The Duggars Respond to Reports That Josh Duggar Was Accused of Child Molestation

[kptrs]

First of all, my abuser was a grown *** man. He was my best friend/next door neighbor’s step-dad. He knew what the hell he was doing. He not only molested me, he molested her too. Oh, and since there was no physical evidence, since we were both frightened children (I didn’t even know what “being molested” meant when this happened to me) and didn’t tell until YEARS later they were going to put 12/13 year old girls on the stand in front of that SOB.
13 year olds DO know right from wrong. Kids start going to confession around 7. A 13 year old knows that you don’t touch people in private places. Stop making excuses for your brother. Making excuses for abuse is similar to Stockholm Syndrome, where hostages are empathic to their captors.
I am not going against Christianity when I am touched a certain way my mind goes back to what happened, or even being touched to be woken up puts me in a panic. Because that is what happened, I was woken up as an 8 year old little girl being touched by a man that was like a father to me.
I don’t wish him ill. I don’t want him to burn in hell. I’m not going against Christianity just because it pops in my mind occasionally and it makes me uncomfortable.
It isn’t like I go around talking about it, however, it doesn’t just go away. And no victim should live with their abuser, ever. Like these girls had to do. Their parents knew and just swept it under the rug. Disgusting.
Abuse IS the issue. I wouldn’t have this problem if I wasn’t abused. I have talked to mental health professionals and I go to the psychologist regularly, I have been assured that my feelings are normal and no, we don’t talk about it every time I go, just so you know. It was an abhorrent thing to happen to someone. I didn’t choose this. I didn’t ask for it. I didn’t ruin my damn life.

And you to have the audacity to say that I am wrong and going against Christianity makes me want to come through this computer and show you what “going against Christianity” is. :stretcher:
Forgiveness doesn’t mean the scars go away or your mind forgets it.

I’m so sorry, Kendra. :hug3: My prayers are with you.

 

[Burt_Macklin]

To be honest, I wonder if exposing your children to a media bubble is not a form of abuse in and of itself. I mean, I would have hated it if my parents would have made my growing up to be a reality show for all the world to see.

Now, that is my opinion, is it a nice opinion to have, I am sure some won’t like it. But is it uncharitable? I cannot see how it is.

I would definitely agree that invading your children’s privacy as they grow up amounts to abuse and neglect. All of the innocent children now have this negative publicity that will follow them for decades.

And I can’t imagine the kind of stupidity it takes to pursue a career in media and politics when you have the kind of skeletons in the closet that the Duggars do. I mean, the fans of their show have known about the “sin in the camp” for years and years. Did they not think that the rest of the world would find out?

 

[Walking_Home]

Darryl Revok:

It’s not only that they put their parenting skills on display, but that they measure the parenting abilities and morality of others against their own. Their show is not only a family drama, but a commercial for a way of life, with the requisite sleights against the lifestyles of their moral competitors. In short, they’ve turned their lifestyle into a product.

Sadly, the Quiverfull design is flawed. The IBLP goods are spoiled. As with any shoddy product, catastrophic failure demands scrutiny. When Consumer Reports ruthlessly deconstructs the flaws of a new smartphone that melts or a new car that fails crash ratings, they aren’t being uncharitable.

I completely agree. And I think it’s high time for the destructive product that is Gothardism to be exposed for what it is publicly. There are way too many people being hurt in that cult. Don’t believe me, have a read over at Recovery Grace…or whatever it’s called. These people are harming children in various ways…physically, sexually, spiritually etc. etc.

And the moral advice the Duggars have been selling on their show all these years really needs to be exposed for what it is. The courtship rules, the side-hugs, the constant obsession with purity and sex, the total lack of education for their girls, the fact that their GROWN adult daughters are still living under daddy’s thumb and total authority…they sold these goods as good Christian morals. They are not. They are destructive and are in no way something that we Christians should try to emulate.

