The God of Islam

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AlphaOmega

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I’m very interested in the opinion of Catholics on Islam. What does the Catholic Church teach about this religion? What is the popular opinion from a Catholic’s perspective concerning the God of Islam?
I’m having a hard time realizing whether this religion is from the spirit below or above. Even a hard core non-Catholic Christian believes differently from me in the strictest term. That it is not the God of Christianity.
Can it be that God is also a God of the Islamic faith under a different name? Does God make use of their devotion and worship?
What about the Qu’ran?
Please help.
 
AlphaOmega said:
I’m very interested in the opinion of Catholics on Islam. What does the Catholic Church teach about this religion? What is the popular opinion from a Catholic’s perspective concerning the God of Islam?
I’m having a hard time realizing whether this religion is from the spirit below or above. Even a hard core non-Catholic Christian believes differently from me in the strictest term. That it is not the God of Christianity.
Can it be that God is also a God of the Islamic faith under a different name? Does God make use of their devotion and worship?
What about the Qu’ran?
Please help.
Click to expand...
They worship the same God but have different attitudes about how He will treat us and our relationship with Him.
 
Hi Alpha,

Here is what the Catechism of the Catholic Church says about Muslims :
**841 **The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.
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This means that sincere Muslims can be saved.

As for the belief of the Muslims relative to God, “Allah” is simply the Arabic word for God. (I personally find it inelegant to use “Allah”, as if it were some wild desert god.) Belîeving in the same God does not mean that we believe the same things *about *God.Whoever believes in God, who is a person and creator of all things and distinct from all things believes in the same God that we do.

For example, we believe that God is one nature in three persons. The Muslims do not believe this. Neither do the Jews. Abraham did not know about this either, nor did anyone before Christ. But they believed in the same God that we do.

Does this answer all your concerns?

Verbum
 
Verbum said:
Hi Alpha,

Here is what the Catechism of the Catholic Church says about Muslims :

This means that sincere Muslims can be saved.

As for the belief of the Muslims relative to God, “Allah” is simply the Arabic word for God. (I personally find it inelegant to use “Allah”, as if it were some wild desert god.) Belîeving in the same God does not mean that we believe the same things *about *God.Whoever believes in God, who is a person and creator of all things and distinct from all things believes in the same God that we do.

For example, we believe that God is one nature in three persons. The Muslims do not believe this. Neither do the Jews. Abraham did not know about this either, nor did anyone before Christ. But they believed in the same God that we do.

Does this answer all your concerns?

Verbum
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I found it very enlightening. I always thought we didn’t like them. But whatabout the crusades? And isn’t it in their religion to kill everyone who isn’t muslim?
 
Hi Brooklyn,

I found it very enlightening. I always thought we didn’t like them. But what about the crusades? And isn’t it in their religion to kill everyone who isn’t muslim?

The Crusades happened a thousand years ago when mentalities were very different from that of today. Christians thought it unfair that the Holy Land should be in the hands of Muslims. So they thought that they were doing the right thing Today, of course we would not support such endeavors. Additionally, we must remember that the ideal of the Crusades was often trampled by unworthy Christians whose aim was to enrich themselves at the expense of the local populations. They even sacked the city of Constantinople, which was inhabited by Christians.

It is not part of Islam to kill non-Muslims. The Muslims occupied Spain or parts of it for 700 years, and although Christians were more heavily taxed than others, the Catholic religion was allowed to continue.

Do you have any more questions?

Verbum
 
Verbum said:
Hi Brooklyn,

I found it very enlightening. I always thought we didn’t like them. But what about the crusades? And isn’t it in their religion to kill everyone who isn’t muslim?

It is not part of Islam to kill non-Muslims. The Muslims occupied Spain or parts of it for 700 years, and although Christians were more heavily taxed than others, the Catholic religion was allowed to continue.

Do you have any more questions?

Verbum
Click to expand...
I get the crusades, but if it’s not in their religion to kill non-muslims, how come they keep bombing us? Is it just certain crazy muslims?
 
