the Hebrew mind is the inevitable “What if…?” The goal of this is to avoid the potentially embarrassing “Who knew?” on that day…

In that line of reasoning, that line of pursuit and inquiry, I can only encourage all, both Jew and Gentile, to seek what your heart desires to a level unimaginable to the human intellect; a level which cannot be fully comprehended by our distracted, finite minds and impure hearts.

The impetus must originate with the Almighty, Who never fails to illumine the path of true seekers.

 

[Rabbi]

You want to have a private chat with me on this whole issue (about proving Jesus), I’d be happy to do so. Just know that things may get a little heated, so I apologies in advance. Understand from here on out that we Orthodox Jews have sound reason to reject Jesus. If we didn’t, we’d all be in Church right now. Believe me. Let me know what you’re feeling.

 

[Rabbi]

“No one has refuted One For Israel,” come on.

 

[Gab123]

You want to have a private chat with me on this whole issue (about proving Jesus), I’d be happy to do so. Just know that things may get a little heated, so I apologies in advance. Understand from here on out that we Orthodox Jews have sound reason to reject Jesus.

Exactly. This simply again makes the case that the Jesus being bersmirched in the Talmud is Jesus of Nazareth. Good grief. It’s like pulling teeth…

 

[Rabbi]

After our private conversation on Jesus, you are free to post it here for all to view. I have nothing to hide.

 

[Gab123]

After our private conversation on Jesus, you are free to post it here for all to view. I have nothing to hide.

I’m not here to convince you of anything. faith is a gift for those who are open to it. i’m Simply pointing out some facts. there are 1000 reasons for those who want to believe, and zero reasons for those who do not want to believe. you will never convince an atheist to believe in God through arguments if he doesn’t want to believe in God…

One has to be open to the truth, if not they will never find it.

 

[KJW5551]

Understand from here on out that we Orthodox Jews have sound reason to reject Jesus. If we didn’t, we’d all be in Church right now. Believe me.

And Muslims, Hindus, etc. also think they have sound reasons to reject Jesus but we think they’re wrong. More importantly we have sound reasons to believe in Jesus and that is why we’re Catholic.

 

[Rabbi]

Gab123, when have I ever called Jesus a liar? Yes, because we can read our Torah in Hebrew, we know exactly why Jesus isn’t the Messiah. Again, we can pm this, I don’t want to step on any toes, that’s not my job. I want to love everyone and respect their beliefs, but if you’re going to challenge me, do it elsewhere (private convo).Yes, the rabbis know Jesus was a great guy, he had potential, but he sadly - and I really mean it - sadly wasn’t the Messiah. Same story with Bar Kochba and Sabbatai Zevi. We all long for that day when there’ll be eternal peace on earth. Yes, some Jews sadly wanted him dead for reasons we’ll never no for sure, but notice how that was SOME. Do rabbis tell us what to believe? Not any more than your Paul. Checkmate. No one can use that excuse. I’ve heard of One For Israel before, their arguments are… let’s just be honest here… very deceptive. I can pound out a million examples in the PM. Maybe some rabbis were corrupted, everyone’s got a few rotten eggs in their baskets, but you can’t hold the whole Talmud accountable. So far, I’ve found no reasonable evidence to suggest our great Chazal spent their days mocking Jesus 24/7.

Yes, the Talmud was written - compiled is a better word - centuries after Jesus. That holds true even for the Mishnah! The problem is that you’re not being fair. We Jews don’t believe we got the Talmud from Sinai. Not a stitch. We believe we got the halacha - known orally - from Sinai. Therefore, and Jesus attests to this himself, we know that our halacha, also taught by Josephus, existed on day one when Moshe stepped down from the mountain. …Um… how many centuries was that before Jesus? You get my point.