And how many times on that show did Michelle give a speech RIGHT IN FRONT OF HER GIRLS about how failures in modesty on the girls part stir up sinful thoughts in a man that he can’t control, defrauding them because they can’t rightfully address them, and it’s HER fault for his lack of control? SHE caused him to sin. SHE is responsible. Over and over and over.
I watched that show since it was on and I don’t remember ONCE a speech about how a man needs to learn how to control himself. Not once.
It needs to be exposed.

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Yes – agree 100%.

 

[LongingSoul]

I am utterly appalled by some of the responses I have been reading here at CA on this topic. As if a teenage boy sexually abusing his sisters/ girls – is just some kind of “passage” they go through to adulthood. It looks like the Church needs to be adding the west/the US alongside those African states.

That’s the real concern I have as well. It’s one thing to note that Josh Duggar was probably a victim of his parents contrived culture and distorted beliefs about sexuality, marriage and family… but at the end of the day, the behaviour is criminal and against one of natures most critical taboos. Not just incest but the sexual abuse of a child. The argument that we accept homosexuals and fornicators so why can’t we be just as tolerant of this… is so ignorant and prideful.

 

[LightBound]

I completely agree. And I think it’s high time for the destructive product that is Gothardism to be exposed for what it is publicly. There are way too many people being hurt in that cult. Don’t believe me, have a read over at Recovery Grace…or whatever it’s called. These people are harming children in various ways…physically, sexually, spiritually etc. etc.

And the moral advice the Duggars have been selling on their show all these years really needs to be exposed for what it is. The courtship rules, the side-hugs, the constant obsession with purity and sex, the total lack of education for their girls, the fact that their GROWN adult daughters are still living under daddy’s thumb and total authority…they sold these goods as good Christian morals. They are not. They are destructive and are in no way something that we Christians should try to emulate.

And how many times on that show did Michelle give a speech RIGHT IN FRONT OF HER GIRLS about how failures in modesty on the girls part stir up sinful thoughts in a man that he can’t control, defrauding them because they can’t rightfully address them, and it’s HER fault for his lack of control? SHE caused him to sin. SHE is responsible. Over and over and over.
I watched that show since it was on and I don’t remember ONCE a speech about how a man needs to learn how to control himself. Not once.
It needs to be exposed.

 

[RACJ]

You must not read the threads on politics where all sorts of weird stuff is believed about Democratic politicians and anyone that doesn’t agree with the right-wing viewpoint is a Democrat making excuses for their vote.

You don’t have to agree with “right-wing” (whatever that means) opinions to accept the fact that a vote for the Democrat party is a vote for abortion-on-demand for all 40 weeks of pregnancy with decent American taxpayers subsidizing them. Some Republicans believe in this as well, and I never vote for them, EVEN if I agree with them on all other issues.

 

[estesbob]

Who here has claimed that Josh is still molesting children. After all, it would be highly uncharitable of you to make the claim without backing it up.

757=is the latest example.

 

[didymus]

One thing I’ve noticed about threads concerning exposure of sexual misconduct is that if the perp is “one of ours”, i.e., Christian responses are all about the media is trying to discredit Christians, we should forgive, blah, blah. If it’s not a Christian, their sin is due to their secular lifestyle & nothing they’ve ever done in their life counts and Hell is too good for them.

Anyone can be a child molester, religious or not, Democrat or Republican, young or old. As for the fact that Josh Duggar was 13/14 when he did this, the Church considers the age of reason (able to tell right from wrong) to be eight. Many states try 14 year-olds as adults for serious offenses like rape and murder.
So his age cuts no age cuts no ice as far as I’m concerned especially since he had the advantage of growing up with two parents who taught him right from wrong.

As far as forgiveness, that’s up to his victims, not us. Some of those nearest and dearest to me have been victims of molestation. I don’t believe anybody does it just once. Yeah, yeah, “studies have shown” that molesters have a low recidivism rate. That’s nice. I still don’t want them (including Josh Duggar) around my kids.

Lastly, I don’t know if he disclosed his past to the Family Resource Council but if he didn’t that was totally dishonest and a terrible disservice to the organization.