BrooklynBoy200 said:
I get the crusades, but if it’s not in their religion to kill non-muslims, how come they keep bombing us? Is it just certain crazy muslims?
Click to expand...
Pretty much. They do have a rule that says they must defend their religion if attacked. The fundies claim America is attacking their religion with their msgs, Israel, greed etc. They are basically twisting a law to fit their purposes.
 
AlphaOmega said:
I’m very interested in the opinion of Catholics on Islam. What does the Catholic Church teach about this religion? What is the popular opinion from a Catholic’s perspective concerning the God of Islam?
I’m having a hard time realizing whether this religion is from the spirit below or above. Even a hard core non-Catholic Christian believes differently from me in the strictest term. That it is not the God of Christianity.
Can it be that God is also a God of the Islamic faith under a different name? Does God make use of their devotion and worship?
What about the Qu’ran?
Please help.
Click to expand...
Go to the thread Islam 101…
 
The greatest insult to anyone of you here is to have someone telling others in YOUR NAME to commit acts of atrocities and shame. And God is certainly no exception. Catechism or otherwise, its irrelevant.

Can I today inform everyone here that I met God who told me to have sex with 9 year old girls? To first speak for the demon and then turn around to tell you that God forgave me being a spokesman for the devil and then claim I am the greatest prophet? That I have been certified legitimate in murdering thousands and raping their wives? That God told me that the sun sets in a muddy spring? That God told me that Jesus is ONLY a prophet?

Please, we have more sense than that. As Catholics, we cannot and should not accept anything contrary to what God has laid down. Remember, trust in God, not in man.

Islam denies the deity of Jesus. And this ALONE warrants them to be labelled as anti-christ.

1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

NOW WHICH OF YOU FELLOW CATHOLICS IS SAYING THAT ALLAH IS THE SAME GOD AS THE CHRISTIANS? PLEASE BEG FOR MERCY FROM YOUR LOCAL PRIESTS FOR ACKNOWLEDING THE DEVIL AS YOUR FATHER.
 
Islam’s allah is NOT God. It is the devil in disguise. This is not a false accusation. And even without going into the teachings of the bible where it clearly classifies islam as demonic, we christians should be able to see this very clearly from the huge contrasts in the teachings. The islamic q’uran builds itself upon the wonders and miracles of the God-of-the-Jews and claim them as their own. But is this the truth?

Now…Allah NEVER spoke to Moses. Why?
  1. The Jewish God loves His people the Jews with everlasting love, but Allah can’t wait to kill them all.
  • Bible – Isai 54:8 8 In a surge of anger I hid My face from you for a moment,
    but I will have compassion on you with everlasting love,"says the Lord your Redeemer.
  • Qur’an – Sur 5:51 “Believers, take not Jews and Christians for your friends.” Hadith : The Hour [Resurrection] will not take place until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them. And the Jews will hide behind the rock and tree, and the rock and tree will say: oh Muslim, oh servant of Allah, this is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!
  1. The Jewish God strictly forbids His people from taking blood. But Allah praises even blood-sucking insects, like mosquitoes! And we all know that mosquitoes hate lights just like muslims hate the truth.
  • Bible - Ge 9:4 - But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.
  • Quran - Sur 2:26 - Allah does not shy away from citing any kind of allegory,* from the tiny mosquito and greater. As for those who believe, they know that it is the truth from their Lord.
  1. The Jewish God appeared personally to Moses in a burning bush during the day and descended as a dove on Christ in full view of the public. But Allah’s ‘gabriel’ appeared in the dark in the Hira cave alone (without witnesses) with Muhammad who later freaked out in pain (according to hadiths).
  • Bible - Ex 3:2 - And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
  • Wikipedia - Hira or the Cave of Hira is the location where Muhammad, according to Islam, received his first revelations from Allah (God).
  1. God hates divorce and re-marriages and finds it disgusting, but allah thinks its great!
  • Deuteronomy 24 Moses says: 4 Since she has slept with her second husband, she cannot marry her first husband again. Their marriage would pollute the land that the LORD your God is giving you, and he would be disgusted.
  • Bukhari Volume 7, Book 63, Number 187: Narrated 'Aisha: A man divorced his wife thrice (by expressing his decision to divorce her thrice), then she married another man who also divorced her. The Prophet was asked if she could legally marry the first husband (or not). The Prophet replied, “No, she cannot marry the first husband unless the second husband consummates his marriage with her, just as the first husband had done.”
It is extremely clear then that Allah NEVER spoke to Moses because the God that spoke to Moses is CERTAINLY NOT Allah. And certainly, Muhammad who was unable to prophesy nor perform great miracles and did not leave behind a history of good conduct cannot be a prophet. And there are certainly better prophets, some even brought straight up to heaven (Enoch) or buried by God (Moses), and one greatest returning in the 2nd coming (Jesus)…