And now you move into the Shoah? Elie Wiesel agreed that we shouldn’t blame modern Germans for what was done to us. It is sad that people refer our pain to “the Holocaust card.” Though I didn’t loose any members, I still feel their pain. To you this may be a joke, but to us, to others, even non-Jews who suffered. . . its not joke. We take it very seriously. I find that many Gentiles, who have no connections to the Shoah, find it funny and non-offensive. Dr. Finkelstein suggesting that Yisrael shouldn’t be a modern state is far from true. Did you know that the Arab leaders made a pact with Hitler before WWII to exterminate the Jews in Eretz Yisrael? You had no clue. You also likely have no clue that we offered them peace via a two-state solution about 5-6 times, and they always rejected it. I don’t want to get political, again no stepping on anyone’s toes. Don’t do it again with me.

To state that there is a “Holocaust Industry” is very, very. . . I don’t even have the words to write it. This is the epitome of anti-Semitism.

 

[Rabbi]

You then say “faith is a gift,” as if we Jews don’t have that gift? Yes, faith, in Hebrew: it doesn’t mean blind faith, it means trust. It means you trust your mother not to poison you tonight. It means we trust HaShem. If there are a hundred arguments against Jesus, well, guess why they’re here? Can you convince an atheist to believe? If you have… good arguments. I believe so, though I’ve never tried it.

Again, if you want to debate Jesus on the PM, why not do it? We can’t do it here, it’ll muddy the waters, be too much posts.

 

[Rabbi]

Yes, so true, the Hebrew root-word is “scribe.” But “sefer,” if you know Hebrew, it simply means “book.” In most circles, however, it means books which are non-secular. Not everyone is a scribe, and not all seforim are written on parchment, to answer your question.

 

[Rabbi]

@Psalm62,

You can see my response about Ethiopian Jews having our sacred oral tradition (i.e., the Mishnah), here:

Proof of our Oral Torah! Non-Catholic Religions

Imagine what it would mean if we Orthodox Jews could actually prove our Oral Torah from Sinai? Wouldn’t it be amazing! Well, as it turns out, we can. The following is just a little piece I wrote about a while back concerning the Ethiopian Jews. Enjoy. . . .Imagine, for a moment, what it would mean to the veracity of the Oral Torah, if we found a ritual from its earliest records (the Mishnah) preserved by an isolated community of Jews who left Yisrael over 2,000 some years ago? Could such a thin…

 

[KJW5551]

Again, if you want to debate Jesus on the PM, why not do it? We can’t do it here, it’ll muddy the waters, be too much posts.

Kinda what the forum is for. You and @Gab123 could, if desired, start a new thread for everyone to read.

 

[Rabbi]

Sure, we could do that, I guess. But my arguments would be very, very long, not sure anyone wants to read that, lol! I’d have to use links, can I use them on such forums or not? I never got a good answer. Thanks in advance!

 

[KJW5551]

Long posts are generally frowned upon (see forum rules) but links to external sources are certainly allowed.

 

[Rabbi]

@Roseeurekacross

You asked: “What’s your basis for saying this rather then Jesus was an Essene , Zealot, or simply just a Rabbi.”

To be frank, rabbi and Pharisee basically mean the same thing. Jesus said that the Pharisees “sit in Moses’ seat” (Matthew 23:20).

 

[Rabbi]

So I can post a link to google docs file. Great!

 

[Rabbi]

@Roseeurekacross, on the same token, it is doubtful if Paul was a Pharisee, even though he claimed the title.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

Now you must know I am Jewish on my Grandparents side and Catholic on my grandparents side.
I am a practising Catholic.
There is a school of thought Jesus was very influenced by the Essenes , but not to their engagement in war .
As you will agree it was a very apocalyptic world view, if you were Jewish, in those days.
St Paul was working for the Sadducees in wiping out the Jewish Christian movement. And very zealous about it, although not a zealot.

Jesus was a very devout and strict Jew, observing the feasts, praying in the Synagogues and Temple, all that. But Jesus upset the sadducees by a radical new way of looking at the world and acting on it.

To them and the Romans, Jesus was just another rebel