 

[masondoggy]

youtube.com/watch?v=U4NzmVEFPrY&feature=youtu.be&t=50m25s

49:00 mark…THIS is the message these people have been drilling into their daughters heads over and over and over, KNOWING that they were victims of sexual assault.
THEIR fault. That poor neighbor that had to watch her mow in a bikini, not HIS fault. HER fault.

This is what they call counseling a sexual assault victim.

 

[stinkcat_14]

757=is the latest example.

Except of course, the poster there does not claim that Josh is still molesting people. He says that Josh still could be molesting people. Those are two very different claims. Josh ruined his reputation because of his behavior. If someone says that they don’t trust him, that does not represent a lack of charity, but that individual’s prudential judgement.

 

[Walking_Home]

youtube.com/watch?v=U4NzmVEFPrY&feature=youtu.be&t=50m25s

49:00 mark…THIS is the message these people have been drilling into their daughters heads over and over and over, KNOWING that they were victims of sexual assault.
THEIR fault. That poor neighbor that had to watch her mow in a bikini, not HIS fault. HER fault.

This is what they call counseling a sexual assault victim.

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The more I read/learn about the quiverfull/Dugger/IBLP “culture” – it not only leaves the door wide open for predatory behavior from men – but it plants it in their heads.

 

[masondoggy]

---

The more I read/learn about the quiverfull/Dugger/IBLP “culture” – it not only leaves the door wide open for predatory behavior from men – but it plants it in their heads.

I agree. It’s no wonder sexual abuse is so rampant in that culture.

 

[masondoggy]

Btw, according to the freejinger forums, there may have been some court -ordered counseling involved after that police report was made. Apparently there was a a case in court about a “family in need of services” involving the Duggars.

No proof, but I guess it can at least give us hope that Josh and these girls actually DID receive appropriate therapy because the court made them get it. Not because the parents sought it out, but because it was ordered by the court.

 

[kptrs]

Hoosier Daddy;12991170:

I agree.
And I could also caution the other posters that sometimes we say things so glibly because we are further along the walk in healing than others are. It may not be our intention but our words can hurt and bring back hurtful memories for other people.
We can never truly understand someone’s response unless we have been in their shoes. I have seen too many friends who walked away from the church never to return because of how we treat them when they are going through these issues. Yes it is all good and well to encourage healing but how you do it matters.
As christians, of course we champion forgiveness and mercy. We should however, temper it with giving the victims time to heal. Sexual abuse is a very heavy cross to bear and we have to remember that the way we treat victims and perpetrators is going to affect whether someone comes forward early to report what happens to them.
Yes, Josh Duggar will be publicly shamed. Should we tell him to “move on” just like we are telling Kendra and many others to move on. By the way who gets to decide when “moving on” occurs for the victim - the victim, the perpretrator or society?

Yes, yes, and yes.

 

[Crossbones]

757=is the latest example.

On the other hand, people are awfully uncharitable in political posts and you don’t seem to care there. Why do you care so much here?

 

[meltzerboy]

I agree. It’s no wonder sexual abuse is so rampant in that culture.

Bear in mind, however, that sexual abuse happens in nearly every culture, and sometimes, I would think, remains unreported.

We should be careful to neither excuse Josh Duggar’s behavior because he is “one of us,” nor indict him because he is “the other,” with regard to religion, politics, ethnicity, or social status. As I noted before, this is mainly a human drama in which punishment may be needed but not in the form of vindictiveness. Forgiveness, according to my faith’s beliefs, is something that primarily belongs to the victims of the crime, not to outsiders such as all of us, while repentance belongs to the perpetrator of the crime.

 

[Memaw]

I can’t understand this mentality at all. Yes, teenagers are immature, and no-one is perfect. But molesting five young girls, including siblings? I’m sorry, but that is not the actions of an immature teenager. An immature teenager skips school, tries smoking or alcohol, considers themselves above their parents.

I agree with ToeInTheWater - when does a teenager become responsible for his actions? If a teenager skips school, tries smoking or alcohol, they are responsible for that. So why does a teenager who molests five young children get given a free pass on the basis of his maturity level?