The crux of the matter really is: If Allah is NOT the God that brought the Jews out of Egypt, then the Quran (which says that the sun sets in a muddy spring!) is nothing but **** because allah had built the quran around the victories of the God-of-the Jews talking so much about what allah had done in Egypt for the Jews etc etc… In which case, the entire religion is in question because Muhammad (who openly admitted he was a speaker for the demon speaking to the Quayrish tribe) would certainly not be a prophet of God and the entire observation of kosher diet by the muslims would be a waste of time. All the promises in the quran would just sizzle down to just emptiness.
 
pumpqeen said:
Islam’s allah is NOT God. It is the devil in disguise. This is not a false accusation. And even without going into the teachings of the bible where it clearly classifies islam as demonic, we christians should be able to see this very clearly from the huge contrasts in the teachings. The islamic q’uran builds itself upon the wonders and miracles of the God-of-the-Jews and claim them as their own. But is this the truth?

Now…Allah NEVER spoke to Moses. Why?
  1. The Jewish God loves His people the Jews with everlasting love, but Allah can’t wait to kill them all.
  • Bible – Isai 54:8 8 In a surge of anger I hid My face from you for a moment,
    but I will have compassion on you with everlasting love,"says the Lord your Redeemer.
  • Qur’an – Sur 5:51 “Believers, take not Jews and Christians for your friends.” Hadith : The Hour [Resurrection] will not take place until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them. And the Jews will hide behind the rock and tree, and the rock and tree will say: oh Muslim, oh servant of Allah, this is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!
  1. The Jewish God strictly forbids His people from taking blood. But Allah praises even blood-sucking insects, like mosquitoes! And we all know that mosquitoes hate lights just like muslims hate the truth.
  • Bible - Ge 9:4 - But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.
  • Quran - Sur 2:26 - Allah does not shy away from citing any kind of allegory,* from the tiny mosquito and greater. As for those who believe, they know that it is the truth from their Lord.
  1. The Jewish God appeared personally to Moses in a burning bush during the day and descended as a dove on Christ in full view of the public. But Allah’s ‘gabriel’ appeared in the dark in the Hira cave alone (without witnesses) with Muhammad who later freaked out in pain (according to hadiths).
  • Bible - Ex 3:2 - And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
  • Wikipedia - Hira or the Cave of Hira is the location where Muhammad, according to Islam, received his first revelations from Allah (God).
  1. God hates divorce and re-marriages and finds it disgusting, but allah thinks its great!
  • Deuteronomy 24 Moses says: 4 Since she has slept with her second husband, she cannot marry her first husband again. Their marriage would pollute the land that the LORD your God is giving you, and he would be disgusted.
  • Bukhari Volume 7, Book 63, Number 187: Narrated 'Aisha: A man divorced his wife thrice (by expressing his decision to divorce her thrice), then she married another man who also divorced her. The Prophet was asked if she could legally marry the first husband (or not). The Prophet replied, “No, she cannot marry the first husband unless the second husband consummates his marriage with her, just as the first husband had done.”
It is extremely clear then that Allah NEVER spoke to Moses because the God that spoke to Moses is CERTAINLY NOT Allah. And certainly, Muhammad who was unable to prophesy nor perform great miracles and did not leave behind a history of good conduct cannot be a prophet. And there are certainly better prophets, some even brought straight up to heaven (Enoch) or buried by God (Moses), and one greatest returning in the 2nd coming (Jesus)…

