The Luminous Mysteries

[Jguerra]

Yes, although I find it difficult to visualise the third mystery, the proclamation, as one event, compared to the other four. Any ideas?

I read the selections for daily Mass before I hit the road and pray the rosary. When I come to the 3rd luminous mystery, I often find myself meditating on the content of the day’s Gospel. This Easter season, during the 3rd luminous mystery I am in Paul and Barnabas shoes on their missionary journey proclaiming the good news of the risen Christ.

As in another post about the same topic, I find this particular luminous mystery dynamic in that it always has a new segment of the Bible for me to consider.

Joe

 

[SpiritusSanctus]

Who cares?

The Rosary is a private Devotion. If you’re praying solo, pray any way you want. If you’re leading a group, pray any way you can get away with. If you’re new to a group, you may be best served by asking a few questions on the front end. Want to sub the Nicene Creed for the Apostles Creed? Want the Confiteor next? Want to do the whole thing in Inuit vernacular? Want St. Michael’s Chaplet at the end? Want to do 15 decades at one time? Make your best deal before you hear the Signum Crucis and stick to it. There’s no need to be so high-maintenance about it.

Most folks who pray the Rosary do so because they love the BVM and they love the prayers. Groups that wish to expand in number may be open to slight modifications to their routine. Few will want to be “schooled” by some recent convert with an ax to grind. If you think you’re being dragged down or robbed of your indulgences by praying in unison with faithful Catholics, you have several options.

Pray the Rosary any way I want to? That almost makes it sound like I’m creating my own form of worship. I worship God the way He wants to be worshiped. Saying the Rosary any way I want to isn’t worshiping God the right way. And who cares? That comes off as saying who cares what Our Lady wants. I’m not saying you said that but that is what it sounds like. I’m not going to change the Rosary in any way just because I’m saying it in private.

 

[blackrobe]

I do not say the Luminous Mysteries because I got tired of JPII messing with tradition. If the request had come from Mary, as did the Fatima prayer, then I would say them. As it is, there is no requirement to say them; therefore I won’t as long as I have a choice.

Every tradition has a beginning.

 

[po18guy]

Every tradition has a beginning.

The request of our Holy Mother is certainly a wonderful justification. She relayed that via a private revelation to a human. So do we then exclude the Holy Spirit from inspiring Pope John Paul II?

I guess that I should not be surprised that additional Rosary Mysteries would be controversial.

 

[WFS5801]

WFS5801, I say stubborn because on another thread a very long time ago - on this same subject - posters were adamant about not including the Luminous Mysteries in their Rosary because they considered only the Psalter the “traditional” Rosary. Some objected to the Fatima Prayer, even though that was requested by our Blessed Virgin. That is stubborn.

Now, there is another target - Our Holy Father John Paul II.

Of course the Luminous Mysteries are “suggestions” and not required, but the Rosary itself is not required.

What I don’t understand is the objection to adding another beautiful Mystery to the Rosary.

Explain that to me. And being sarcastic about the words of our Holy Father’s Apostolic Letter does not cut it for me.

:knight1:

I wasn’t being sarcastic by saying the Luminous Mysteries were a suggestion, not a requirement. I was making the point that there was nothing binding in this suggestion. I’ve already given my major reasons for rejecting the Luminous Mysteries in the Rosary – that there are traditionally 150 Hail Mary’s as in the Psalter, and Mary specifically compared the Rosary to the Psalter – and that the traditional mysteries fit in with the Church’s Calendar. I’ve also always considered Saturday Mary’s special day, and I like the fact that the Glorious Mysteries always fall on Saturday when the Rosary is prayed in the traditional way. As you say the Rosary is not required – though I can’t understand any Catholic would not pray it – and my reasons for praying it the way I do are very personal. There seems to be a bit of intolerance in some here against the traditional way of praying the Rosary. Not quite sure why.

 

[WFS5801]

The second issue is whether or not Mary, if she did give the Rosary to St Dominic, intended it to be exclusively set with only 15 mysteries. Given that it is a private devotion and not a liturgy of the Church, it would seem strange that a devotion could or would be so tightly limited that it could not include other mysteries.

I see no reason to question St. Dominic’s account of how he received the Rosary – or the fact that he often called it “her Angelic Psalter.”

 

[mullenpm]

The Decade Prayer (also known as the Fatima Prayer) was revealed by Our Lady on July 13, 1917 (3rd apparition). She asked the three shepherd children to recite it at the end of each decade of the rosary. It was approved for public use in 1930.

There is no intolerance toward Catholics praying the Rosary in the “traditional” way - but I feel that the objection to the Luminous Mysteries is not so much praying the Rosary in the so-called traditional way as an annoyance with Our Holy Father John Paul II for daring to suggest the new Mysteries. Catholics being so resentful at Our Holy Father astounds me.:knight2::knight1:

I’ll bet most of the people objecting to any change in the Rosary say “you” instead of “thee” and “you” instead of “thou” (except for the poster who prays his Rosary in Latin) because when I started a thread on this subject some time ago, I was quickly pounced on for saying the old language was more beautiful. Can’t have it both ways.

Corsair, you are still saying that John Paul II “messed” with tradition. Would you please tell me where he has messed with tradition.

 

[RedWings]

Yes, I do. They are beautiful. I pray them on Thursdays and whenever I pray multiple Rosaries in a day.

Thank you Pope John Paul II.

 

[po18guy]

There is no intolerance toward Catholics praying the Rosary in the “traditional” way - but I feel that the objection to the Luminous Mysteries is not so much praying the Rosary in the so-called traditional way as an annoyance with Our Holy Father John Paul II for daring to suggest the new Mysteries. Catholics being so resentful at Our Holy Father astounds me.:knight2::knight1:

Father Corapi was just speaking of being well-balanced in our faith, neither jumping off the left side or the right side of the ship (liberalism or conservatism in the extreme). Either way, the sharks are waiting.