Quite frankly, the thing that I am appalled by the most is the amount of people willing to make up excuses for Josh Duggar because of his age at the time. Immature or not, this is not a valid reason for molesting young children.

Lou

I don’t think anyone is “making excuses” for him but he has repented and did go to counseling and has completely turned his life around and good gosh, what more do you expect? We as Catholics should understand forgiveness better than that. If we aired everyone’s dirty linen, I am afraid we’d be very shocked by some of it. Should we crucify him??? Basically that’s what they are trying to do. Would that make some people happy ? Let’s not cast any stones for fear they may one day be returned to us. God Bless, Memaw

 

[Walking_Home]

masondoggy:

Walking_Home:

The more I read/learn about the quiverfull/Dugger/IBLP “culture” – it not only leaves the door wide open for predatory behavior from men – but it plants it in their heads.

I agree. It’s no wonder sexual abuse is so rampant in that culture.

---

Yes – what happens within the said “culture(s)” – has come out into the open – and now being taken notice:

Russell Moore is president of the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission of the Southern Baptist Convention,

News reports are filled with stories and analysis about Josh Duggar, the reality television star-turned-conservative activist, who is alleged to have committed sexually abusive acts against young girls when he was a teenager. Duggar has admitted that he “acted inexcusably” and has resigned from his position at a pro-family political organization. Meanwhile, TLC network has reportedly pulled the Duggar family reality show, 19 Kids and Counting, from the air while they determine the future of the show. This is after TLC cancelled Here Comes Honey Boo Boo because the show’s mother, “Mama June” is dating a registered sex offender. The controversy here is, sadly, yet another reminder to the church of our responsibility to be a witness for justice and righteousness on the issue of sexual abuse.

I’m not interested in litigating the specifics of this case—the civil authorities and the relevant employers are now alerted to the situation. I’m more concerned that we see that this story is one more in what has been an endless cycle of stories of sexual abuse in “churched” contexts. We cannot assume that we can avoid this topic simply by making sure our doctrines are right, our values conservative, and our people sheltered from the world. If we are not addressing this issue, it is only because we are ignoring what is going on in our communities, and all too often in our pews. This requires that churches come with conviction to this question preemptively, before any specific situation arises, with a word from God.

The first step is to recognize that sexual abuse is not merely sexual immorality. Sexual immorality, any sexual contact outside the bounds of covenantal marriage, is sin and comes under the just condemnation of God’s law. Immorality is a matter of a sin against God and, usually, sin against others—a spouse, the other party, and so forth. Immorality, by itself, is dealt with in terms of a call to repentance and the sort of discipleship it takes to overcome sinful patterns by the power of the Spirit and, where possible, to restore broken relationships.

Sexual abuse is immoral, but it is far more than just sexual. Sexual abuse is an act of violence, in which one leverages power to sexually violate the helpless. The resulting aftermath is not just a guilty conscience awaiting judgment on the part of the perpetrator, but a victim who has been assaulted. Sexual abuse is not just a sin but also a crime, not just a matter of personal unrighteousness on the part of the perpetrator but also a matter of public injustice.

This means that sexual abuse in the context of the church must be handled in terms of both authorities responsible—both the church and the state. The state has been given the sword of justice to wield against those who commit crimes (Rom. 13:1-7). The church has no such sword (Matt. 26:51-53). This means that the immediate response to allegations of sexual abuse is to call the civil authorities, to render unto Caesar the responsibility that belongs to Caesar to investigate the crime. The church may or may not know the truth of the allegations, but it is the God-ordained prerogative of the civil authorities to discover such matters and to prosecute accordingly. When faced with a question of potential sexual abuse, call the authorities without delay.

continued:

 

[Walking_Home]

The church’s role is not to replace the police power of the state, but to deal with the spiritual issues involved. Excommunication is no replacement for incarceration. The sins and crimes here involve two different spheres, and both should be engaged in stopping such. If an offender is a member of a congregation, the church must investigate the situation and follow through with biblical discipline but this does not replace the responsibility to alert the civil authorities. The church can speak to the soul of the offender and to the outside world about how seriously the church takes the horrific evil of sexual abuse, but the church cannot restrain evil through coercive power; only the civil realm can do that. If the church does not cooperate with the law, and with the police power of the law, in protecting the vulnerable, the church is in defiance against the ordinances of God himself.