The crux of the matter really is: If Allah is NOT the God that brought the Jews out of Egypt, then the Quran (which says that the sun sets in a muddy spring!) is nothing but **** because allah had built the quran around the victories of the God-of-the Jews talking so much about what allah had done in Egypt for the Jews etc etc… In which case, the entire religion is in question because Muhammad (who openly admitted he was a speaker for the demon speaking to the Quayrish tribe) would certainly not be a prophet of God and the entire observation of kosher diet by the muslims would be a waste of time. All the promises in the quran would just sizzle down to just emptiness.
Click to expand...
:amen:
 
Verbum said:
… “Allah” is simply the Arabic word for God. (I personally find it inelegant to use “Allah”, as if it were some wild desert god.) …
Click to expand...
“Allah” is not the Arabic word for God, but rather is a name for God; Like “Yahweh” is a name for God. (Admittedly, “Allah” is not biblical.)

My Arabic-speaking Christian parents use the name “Allah” all the time. But it is the muslims who made this name popular.
pumpqeen said:
… NOW WHICH OF YOU FELLOW CATHOLICS IS SAYING THAT ALLAH IS THE SAME GOD AS THE CHRISTIANS? …
Click to expand...
Well, me. And the Pope.

Muslims believe that the God of Abraham is the one and only true God, The Creator. But it falls down after that. Muslims don’t understand Him like the way we do, and so they worship him differently (and I’m not suggesting correctly).

P.S. Catholics don’t agree that the Qur’an is God inspired scripture.
 
To confirm and embillish pumpqueen’s post:

Islam is the opposite of Christianity. Islam is specifically antichrist:

From the Koran: “The Jews call 'Uzair a son of God, and the Christians call Christ the Son of God. That is a saying from their mouth; (In this) they but imitate what the Unbelievers of old used to say. **God’s curse be on themhow they are deluded away from the Truth! **: Surah 9.30”

Founding verses of the Dome of the Rock:
“O you People of the Book, overstep not bounds in your religion, and of God speak only the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, is only an apostle of God, and his Word which he conveyed unto Mary, and a Spirit proceeding from him. Believe therefore in God and his apostles, and say not Three. It will be better for you. God is only one God. Far be it from his glory that he should have a son.”

If these aren’t the words of a beautiful, smooth tongued and angry seducer that was cast out of Heaven…

Much of the Church can’t see that there are a billion and a half antichrists in Islam alone, because they are looking for some future boogeyman.
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=118140

Additionally the term Allah Akbar, for example means “God is greatest”. There seems to be considerable archeological evidence that the name Allah came from the moon god idol that was worshipped in Mecca. search.yahoo.com/search?p=allah+moon+god+idol&fr=yfp-t-501&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8 Mohammed selected from among some 360 idols of which the moon god was considered the most powerful.

Mohammed had trouble convincing worshippers that they should worship one God (his own uncle went to his grave still maintaining the idol that was in his care - so Mohammed created his own special level of hell for him in the Quran.).

In th first 13 years Mohammed was able to convert less than 100 followers. Then he picked up the sword. The sword is Islamic fundamentalism.

Now if the expression Allah Akbar above did not apply to multiple deities then perhaps it applies to their god being greater than the Christian’s and Jew’s God - Yahweh. So they can hardly argue that it is the same God.

Islam is the leopard-bear-lion beast of Revelation 13. The dragon gives it it’s seat, power and authority. Islam is the religion of Satan. They murder hundreds of saints around the world every day - TODAY. 2 million dead in the Sudan alone.

A free book written by a Nigerian that was raised Muslim that is now a Christian evangelist in Nigeria, trying to stay 2 steps ahead of the beheading knife, puts a lot of this in perspective. Bible vs Quran, Christianity vs Islam. The assumed name is M. Ali and the book is an absolutely free PDF available here (once it loads you have to scroll a little): ellisskolfield.com/pdf/IslamReviewed.pdf

I believe it is criminal of Christians to suggest to Muslims that their antichrist god is the same as our God. It is absurd. All this touchy feely stuff is likely doing is helping them down the road to perdition.

Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
 
Charlie Zeaiter,

Islam denies the deity of Jesus and denies that Jesus is the son of God.

1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

So, You have made your wish to stand against God and embracing the devil. It doesn’t matter what I think.
 
I’ve also wondered why many Catholics have pushed for ecumenism so much, as to say that “Muslims worship the same God as we do, just a different perspective.” It’s sad. If they did, what’s the point of Christ dying for EVERYONE’s sins, if they are allowed access to Heaven by not being a part of the Church.

Moreover, what’s the point of Evangelizing to Jews or Muslims, if they worship the same God? How soon will it be until Catholics say that Buddhists, and Hindus worship the same God?

Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus.(hope that’s right)

In Pax Christi
Andrew
 
pumpqeen said:
Charlie Zeaiter,

Islam denies the deity of Jesus and denies that Jesus is the son of God.

1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

So, You have made your wish to stand against God and embracing the devil. It doesn’t matter what I think.
Click to expand...
It is sad when Church doctrine trumps the truth of God’s Holy Word. But there was no shortage of that even as John wrote. After all, what’s all the "overcommeth"ing about in Rev Chapter 2?

Seems to me like the Catholic Church caved in to Islam out of fear of persecution. I was saddened to see the Pope have an opportunity to stand up for Jesus, and instead it seemed he hedged.
 
JohnWilliams said:
To confirm and embillish pumpqueen’s post:

Islam is the opposite of Christianity. Islam is specifically antichrist:

From the Koran: “The Jews call 'Uzair a son of God, and the Christians call Christ the Son of God. That is a saying from their mouth; (In this) they but imitate what the Unbelievers of old used to say. **God’s curse be on themhow they are deluded away from the Truth! **: Surah 9.30”

Founding verses of the Dome of the Rock:
“O you People of the Book, overstep not bounds in your religion, and of God speak only the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, is only an apostle of God, and his Word which he conveyed unto Mary, and a Spirit proceeding from him. Believe therefore in God and his apostles, and say not Three. It will be better for you. God is only one God. Far be it from his glory that he should have a son.”

If these aren’t the words of a beautiful, smooth tongued and angry seducer that was cast out of Heaven…

Much of the Church can’t see that there are a billion and a half antichrists in Islam alone, because they are looking for some future boogeyman.
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=118140

Additionally the term Allah Akbar, for example means “God is greatest”. There seems to be considerable archeological evidence that the name Allah came from the moon god idol that was worshipped in Mecca. search.yahoo.com/search?p=allah+moon+god+idol&fr=yfp-t-501&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8 Mohammed selected from among some 360 idols of which the moon god was considered the most powerful.

Mohammed had trouble convincing worshippers that they should worship one God (his own uncle went to his grave still maintaining the idol that was in his care - so Mohammed created his own special level of hell for him in the Quran.).

In th first 13 years Mohammed was able to convert less than 100 followers. Then he picked up the sword. The sword is Islamic fundamentalism.

Now if the expression Allah Akbar above did not apply to multiple deities then perhaps it applies to their god being greater than the Christian’s and Jew’s God - Yahweh. So they can hardly argue that it is the same God.

Islam is likely the leopard-bear-lion beast of Revelation 13. The dragon gives it it’s seat, power and authority. Islam is the religion of Satan. They murder hundreds of saints around the world every day - TODAY. 2 million dead in the Sudan alone.

A free book written by a Nigerian that was raised Muslim that is now a Christian evangelist in Nigeria, trying to stay 2 steps ahead of the beheading knife, puts a lot of this in perspective. Bible vs Quran, Christianity vs Islam. The assumed name is M. Ali and the book is an absolutely free PDF available here (once it loads you have to scroll a little): ellisskolfield.com/pdf/IslamReviewed.pdf

I believe it is criminal of Christians to suggest to Muslims that their antichrist god is the same as our God. It is absurd. All this touchy feely stuff is likely doing is helping them down the road to perdition.

Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Click to expand...
 
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