 

[mick321]

Pray the Rosary any way I want to? That almost makes it sound like I’m creating my own form of worship. I worship God the way He wants to be worshiped. Saying the Rosary any way I want to isn’t worshiping God the right way. And who cares? That comes off as saying who cares what Our Lady wants. I’m not saying you said that but that is what it sounds like. I’m not going to change the Rosary in any way just because I’m saying it in private.

That’s an excellent choice.

I think the Blessed Mother would approve.

 

[WFS5801]

There is no intolerance toward Catholics praying the Rosary in the “traditional” way - but I feel that the objection to the Luminous Mysteries is not so much praying the Rosary in the so-called traditional way as an annoyance with Our Holy Father John Paul II for daring to suggest the new Mysteries. Catholics being so resentful at Our Holy Father astounds me.

There is a continuity with the past when we preserve devotions as they were taught to us over the centuries. Tradition is not evil – it’s a bulwark against novelty and change simply for the sake of change.

I’ll bet most of the people objecting to any change in the Rosary say “you” instead of “thee” and “you” instead of “thou” (except for the poster who prays his Rosary in Latin) because when I started a thread on this subject some time ago, I was quickly pounced on for saying the old language was more beautiful. Can’t have it both ways.

Well, I’m not “most people” I guess, because I still use “thee,” “thou,” and “thy.” That’s the way it was in the Missal I found (when I was reading myself (slowly) into Catholicism – I’m a convert from Protestantism) and it’s stuck with me. I see no reason to change that either. (Not that it’s a big deal either way.)

 

[blackrobe]

Regarding how we evaluate what the Holy Father utters, as Jesus said to the Apostles:

“He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you rejects me, and he who rejects me rejects him who sent me.” Lk. 10:16

 

[blackrobe]

I see no reason to question St. Dominic’s account of how he received the Rosary – or the fact that he often called it “her Angelic Psalter.”

Forgive my ignorance, but where does one find St. Dominic’s account of how he received the rosary? I am not aware of any such account in his writings nor writings about him referring to his own time. Nor, as far as I can ascertain, do the records of the O.P contain references to the rosary until considerably after Dominic’s time.

My understanding is that the origin of the Dominican rosary is a pious tradition, which I certainly do not dismiss, but unsupported by reliable documentation.

 

[Cristiano]

The Decade Prayer (also known as the Fatima Prayer) was revealed by Our Lady on July 13, 1917 (3rd apparition). She asked the three shepherd children to recite it at the end of each decade of the rosary. It was approved for public use in 1930.

There is no intolerance toward Catholics praying the Rosary in the “traditional” way - but I feel that the objection to the Luminous Mysteries is not so much praying the Rosary in the so-called traditional way as an annoyance with Our Holy Father John Paul II for daring to suggest the new Mysteries. Catholics being so resentful at Our Holy Father astounds me.:knight2::knight1:

I’ll bet most of the people objecting to any change in the Rosary say “you” instead of “thee” and “you” instead of “thou” (except for the poster who prays his Rosary in Latin) because when I started a thread on this subject some time ago, I was quickly pounced on for saying the old language was more beautiful. Can’t have it both ways.

Corsair, you are still saying that John Paul II “messed” with tradition. Would you please tell me where he has messed with tradition.

Wouldn’t be fun if JPII were going to be canonized and then we were to discover that, being the mystic that he was, he had a revelation from the Blessed Mother to add the Luminous Mysteries. I wonder how people would deal with that!

 

[CallistusPM]

Not orthodox?! What is not orthodox about them, unless you consider the New Testament to be unorthodox.

You say “stick to the historic traditions of the church fathers”, but the Rosary dates well after the time of the Church Fathers.

I agree, they are not required, but neither is the Rosary. The Rosary is neither dogma nor a precept.

 

[CallistusPM]

When I speak of “the church fathers” I mean the church fathers DOWN THROUGH THE AGES.
Personally, it really does not matter to me what “mysteries” you meditate on when praying the rosary. As I said, prayers are prayers. Why not make up your own mysteries as you finger the beads? I am sure Almighty God will accept any attmpt at prayer.

 

[otjm]

I see no reason to question St. Dominic’s account of how he received the Rosary – or the fact that he often called it “her Angelic Psalter.”

Because of evidence to the contrary?

 

[otjm]

There is a continuity with the past when we preserve devotions as they were taught to us over the centuries. Tradition is not evil – it’s a bulwark against novelty and change simply for the sake of change.

There is also continuity with the Luminous Mysteries. The Rosary is a means of meditative prayer, meditating on the life of Christ. Adding other parts of the life of Christ to the format is hardly novel - it relates directly to the process and the substance - and anyone who loves Christ and His mother would be hard pressed to say that it is change for the sake of change. It is change for the sake of edification of the one praying. It is not mandatory - the Rosary itself is not mandatory - it is for sure not novel - it is only an expansion of what already existed - and some of the reactions are a clear example of putting form over substance.

No one has to say them. No one has to say the Rosary, for that matter. Why people would not say them on occasion is perhaps a better question; and again, we come to form over substance.

 

[JMJ_coder]

No, because my Rabbi told me not to!

Huh?

 

[JMJ_coder]

So what you are saying is that every action taken by every Pope was and is good and proper. Is that about right?

Nope, not at all. There are many Popes who led less than reputable lives. But, we are speaking particularly of Venerable John Paul II, and the charges trumped up by so-called ‘traditionalist Catholics’ are just not credible or compelling.