The church has a responsibility, beyond alerting proper authority, in several areas. The first is to preach and teach on issues of sexual abuse. Many abused people hide in the shadows because they believe, sometimes even subliminally, that they were somehow at fault for their abuse. Sometimes abused people are fearful to come forward because they think that people within the church will think they are now “damaged” because of the abuse. The church’s witness should be clear that victims of sexual abuse are not to blame—nor are they defined by the atrocities committed against them. You may think that such truths are obvious, but they need to be said if we are to offer freedom for the captives, as Jesus did (Lk. 4:18). One of the chief ways people are held in captivity is through misplaced shame, for what has been done to them.

We should also make clear to the whole congregation the steps we are taking to make sure that children and the vulnerable are safe in our churches from sexual abuse. Tell the congregation why you have background checks, why safeguards for parent pick-up in nursery or Sunday school are in place, and so forth. Moreover, tell the congregation what the leaders will do when there is an allegation of sexual abuse. Make it clear that sexual abusers will not be enabled in your church, and victims will not be blamed or shamed.

We must maintain this witness until sexual abuse is not only gone from reality television, but, more importantly, gone from reality altogether.

russellmoore.com/2015/05/22/what-should-the-duggar-scandal-teach-the-church/

 

[Gordon_Sims]

This is a gross misinterpretation of the police report. Jim Bob Dugger sent his son over 200 miles away so he could go through a Christian Ministry program where he believed his son received counseling and hard labor.

Jim Bob couldn’t even provide a name of where they sent him. Michelle contradicted him. Again, from the actual police report:

Det. Hignite then asked Mrs. Duggar about the training center they sent _____ to. She said it was not really a training center. Det. Hignite asked if the guy _____ talked to was a certified Counselor. She said no. She said it was a guy they know in Little Rock that is remodeling a building. Det. Hignite asked if the guy was more of a mentor. She said kind of.

I’ve read the whole report a few times now. I’ll state again that it’s full of red flags (you know, on top of the actual admissions and remembrances of Josh molesting his sisters). I’ll also state again that I think a lot of people on here are clueless when it comes to child sexual abuse which, considering what’s happened in the Church, is inexcusable for Catholics.

Child sexual abuse is not the same as other crimes. It’s not a “one and done” type crime. It doesn’t stop because someone says they’re sorry. The effects don’t go away because someone says they’re sorry. It doesn’t occur in a vacuum. If it’s not stopped and treated properly, it typically doesn’t stop. It’s often a generational thing, meaning that there’s a good likelihood Josh was molested, that without proper treatment he’ll do it again, and that his victims all are at an increased risk of becoming offenders themselves.

To be absolutely clear, none of what I’m saying is uncharitable or un-Christian in any way. This is one of those crimes that aren’t like other crimes. It’s tragic, its effects are wide ranging and it can be “passed on” ensuring more perpetrators and victims. The responsible thing for the Duggars to have done would have been to have gone to the authorities, gotten Josh out of the house and then not bring him back until they’d gotten him legitimate, professional, certified counseling, and gotten the same for the girls. From the facts provided, there’s no good reason to believe any of that happened. Without proper handling of his prolonged, repeated abuse of multiple victims, there’s no reason to believe that he’s not at risk of re-offending.

I think I should also point out that none of what I’ve said is an indictment of or criticism of Josh. He absolutely needed (and likely still does) competent professional help. If he was abused himself (speculation, but based on the nature and breadth of his crimes, likely) then he was also a victim. That in no way excuses his behavior. But even if he wasn’t, four months of handyman work isn’t counseling or therapy. For the sake of him, his wife, his victims and his daughters, he needs a clean bill of mental health. Suggesting that him confessing his sins somehow makes up for that is ignorant, irresponsible and wrong.